Give that dude a break, he's literally a stroke victim lolHey is Mickey Mantle somewhere on this list? That guy used to beat up on baseballs like they were a rented mule.
There are no rumors that Bonds ever even used post-2005.
I never once claimed Bonds was “clean” pre-‘05. Please provide a link of my stating otherwise.
I’ll wait…
For the record, I have yet to find a single Giants fan who claims Bonds was “clean”. At least one who didn’t make the claim as a troll.Oh my bad. I obviously mixed you up with a different Giants fan. Again my bad, I was outta line.
Now this here is a great post. So many have trouble admitting error.Oh my bad. I obviously mixed you up with a different Giants fan. Again my bad, I was outta line.
Now this here is a great post. So many have trouble admitting error. <--
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It's insecure people who can't do it. Confident ones have no problem admitting they got something wrong.That is very true.
And I have never understood why anyone would wanna double-down on being wrong.
To me it's better to admit error that push something that's incorrect.
For me, I'm skeptical of any player being clean from that time period. Not saying all used or that anyone in particular is a user but Rafael Palmeiro tells me that being adament on being clean isn't a slam dunk on that being the case. And body shape goes out the window when I think of players like David Ortiz, Andy Pettitte and Shane Monahan. Usage doesn't mean the player suddenly looks very different.And that's your journey. I do have an opinion about whether Hurt used or not: he didn't.
Well, we have another 10 votes to evenly split between the two before you have to vote.And fuck you all very much for trying to force me to cast the deciding vote here.
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All fair points. And yet my opinion remains: he didn'tFor me, I'm skeptical of any player being clean from that time period. Not saying all used or that anyone in particular is a user but Rafael Palmeiro tells me that being adament on being clean isn't a slam dunk on that being the case. And body shape goes out the window when I think of players like David Ortiz, Andy Pettitte and Shane Monahan. Usage doesn't mean the player suddenly looks very different.
Did Griffey and Thomas used? I don't know. I certainly hope not. I loved both players when they were playing. But I'm not going to assume that they were clean or that they were dirty. The era is very muddled and usage was all over the place. I won't demonize or issue sainthood for anyone from the 1980s to early 2000s.
All there is in these cases is opinion. Even B&C using is an opinion. They never got tested in public, well organized, well defined manners. It isn’t until ‘05 where opinion is finally removed from the debate.All fair points. And yet my opinion remains: he didn't
Well, now you made that weird. I think it's pretty obvious I was just being folksy.Give that dude a break, he's literally a stroke victim lol
Big difference between using steroids and using steroids to recover from injury. At least to me.For me, I'm skeptical of any player being clean from that time period. Not saying all used or that anyone in particular is a user but Rafael Palmeiro tells me that being adament on being clean isn't a slam dunk on that being the case. And body shape goes out the window when I think of players like David Ortiz, Andy Pettitte and Shane Monahan. Usage doesn't mean the player suddenly looks very different.
Did Griffey and Thomas used? I don't know. I certainly hope not. I loved both players when they were playing. But I'm not going to assume that they were clean or that they were dirty. The era is very muddled and usage was all over the place. I won't demonize or issue sainthood for anyone from the 1980s to early 2000s.
All there is in these cases is opinion. Even B&C using is an opinion. They never got tested in public, well organized, well defined manners. It isn’t until ‘05 where opinion is finally removed from the debate.