The NBA rookies Thread

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

Ben Simmons 16 ppg, 8 rbd, 7 dimes .53 fg %, .57 ft %, .00 3pt %.

Donovan Mitchell 20ppg, 4 rd, 3 dimes .44 fg %, .84 ft % ,.35 3pt %.

Mitchell takes 17 shots a game.

Simmons takes 13 shots a game.

One guy shoots seven 3's a game and the other shoots .02....

That's the difference in fg%.

Simmons boards and dimes makes me pause though.

He is a monster.

It's close.

But, I'm going Donovan.

 

[Sparhawk]

Insert Jason Kelce meme here...
"Ben Simmons red-shirted his rookie year!"

 

[Sparhawk]

Ben Simmons 16 ppg, 8 rbd, 7 dimes .53 fg %, .57 ft %, .00 3pt %.

Donovan Mitchell 20ppg, 4 rd, 3 dimes .44 fg %, .84 ft % ,.35 3pt %.

Mitchell takes 17 shots a game.

Simmons takes 13 shots a game.

One guy shoots seven 3's a game and the other shoots .02....

That's the difference in fg%.

Simmons boards and dimes makes me pause though.

He is a monster.

It's close.

But, I'm going Donovan.

Those numbers are ignoring defense.
Going by advanced stats at Basketball Reference, their TS% are nearly identical.

But, other than TRB%, AST%, BLK%, OWS, DWS, WS, WS/48, OBPM, DBPM, BPM, and VORP, I would agree that Mitchell has the edge, especially in TOV% and USG%.....

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

Those numbers are ignoring defense.
Going by advanced stats at Basketball Reference, their TS% are nearly identical.

But, other than TRB%, AST%, BLK%, OWS, DWS, WS, WS/48, OBPM, DBPM, BPM, and VORP, I would agree that Mitchell has the edge, especially in TOV% and USG%.....

Defense?

Concede...lol

I'm tempted to use Donovan's height as an excuse.

But, George Hill, Rondo, Cp3 manage.

Truth is, Donovan is singularly focused on one end of the court and just depends on Gobert to clean up his mess.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

Insert Jason Kelce meme here...
"Ben Simmons red-shirted his rookie year!"

I don't agree with that stance.

If you never played, you are a rookie.

If you get draft and stashed, they don't hold it against you.

I just don't see this any different.

 

[Sparhawk]

It is what it is.
Everyone can spin the numbers however they want.
Maybe we can feed the anti-Sixers NBA conspiracy in which the Process gets no recognition.
It wouldn't surprise me if Mitchell winds up Brogdoning Simmons for ROY.

It would actually feed into the whole 'hungry dogs run faster' motif that is essentially pissing off roughly 99.47% of the non-Eagle NFL fans on the Hoop. Carryover is to be expected....

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

It is what it is.
Everyone can spin the numbers however they want.
Maybe we can feed the anti-Sixers NBA conspiracy in which the Process gets no recognition.
It wouldn't surprise me if Mitchell winds up Brogdoning Simmons for ROY.

It would actually feed into the whole 'hungry dogs run faster' motif that is essentially pissing off roughly 99.47% of the non-Eagle NFL fans on the Hoop. Carryover is to be expected....

Anti Sixers?

I don't post anywhere else but the hoop.

Where is that happening?

I remember a couple of Sixers vs. Lakers vs. Minny who has the best young talent debates.

But, I don't think most posters here are anti-sixer.

I actually think it's the opposite.

 

[Sparhawk]

I don't agree with that stance.

If you never played, you are a rookie.

If you get draft and stashed, they don't hold it against you.

I just don't see this any different.

That's because you're using common sense and logic.
Trolls and clickbait articles don't care for that too much....

 

[Sparhawk]

Anti Sixers?

I don't post anywhere else but the hoop.

Where is that happening?

I remember a couple of Sixers vs. Lakers vs. Minny who has the best young talent debates.

But, I don't think most posters here are anti-sixer.

I actually think it's the opposite.

No, not necessarily here.
It's kind of a running joke on Liberty Ballers (SB Nation 76ers site), which can have a hive-mind mentality at times.

The discussions here are generally pretty good.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

No, not necessarily here.
It's kind of a running joke on Liberty Ballers (SB Nation 76ers site), which can have a hive-mind mentality at times.

The discussions here are generally pretty good.

Got it.

For the record, I think Simmons is a phenom.

He is the closest thing to the 2nd coming of LeBron that we will likely ever see.

