Texas Game Thread

[WVUDAD]

Boy...I thought this group was better than this......obviously I was wrong..

Any of you who actually thinks that Lyon's or anyone else sits Dana down and treats him like a first grader has got to be out of their minds...or just so unwilling to see the forest thru the trees that this HC has the ability to adapt and be nimble with the talent he coaches..I would say that is a HC that you definitely want on the Wv sideline

Slaton, we have seen for five years now that Holgorsen wants to pass at all costs, loves to run 9 yards a clip to the oponents thirty, then throw three incomplete passes, then for the last two games, he keeps running, why did Holgorsen choose to adapt NOW? SOMEONE spoke to him!!!!!

 

[Mike]

Slaton, we have seen for five years now that Holgorsen wants to pass at all costs, loves to run 9 yards a clip to the oponents thirty, then throw three incomplete passes, then for the last two games, he keeps running, why did Holgorsen choose to adapt NOW? SOMEONE spoke to him!!!!!

Have you been watching the same Holgersen coached teams at WVU that I have? or are you just trying to rile up some people on here?

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/...fted-into-run-first-mold/stories/201510100030

That story was posted on October 10 of this year the facts are the facts.....

It’s a peak West Virginia has climbed toward the past several years. In 2011, Holgorsen’s first year at the school, 43.5 percent of his team’s plays came on the ground. Over time, that percentage has steadily grown, from 46.2 in 2012 to 47.9 in 2013 to 51.3 last year. This season, 61 percent of West Virginia’s plays have been runs.

The numbers indicate a gradual evolution in Holgorsen’s mindset and execution, one that might come as a surprise to fans and former colleagues in Stillwater, Okla.

 

[mad2mc]

52-0 victory for Ol Doc and 9 win season so far.. Prob getting a lot of penalties from playing all those backups and building that program for another great year. We get down 30-40 with the QB looking like hot garbage and ol skinny Charlie won't put the backup in... Poor Ol Pat White would have been a WR under skinny Charlie...

GR - over the last 5 years Doc has been HC, how many games were against top 25 teams, at the time they played, and won? A quick look at their schedule since 2010 I've only seen VaTech, Ohio State, and West Virginia. I can't buy into Doc's record translating into victories for WVU in the Big 12.

 

[WVUDAD]

Have you been watching the same Holgersen coached teams at WVU that I have? or are you just trying to rile up some people on here?

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/...fted-into-run-first-mold/stories/201510100030

That story was posted on October 10 of this year the facts are the facts.....

It’s a peak West Virginia has climbed toward the past several years. In 2011, Holgorsen’s first year at the school, 43.5 percent of his team’s plays came on the ground. Over time, that percentage has steadily grown, from 46.2 in 2012 to 47.9 in 2013 to 51.3 last year. This season, 61 percent of West Virginia’s plays have been runs.

The numbers indicate a gradual evolution in Holgorsen’s mindset and execution, one that might come as a surprise to fans and former colleagues in Stillwater, Okla.

Mike, I am not talking about the number of plays, but their timing. In the four losses, there were numerous times in drives where WVU ran the ball on first down with really nice gains, ran down the field, only to squander the drives by throwing incomplete on first down, getting behind the chains, and throwing two more incompletes because Howard was put in a position to HAVE to throw.

 

[Mike]

Mike, I am not talking about the number of plays, but their timing. In the four losses, there were numerous times in drives where WVU ran the ball on first down with really nice gains, ran down the field, only to squander the drives by throwing incomplete on first down, getting behind the chains, and throwing two more incompletes because Howard was put in a position to HAVE to throw.

I will agree to an extent, that sometimes I wonder about some of the play calls also, but in the end, Holgersen has forgot more about football then I will ever claim to know. I think that there has been some mistakes, but also there are other things that may effect some of the calls, ie: how certain players at the time may be winded, momentum shifts anticipated, ect. the list can go on, that many of us don't know about.

That October stretch was brutal, but so was the competition.

 

[bbwvfan]

I will agree to an extent, that sometimes I wonder about some of the play calls also, but in the end, Holgersen has forgot more about football then I will ever claim to know. I think that there has been some mistakes, but also there are other things that may effect some of the calls, ie: how certain players at the time may be winded, momentum shifts anticipated, ect. the list can go on, that many of us don't know about.

That October stretch was brutal, but so was the competition.

Mike, I am not picking on you... trust me.

I watch the same game you watch. And, I am baffled about why a play didn't work as much as the next guy. As any coach would admit... sometimes a poor play is called. But, the success of a play is determined by other factors as well.

As we've shared on more than one occasion on this board, Dana gives his QB great freedom to run the offense. He signals in two plays... a run option and a pass option on almost every down. The QB is responsible for making both a pre-snap and post-snap read to determine whether the play will be pass or run.

Here is a great article on this subject...

POP plays and the pro-style offense

Dana recently said Skyler was one of the best QB's he's ever had getting the offense into the right play. Execution of the play has been another matter. One Dana admits is still a work in progress...

 

[bbwvfan]

This is another great article going over the pass run option offense.

This is how Dana installs his offense in 3 days... but, it takes time to master...

There is an example of a single play run 5 different ways with success by Ole Miss...

Packaged Plays and the Newest Form of Option Football

 

[Slaton10]

Slaton, we have seen for five years now that Holgorsen wants to pass at all costs, loves to run 9 yards a clip to the oponents thirty, then throw three incomplete passes, then for the last two games, he keeps running, why did Holgorsen choose to adapt NOW? SOMEONE spoke to him!!!!!

