The Catch II

[Bemular]

steve young was screwed over by the cap. no running game and lack of corners hurt big time. not to mention some of the free agent signings were horrible.

Young was seeing stars by the time the cap impacted the 49ers - Sorry, but the much heralded 1st round QB out of BYU still had his ass kicked by that 3rd rounder from ND - Keep trying kid - the hilarity is the best ever.

 

[Bemular]

Bemular, I've tried really hard to ignore you because you're like an incoherent, argumentative psychopath or something, but I'll repeat what I said like 6 months ago. PLEASE stop replying to my posts.

I honestly don't understand why anyone would waste their time replying to yours.

And yet here you are replying to me - and I'm the incoherent one? LMAO!!

You're an idiot as always - Please just go back to ignoring me and not waste my time with your high-school educated dreck. As for me, when you say something stupid I'm going to call you on it - Don't like it, then stop saying stupid shit - See, it's easy!

 

[SFAnthem]

Dude, you seem like a nice kid, but I think you're off with your facts a little. First of all, we ran the exact same offense with Young. Second, many of the players from the '80's & '90's retired as 49ers or close thereto.

You are making excuses for Steve's ineptness - I get it and I agree, Young absolutely needs those excuses in order to get even close to your fantasy of what you think Steve was.

Although Montana needs zero excuses, my point is simply this; if we were to afford similar BS excuses to Montana we find that Steve falls even further behind Montana - it doesn't add up.

That's the thing, the WCO was used more widely in the 90s and that there was a decade of niners film to create a defensive plan against. The strategic advantage was diminished.

Many stars were career niners but Walsh never used sentimentality to keep aging stars. Seeing Lott and Roger Craig in Raider jerseys were an abomination.

Appreciating Steve Young shouldn't be read as I think he was as good as Joe. As I've said before Joe was the best because he was clutch in big games. He is the standard QBs are being judged by.

Saying Steve could've won more super bowls has nothing to do with Joe.

I've only read stories about the 1983 game vs the skins but that game and of course the roger Craig wtf fumble against the Giants that cost the chance at a 3 peat..Joe certainly should have had more rings.

 

[Flyingiguana]

Young was seeing stars by the time the cap impacted the 49ers - Sorry, but the much heralded 1st round QB out of BYU still had his ass kicked by that 3rd rounder from ND - Keep trying kid - the hilarity is the best ever.

the cap impacted the team right after the super bowl win

 

[Bemular]

That's the thing, the WCO was used more widely in the 90s and that there was a decade of niners film to create a defensive plan against. The strategic advantage was diminished.

Many stars were career niners but Walsh never used sentimentality to keep aging stars. Seeing Lott and Roger Craig in Raider jerseys were an abomination.

Appreciating Steve Young shouldn't be read as I think he was as good as Joe. As I've said before Joe was the best because he was clutch in big games. He is the standard QBs are being judged by.

Saying Steve could've won more super bowls has nothing to do with Joe.

I've only read stories about the 1983 game vs the skins but that game and of course the roger Craig wtf fumble against the Giants that cost the chance at a 3 peat..Joe certainly should have had more rings.

That's the thing, the WCO was used more widely in the 90s and that there was a decade of niners film to create a defensive plan against. The strategic advantage was diminished.

C'mon now, you need to stop this bs Anthem. Look, the advantages of the WCO are still very much alive today and are responsible for more SB victories than any other offense.

Have you not heard who is rumored to be the next HC of the Bears? Can you say Jay Cutler is going to get the WCO -if true, Cutler will thrive in a WC style offense!

During the 90's and as the Walsh coaching tree began to grow branches the strategic advantage of the WCO strengthened it did not diminish. The 49ers remained one of the top offenses in the league as did the other WCO disciples.

Has the WCO gone through changes to stay ahead of the DC's? Of course. However the WCO will never entirely diminish because it is a philosophy not a strategy.


Many stars were career niners but Walsh never used sentimentality to keep aging stars. Seeing Lott and Roger Craig in Raider jerseys were an abomination.

Couple facts here - Walsh demanded perfection and with that it may have seemed he was not sentimental but he was. That said, if you didn't perform you were not long for the 49ers of the 80's & 90's. However it should be noted that the two players you mention here played beyond Walsh's years.


Appreciating Steve Young shouldn't be read as I think he was as good as Joe. As I've said before Joe was the best because he was clutch in big games. He is the standard QBs are being judged by.

Saying Steve could've won more super bowls has nothing to do with Joe.

As stand-alone statements I would agree but said in the context of a Steve vs. Joe discussion they understandably carry a comparative connation and there is no comparison.


I've only read stories about the 1983 game vs the skins but that game and of course the roger Craig wtf fumble against the Giants that cost the chance at a 3 peat..Joe certainly should have had more rings.

The '83 game was ridiculous. Craigs fumble however, saved us from our 1st SB loss as there was not way in hell Steve Young was ready to play on that stage - again, he was a back-up QB for a reason and one of those reasons was he could not handle pressure.

Injuries to Montana gave Young a few opportunities to take the starting role but each time he found new and creative ways to combine the very good with the really shitty. When an injury to Montana forced Young into the starting role in '91, he didn't last half the season before being replaced by Steve Bono.

Young was a mess of a QB when he arrived in '87 and remained a mess until 1992 and even then would have received twitter death threats for trying to kill Rice & Taylor - those who actually watched (or studied) "all" of his passes in '91 & '92 will know what I'm talking about.

Once Young settled in he became one of the better regular season QB's to every play, but he will always be a playoff level bed-shitter, and all the excuses in the world will not change that.