If he keeps working, he could be better as a player and equally as accomplished.

The one thing young LeBron was lacking was a difference maker he could lean on in Cleveland.

Simmons won't have that issue, pressure.

Skies the limit for him and Philly.

 

[bksballer89]

Lmao why are sixers fans acting like people are so crazy if they dare choose Mitchell over Simmons for ROY? My god

 

[trojanfan12]

I don't agree with that stance.

If you never played, you are a rookie.

If you get draft and stashed, they don't hold it against you.

I just don't see this any different.

I agree to a point. It's true that if a player is "redshirted" that they can still be considered a rookie because they haven't played.

However, just as a "redshirt freshman" in college is still considered a freshman because he still has 4 years of eligibility, he also has a distinct advantage over a "true freshman" based on the fact that he has a year of training and practicing with the team that the "true freshman" does not.

Draft and stash is different, imo, because that player doesn't get to spend a year training and practicing with his NBA team like the "redshirt" guy does.

I'm not sure I like the idea of a "redshirt" player being eligible for ROY, but I don't really care enough to be bothered by it or want the NBA to change it.

Maybe just make a distinction between a "redshirt rookie" and a "true rookie" like they do in college with freshmen?

 

[trojanfan12]

lol @"anti-Sixers conspiracies."

#thetruthisoutthere

 

[flyerhawk]

Defense?

Concede...lol

I'm tempted to use Donovan's height as an excuse.

But, George Hill, Rondo, Cp3 manage.

Truth is, Donovan is singularly focused on one end of the court and just depends on Gobert to clean up his mess.

No only is Mitchell defensively indifferent, I suspect that Simmons will make All-NBA defense this year. Probably 3rd string but his numbers certainly justify it. He is 11th in DBPM and 3 in DWS. He's 2nd in the league in steals and is averaging a block a game.

Now I'm not sure how much RoY voters really care about defensive effort so that may not matter for that vote.

 

[flyerhawk]

Lmao why are sixers fans acting like people are so crazy if they dare choose Mitchell over Simmons for ROY? My god

There are precisely two Sixer fans that have responded in the last 24 hours. Me and Sparhawk. I already said that Mitchell will win it if the Jazz win 45 games.

So let's ease up with the broad brush strokes.

 

[bksballer89]

There are precisely two Sixer fans that have responded in the last 24 hours. Me and Sparhawk. I already said that Mitchell will win it if the Jazz win 45 games.

So let's ease up with the broad brush strokes.

I prefer to see a split assuming both teams make the playoffs.

 

[flyerhawk]

I prefer to see a split assuming both teams make the playoffs.

I think you could make a strong argument for either. And I am skeptical that the Jazz have turned into the Warriors overnight. Hot streaks can often make things look much better than they really are. The Celtics looked like the best team in basketball at the start of the season.

But when streaks end, confidence wanes and players stop making shots. Which is why you often see teams that go on 6 or 7 game win streaks follow that up with 3 or 4 straight losses.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

I prefer to see a split assuming both teams make the playoffs.

I actually agree after thinking about the defensive side.

It's happened 3 times.

Hill/Kidd, Francis Brand in this era.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

I think you could make a strong argument for either. And I am skeptical that the Jazz have turned into the Warriors overnight. Hot streaks can often make things look much better than they really are. The Celtics looked like the best team in basketball at the start of the season.

But when streaks end, confidence wanes and players stop making shots. Which is why you often see teams that go on 6 or 7 game win streaks follow that up with 3 or 4 straight losses.

I think this is what @bksballer89 is referring too.

You keep trying to downplay Donovan and the Jazz.

The two situations are not mutually exclusive.

Both guys can be worthy of winning without us having to Shit on the other.

Nobody is comparing them to the Warriors.

But, you want to hold it against HIM because they aren't?

Lmao

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

I agree to a point. It's true that if a player is "redshirted" that they can still be considered a rookie because they haven't played.

However, just as a "redshirt freshman" in college is still considered a freshman because he still has 4 years of eligibility, he also has a distinct advantage over a "true freshman" based on the fact that he has a year of training and practicing with the team that the "true freshman" does not.

Draft and stash is different, imo, because that player doesn't get to spend a year training and practicing with his NBA team like the "redshirt" guy does.

I'm not sure I like the idea of a "redshirt" player being eligible for ROY, but I don't really care enough to be bothered by it or want the NBA to change it.

Maybe just make a distinction between a "redshirt rookie" and a "true rookie" like they do in college with freshmen?

....yeah, that's fair and reasonable.