What credibility does Shane Lyons have or anyone for that matter that knows more about X's and O's than the HC of the football team....its why they pay him 3 million per year.......

 

[GoldRusher]

GR - over the last 5 years Doc has been HC, how many games were against top 25 teams, at the time they played, and won? A quick look at their schedule since 2010 I've only seen VaTech, Ohio State, and West Virginia. I can't buy into Doc's record translating into victories for WVU in the Big 12.

I would counter with this,
At the end of this regular season at WORST Doc will be 32-8 as a HC the last 3 seasons coaching in CUSA.

1. Coaches get hired on potential more times than not from the lower ranks.

2. RichRod, Stew, or Dana didn't have NEAR that kind of resume even at THAT level as a HC and yet got the WVU job.

End of the day, we win 7-8 regular season games then its a moot point, we wont need a new HC unless Dana takes one of the open positions around the country but Doc is a GREAT hire if we go coach shopping, especially considering that he is a WVU man and could sell WVU day 1 to recruits. He wouldn't have to learn what it means to be a Mountaineer. Near perfect fit IMO.

 

[WVUDAD]

What credibility does Shane Lyons have or anyone for that matter that knows more about X's and O's than the HC of the football team....its why they pay him 3 million per year.......

I can't believe you said that..........

 

[Slaton10]

I can't believe you said that..........

Which part? He has never even coached a Pop Warner team!...and Holgorsen makes EXACTLY 2.5 million more than he does...just can't see Lyon's telling Holgorsen how to coach the football team..

 

[mountaineers44]

It was Mike Leach!! He sat Dana down and explained that you have to run the ball to be successful in the Big XII. Of course Dana tried to argue with him, but Mike was having none of it. Mike re-emphasized to run the ball, run some more when you're running the clock (to never audible even if there is 15 guys in the box). Run the ball....you get the idea. Lastly finished with, "Dana, just do as I say - not as I do!"

 

[mad2mc]

I would counter with this,
At the end of this regular season at WORST Doc will be 32-8 as a HC the last 3 seasons coaching in CUSA.

1. Coaches get hired on potential more times than not from the lower ranks.

2. RichRod, Stew, or Dana didn't have NEAR that kind of resume even at THAT level as a HC and yet got the WVU job.

End of the day, we win 7-8 regular season games then its a moot point, we wont need a new HC unless Dana takes one of the open positions around the country but Doc is a GREAT hire if we go coach shopping, especially considering that he is a WVU man and could sell WVU day 1 to recruits. He wouldn't have to learn what it means to be a Mountaineer. Near perfect fit IMO.

It just seems odd to me that Doc was associated with WVU for 22 years (2 as a graduate assistant) and never selected for the HC position. Spent 2 different stints as Assistant HC that totaled 6 years as an AHC.
You mentioned that coaches are hired for their potential but Doc never was hired by anybody but Marshall. Dana was brought in and Doc went to Marshall. I’m not sure why he would even entertain the thought of coming to WVU after being shunned so many times. You say he is a great recruiter and I will default to opinion as I am not going to look into who he brought in at WVU, but after a 20 year stint as a position’s coach, I’m sure he should have brought in at least a few players.
C’mon now, you cherry-picked the last 3 years to make Doc’s record look impressive, but do tell the whole story. Let’s look at his body of work over the 5 years (2010 to now) that he has been there. If you are looking for improvement, I’ll give you that but don’t let your affinity for Doc blind everything. Doc’s record is 49 – 27 from his start at Marshall thru 11/14/15.
2010: 5 – 7
2011: 7 – 6
2012: 5 – 7
2013: 10 – 4
2014: 13 – 1
2015: 9 – 2 (thru 11/14/15)

Doc shows improvement in CUSA. Dana, not so much, but fairly consistent in the Big 12. Not the CUSA nor the old BE, but the Big 12.

Teams Marshall played from 2010 – thru 11/14/15 (record in parenthesis):
Ohio State (0 -1) this game was vacated when OSU got in trouble.
WVU (0 – 3)
Bowling Green (0 – 1)
Ohio (2 – 4)
S. Mississippi (6 – 0)
Central Florida (1 – 3)*
E. Carolina (3 – 1)*
Texas El-Paso (1 – 0)
Alabama-Birmingham (4 – 1)
Memphis (3 – 0)
SMU (1 – 0)
Tulane (1 – 0)
VaTech (0 – 2)*
Louisville (1 – 0)*
Rice (3 – 1)
Houston (1 – 1)
Tulsa (1 – 2)
Florida International (4 – 0) one win was a bowl game
Western Carolina (1 – 0)
Purdue (1 – 1)
Miami (OH) (2 – 0)
Western KY (0 – 1)
Gardner Webb (1 – 0)
Texas San Antonio (1 – 0)
Florida Atlantic (3 – 0)
Middle Tennessee St (1 – 2)
Maryland (1 – 0)* win was a bowl game
Rhode Island (1 – 0)
Akron (1 – 0)
Old Dominion (2 – 0)
Louisiana Tech (1 – 0)
NIU (1 – 0) win was in a bowl game
Charlotte (1 – 0)
North Texas (1 – 0)
Kent State (1 – 0)
Norfolk State (1 – 0)

Which of these teams strikes fear in your heart? The competition level between the 2 conferences is not even close. Doc is 6 – 6 against teams (asterisk) that we played against on a regular basis or were in the BE. I gave him the bowl victory against Maryland. What would give me hope that he would do better than Dana in the Big 12? Still don’t see it. Now if you say Butch Jones, I will entertain that thought, but that will not happen either.