The Browns should take Chubb and Barkley

[eaglesnut]

Couldn't be because his defense is garbage most of that time.

That certainly is a component. However, he did have a defense a few years. Still no RB.

 

[eaglesnut]

He was insanely overrated. They'd of been so much better off taking another RB later on. He averaged 3.9 YPC, but also had a 90 yard run, which accounted for 8% of his overall production. Outside of that 1 run, he averaged 3.5 YPC. Imagine if they'd have been smart and grabbed Jamal Adams in the 1st round and snagged Hunt in the 3rd instead. That's scary.

The Jags lead the league in rushing. Fournette gave them the identity to just pound away on offense. You may say they could run for a low rate with anyone, but they had tried that already. Not until Fournette was the attempt believable and not until Fournette did the Jags lead the league there.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

He was insanely overrated. They'd of been so much better off taking another RB later on. He averaged 3.9 YPC, but also had a 90 yard run, which accounted for 8% of his overall production. Outside of that 1 run, he averaged 3.5 YPC. Imagine if they'd have been smart and grabbed Jamal Adams in the 1st round and snagged Hunt in the 3rd instead. That's scary.

The level of apologia for Fournette the pick is rather impressive. The Jags will fade within 1-2 years if they don't fix the QB position with how volatile maintaining defenses are most likely.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

That certainly is a component. However, he did have a defense a few years. Still no RB.

He lacked many a thing

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Do you think hunt would have been better for the Jags than Fournette was?? I wont buy this... the problem with football analysis is that we just assume a players stats would be similar no matter what team they were on... a bust on one team could just as well be a STUD for another...

Yeah, Hunt can actually catch a football and run a few routes. Fournette is 1 dimensional

 

[eaglesnut]

I think what a lot of people are discounting is how Barkley would impact Taylor. A great RB is important to every QB but far far more important to some based on the style that QB plays. Taylor, maybe moreso than any other middle tier or better QB, us dependent on guys he can check down to that can make plays after the catch. He's risk averse to the extreme so a guy who can catch a 4 yard screen pass and turn it into a 23 yard play is more important to him because he's going to throw more of those types of passes. It's also why Njoku is likely to have a phenomenal year in Cleveland

Barkley is a perfect fit. Njoku is still too young. Jarvis should reap the rewards of Taylor's style.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Michel can offer 80% of what Barkley can without an absurd asking price. Or Chubb, Freeman, Penny for instance. It's a very deep RB class- legitimately.

​

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Offensive identity matters. I've explained it to you previously, but you'll understand some day. Fournette gave them what they didn't have.

Do you even understand what identity means?

Besides the point- the position value isn't all that great for RB's.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

If the defense of Fournette is basically he was given a lot of carries because his QB is awful, then I don't know how to even respond to that.

 

[Across The Field]

Do you think hunt would have been better for the Jags than Fournette was?? I wont buy this... the problem with football analysis is that we just assume a players stats would be similar no matter what team they were on... a bust on one team could just as well be a STUD for another...

Yes, no question he would've been as good. The offensive lines ranked almost identically, and Jacksonville played one of the easiest schedules in the league last year. Mind you, it wasn't as if Fournette was close to being as good as Hunt - Hunt averaged a full yard more per carry.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

It's not too often a team has the opportunity to get the 2 biggest difference makers in the same draft. The Browns have a great great shot to do just that. Tyrod Taylor is at worst a bridge , at best a serviceable solid QB for the next 4-5 years. You've got just as good a shot at hitting on a QB late first or early second as you do top 10. Why risk a question mark at 1 or 4 if you don't need to?? Take Barkley 1 so the Giants don't pick him, take Chubb 4. You've got the best RB corp in football, you've got book end legit pass rushers , you've got a solid QB, you've got solid wideouts, you've got a decent OL. You're a playoff team

Late to the party...again, but you make good points here if they could pull it off. IDT it makes them a playoff team anytime soon, but in a DIV that's not particularly hard right now, they should be at worst a .500 team in '19.

IMO just watching him play, Taylor is not a winning playoff caliber QB, but to be honest, in BUF he's never really had a capable team around him either so its tough to say what his ceiling is.

I pulled the last half dz drafts the other day and what jumped off the page...dominant edge players go top 10 nearly every year and they are few and far between after the 15th pick...I think Cameron Jordan and JPP were the exceptions. I say that to say, if Chubb is considered to be an elite edge rusher...you take him #4, if not #1.

So...Barkley or QB?

Are they letting the next Carson Wentz go elsewhere? Can you find the next a Carson Wentz at 33 or bottom of the 1st round? If you think you can, you take Barkley....the fallout imo...2 yrs down the down and now you've realized Taylor's ceiling, but you're a 6-10, 8-8...idk if you get that top 5 pick.