 

[Bemular]

the cap impacted the team right after the super bowl win

Nope! But hey, don't let me stop you from flinging your poo, eventually something will stick - most likely to your forehead but as long as it sticks to something right?

 

[wartyOne]

best qb to ever play

How can a Notre Dame fan say this with a straight face?

Or are you e-laughing?

 

[spacedoodoopistol]

Maybe my favorite 49ers game ever......watched in Sevilla, Spain after searching most of the day for a sports bar showing it. Me and my 49ers fan buddy, and amazingly a group of Packers fans there. Absolutely epic shit talking in a bar full of bemused Spaniards, with the classic ending topping it off.

 

[NinerSickness]

Note to moderators:

Bemular has become a full-fledged troll. The reason SportsHoopla is better than the old BSPN forum is because people like him were kept at bay. SportsHoopla is being crapped on by this guy's constant ad hominem nonsense. Why have you put up with him this long?

 

[spacedoodoopistol]

Not hard to ignore when he is being like that.

 

[MHSL82]

I just watched the games, didn't really note the salary cap when Steve Young was playing. Do we know if our opponents we beat in Young's wins or in Young's SB run were affected by the cap equally or more so? Was our cap smaller than the rest due to either DeBartolo's incident or bad contracts started in Montana's years that went into Young's?

I'm not arguing one way or another as I always thought Montana was the best and never considered anyone else. Steve Young was from BYU, so as a Utah fan, I wasn't allowed to ever consider him the greatest, could I? Just kidding, but even objectively with Young's BYU sin aside, I always thought Joe was best. Having said that, I'm all for looking at context for both careers.

 

[TobyTyler]

And yet here you are replying to me - and I'm the incoherent one? LMAO!!

You're an idiot as always - Please just go back to ignoring me and not waste my time with your high-school educated dreck. As for me, when you say something stupid I'm going to call you on it - Don't like it, then stop saying stupid shit - See, it's easy!

Damn you Bem, you incoherent, argumentative, psychopath you!

 

[MHSL82]

Don't let people get under your skin, whether that be argumentative people or just annoying people. I once let that happen and it wasn't any fun, because no matter what you say you're still dealing with the same person that won't take it. I know I annoy or have annoyed some here, but that shouldn't get under anyone's skin. I try to limit my annoyances and contribute some articles and substantive comments when I can. And limit my arguments.

 

[wartyOne]

Maybe my favorite 49ers game ever......watched in Sevilla, Spain after searching most of the day for a sports bar showing it. Me and my 49ers fan buddy, and amazingly a group of Packers fans there. Absolutely epic shit talking in a bar full of bemused Spaniards, with the classic ending topping it off.

My favorite is still the third SB. Even after Cincinnati took the lead with only 2 minutes to go I felt very confident that we'd win that game. Gotta love Montana in the huddle pointing out John Candy in the stands before breaking.

As for Young, I'd definitely put the NFCC over the Cowboys ahead of this game. Kind of a shame that Young ran into the dynasty Cowboys, the upstart Packers* (Young only beat Favre that one time) and the salary cap all at the same time.

Is what it is, though. But talk about 20+ years of being a spoiled fanbase at QB. Montana (arguably the best ever), Young (prolific efficiency, and also a HOFer), skip a salary-cap-purge-year, Garcia (three time Pro-Bowler).

*Crazy as well is the number of back-to-back Super Bowl appearances by teams in that era. Think about this: 88-89/89-90 the 9ers won SB's; 90-93 the Bills went to 4 straight SB's (didn't win, but...); 92-93/93-94 the Cowboys won the SB's; 94-95/95-96 is the aberration in this bunch, and they still came down to the 9ers/Cowboys. 96-97/97-98 saw the Packers. 97-98/98-99 the Broncos won both. Things started even-keeling at this point, except for the Patriots in 03-4/04-05.

Sorry for the digressed, ranting tangent.

 

[Bemular]

Damn you Bem, you incoherent, argumentative, psychopath you!

I know right! But you forgot the: "or something!"

I'm currently arguing with myself as to what that could mean but I'm not making any sense.

 

[Bemular]

Note to moderators:

Bemular has hurt my feelings and I would like you to ban him or I wlll cry & stomp my feet!

fify!

Look Sickness, I'm not an enemy of you or anyone on this board. I'm just someone who knows and takes his team seriously. Sorry if that offends you.

 

[MHSL82]

Damn you Bem, you incoherent, argumentative, psychopath you!

I know right! But you forgot the: "or something!"

I'm currently arguing with myself as to what that could mean but I'm not making any sense.

I'm not an enemy of you or anyone on this board. I'm just someone who knows and takes his team seriously. Sorry if that offends you.

I'm pretty sure the "something" meant "someone who knows and takes his team seriously." Right?

 

[Bemular]

To those who believe Young suffered any "cap" issues you are simply dead wrong. Our cap issues didn't surface until after the 1999 season.

In fact, it was during the 1999 off-season that Steve consulted with Bill Walsh regarding his career. Walsh, in light of Young's concussions, advised Steve that the cap investigation would likely result in the loss of players and thus Steve retired.

The only Notable losses Young suffered since '92 were Watters (after the '94 season) & Rice (97 only) Hell, Young went from having Rice & Taylor to having Rice & Owens - hardly what I would call suffering

 

[Bemular]

I'm pretty sure the "something" meant "someone who knows and takes his team seriously." Right?

Haha! Yeah, that must be it.

 

[TobyTyler]

I know right! But you forgot the: "or something!"

I'm currently arguing with myself as to what that could mean but I'm not making any sense.

Ha ha!