Which Team Won The Big 4-Team Trade?

[tlance]

You actually may have given him a little more love than I did. I said he is a solid young core piece. From what we have seen, he is more than just solid.

Clearly just a personal vendetta.

Imagine if I had been one to criticize Cleveland acquiring Allen, or paying him.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Uh, yeah. Kind of the definition.

there have been plenty of hall of famers- that have never been MVP caliber players. I would certainly call those type of guys special and not "role players" that are "nothing special".

 

[tlance]

there have been plenty of hall of famers- that have never been MVP caliber players. I would certainly call those type of guys special and not "role players" that are "nothing special".

You are grasping at stress here.

When Jarrett Allen gets inducted into the Hall of Fame you can say I was wrong about him “ not bring special”.

 

[WiggyRuss]

You are grasping at stress here.

When Jarrett Allen gets inducted into the Hall of Fame you can say I was wrong about him “ not bring special”.

i mean if that is the standard there are like 7 "special" players in the NBA. lol.

 

[trojanfan12]

there have been plenty of hall of famers- that have never been MVP caliber players. I would certainly call those type of guys special and not "role players" that are "nothing special".

lol

So he's a Hall of Famer now.

 

[WiggyRuss]

lol

So he's a Hall of Famer now.

absolutely not

i just dont think you need to be an MVP caliber player to be "special" and more than a "role player".

 

[flyerhawk]

Both. They absolutely run their offense through him.

He isn’t anything like Capela. He has post game and great footwork.

He isn’t elite.

He doesn’t have to be like Capela or Embiid. He is in a tier between the two.

With Bam out he has been the 2nd best center in the East. Borderline AS type of player. He deserves to be a backup center in the East so far.

He's having his best season of his career right now. But his numbers are pretty similar to Capela's. And other guys as well like Vucevic.

Good player to have. He could sneak onto an All-Star team at some point. But I think above average starter seems like a good spot for him especially when we don't know what he can do in a playoff situation yet.

 

[flyerhawk]

there have been plenty of hall of famers- that have never been MVP caliber players. I would certainly call those type of guys special and not "role players" that are "nothing special".

 

[tlance]

absolutely not

i just dont think you need to be an MVP caliber player to be "special" and more than a "role player".

But you do realize this whole thing has nothing to do with the player.

Your entire argument is how you care to define those terms.

You know, kind of like when you went round and round about a guy who averaged 15 minutes a game wasn’t a rotation player because he didn’t score enough.

WTF?

 

[trojanfan12]

absolutely not

i just dont think you need to be an MVP caliber player to be "special" and more than a "role player".

lol

Ya kinda do.

You dont have to be MVP caliber/special to be more than a role player. But special is elite level. Allen is not elite.

 

[WiggyRuss]

He's having his best season of his career right now. But his numbers are pretty similar to Capela's. And other guys as well like Vucevic.

Good player to have. He could sneak onto an All-Star team at some point. But I think above average starter seems like a good spot for him especially when we don't know what he can do in a playoff situation yet.

I would say that is closer to the truth then "nothing special" and "role player".

The starting centers that are clearly better?
Embiid
Towns
Gobert
Ayton
Jokic

those are the "elite of the elite" centers.

are Bam and Davis "centers"? maybe- maybe not. Davis has tried not to play center his whole career.

at 23- in his first year as a full-time starter- I think he is playing just as good if not better than Vucevic, Capela, Wood, Valunciunas, Nurkic----all of which (beside maybe Wood) are long time nba vets-- especially since defensively he is almost certainly better than all of those guys- and his efficiency is arguably the best in the NBA outside of Gobert. 71% from the field is no joke. He did just whoop on Towns i gotta say.

 

[WiggyRuss]

lol

Ya kinda do.

You dont have to be MVP caliber/special to be more than a role player. But special is elite level. Allen is not elite.

i would call Mobley special. but he is certainly not elite

you wouldnt call Mobley special? you know how many commentators/former players/coaches/analysts, etc. that I have heard call Mobley special?

 

[trojanfan12]

i would call Mobley special. but he is certainly not elite

you wouldnt call Mobley special?

Mobley definitely has the ability to be special and that seems to be where he is headed, but no, he's not special yet.

With the improvement he has shown just in the time between his season at USC and now...he will get there soon if he keeps working.

 

[flyerhawk]

I would say that is closer to the truth then "nothing special" and "role player".

The starting centers that are clearly better?
Embiid
Towns
Gobert
Ayton
Jokic

those are the "elite of the elite" centers.

are Bam and Davis "centers"? maybe- maybe not. Davis has tried not to play center his whole career.

at 23- in his first year as a full-time starter- I think he is playing just as good if not better than Vucevic, Capela, Wood, Valunciunas, Nurkic----all of which (beside maybe Wood) are long time nba vets-- especially since defensively he is almost certainly better than all of those guys- and his efficiency is arguably the best in the NBA outside of Gobert. 71% from the field is no joke. He did just whoop on Towns i gotta say.

His 1st year as a full time starter but his 5th year in the league. Actually I would say he was a full time starter in Brooklyn.

Center has been a de-emphasized role in the NBA for a few years. There is a pretty big gap between the top 4 centers and everyone else and Ayton is probably the only one sneaking up on that.

 

[flyerhawk]

i would call Mobley special. but he is certainly not elite

you wouldnt call Mobley special? you know how many commentators/former players/coaches/analysts, etc. that I have heard call Mobley special?

You can't call someone special based on 20 something games.

 

[trojanfan12]

You can't call someone special based on 20 something games.

Folks are way too quick to want to elevate some of these guys.

Jarrett Allen has developed into an above average starter. Can he develop into an elite level player? I don't know...maybe. He's only 23, so I wouldn't rule it out...but I'm not putting any money on it either.

Mobley is off to a great start for his rookie year. Can he develop into an elite level player? I would probably put money on that.

 

[flyerhawk]

Folks are way too quick to want to elevate some of these guys.

Jarrett Allen has developed into an above average starter. Can he develop into an elite level player? I don't know...maybe. He's only 23, so I wouldn't rule it out...but I'm not putting any money on it either.

Mobley is off to a great start for his rookie year. Can he develop into an elite level player? I would probably put money on that.

Yeah. Mobley shows a ton of promise. But 20 games is just 20 games.

 

[Shanemansj13]

He's having his best season of his career right now. But his numbers are pretty similar to Capela's. And other guys as well like Vucevic.

Good player to have. He could sneak onto an All-Star team at some point. But I think above average starter seems like a good spot for him especially when we don't know what he can do in a playoff situation yet.

Are they? LOL No actually they aren’t. Vucevic is shooting 40% and he is average at best defender. Capela is a great defender but he is averaged 11 ppg and has little to no post game so both of those are awful comparisons. Numbers are off AND player comparisons are too so that’s 0 for 2

 

[Shanemansj13]

I think both were exaggerations: tlance said Allen will be nothing special. To this point, he is wrong. Wiggy said he will be better than Harden in 3-4 years…not his exact words but from a trade aspect. I dont think most expected him to have this great of an impact early.

 

[flyerhawk]

Are they? LOL No actually they aren’t. Vucevic is shooting 40% and he is average at best defender. Capela is a great defender but he is averaged 11 ppg and has little to no post game so both of those are awful comparisons. Numbers are off AND player comparisons are too so that’s 0 for 2

But look at Capela's numbers when he was with Houston. 16 ppg, 13 rebounds.

Comparing Vucevic's shooting percentage with Allens' is pretty silly. Allen has taken 16 shots from beyond 10' all season. Vucevic is average nearly 5 3 point shot attempts per game. Vucevic has 5 dunk attempts all season.