 

[eaglesnut]

Michel can offer 80% of what Barkley can without an absurd asking price. Or Chubb, Freeman, Penny for instance. It's a very deep RB class- legitimately.

It's that 20% that makes the difference.

 

[Across The Field]

The Jags lead the league in rushing. Fournette gave them the identity to just pound away on offense. You may say they could run for a low rate with anyone, but they had tried that already. Not until Fournette was the attempt believable and not until Fournette did the Jags lead the league there.

They were also 9th in YPC. Just because they did such a horrible job analyzing RB talent before last year, it doesn't mean Fournette and ONLY Fournette could make them what they became.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Until you have the QB position solved you have to aggressively look for ways to address it.

If you're waiting around for the perfect QB prospect you'll be waiting around for a while and because the Browns have been gun-shy about picking a QB it's lead them into the mess they've been in. They had the chance to draft Wentz and Watson the past two years and I'm sure they would've loved to have either one right now.

The SEA model is a good one to copy, but at some point you gotta have a triggerman that can execute under pressure to win a title.

 

[Clayton]

I think what a lot of people are discounting is how Barkley would impact Taylor. A great RB is important to every QB but far far more important to some based on the style that QB plays. Taylor, maybe moreso than any other middle tier or better QB, us dependent on guys he can check down to that can make plays after the catch. He's risk averse to the extreme so a guy who can catch a 4 yard screen pass and turn it into a 23 yard play is more important to him because he's going to throw more of those types of passes. It's also why Njoku is likely to have a phenomenal year in Cleveland

I'd imagine thats why the Bills got rid of Taylor. They had Shady and probably figured their offense should've been doing more.

 

[eaglesnut]

Do you even understand what identity means?

Besides the point- the position value isn't all that great for RB's.

Yes, it means the offense and entire franchise was rescued from the whims of Blake Bortles. Now it's a Tom Coughlin, Leonard Fournette team.

 

[eaglesnut]

If the defense of Fournette is basically he was given a lot of carries because his QB is awful, then I don't know how to even respond to that.

I know you don't. It's because you don't grasp it. The top 5 backs all went to the playoffs. 9 of the 10 top rushing teams went to the playoffs.

 

[TKOSpikes]

It's not too often a team has the opportunity to get the 2 biggest difference makers in the same draft. The Browns have a great great shot to do just that. Tyrod Taylor is at worst a bridge , at best a serviceable solid QB for the next 4-5 years. You've got just as good a shot at hitting on a QB late first or early second as you do top 10. Why risk a question mark at 1 or 4 if you don't need to?? Take Barkley 1 so the Giants don't pick him, take Chubb 4. You've got the best RB corp in football, you've got book end legit pass rushers , you've got a solid QB, you've got solid wideouts, you've got a decent OL. You're a playoff team

Impossible if the Giants take Barkley (or Chubb).

Mad Dog on sirius radio said the same. Having Taylor gives the Browns a few years and these players are too great to pass on.

Problem...

If they (Chubb and Barkley) are too good, why would the Giants pass on them? Why would the Bills trade a fortune to move up for a QB when they had the same Taylor that should convince the Browns not to take a QB? It makes no sense.

I think they take Chubb at 1. I highly doubt the Giants pass on Barkley. Baker to the Jets seems likely, leaving Allen/Darnold at 4.

 

[eaglesnut]

They were also 9th in YPC. Just because they did such a horrible job analyzing RB talent before last year, it doesn't mean Fournette and ONLY Fournette could make them what they became.

Well he did. Reality is on my side here. I agree that a number of hypotheticals could have worked out for them. But they were final four the way they did it and the Patriots needed some ref help to beat them.

Now they get to enjoy year two of their current offensive identity. They'll build up the line and get better their strengths. Too many fans get caught up in weaknesses rather than looking at strengths. They began turning the running game into a strength when they drafted Fournette. It's a huge franchise changing move for them.

 

[rmilia1]

I'd imagine thats why the Bills got rid of Taylor. They had Shady and probably figured their offense should've been doing more.

I'm all for improving your QB situation, I just don't think any of these guys come in and are better than Taylor year 2 or 2 so the scenarios are you draft a QB he sits for a few years and you essentially waste 2 years of a top 5 pick or you play the young guy anyway and get yourself a new coacjobg staff yet again after next year . And those are middle outcomes, maybe even high side. Worst case you miss and put yourself back another 5 years. For every Wentz there's 3 guys who are Taylor level or far worse so you really have about a 25% chance of getting it right if you go QB