Playing by the Rules

[flaraider]

One of the great aspects of playing golf is it teaches you to be honest, with others and most importantly, yourself. As it has been said, when you write down that score, you want it to be accurate, or in addition to being dishonest with your mates, you are cheating yourself. I never play gimme with my own ball at par or under, in most cases I try to putt out, but sometimes allow one for a double bogey or some other such indignity, during friendly rounds only of course.

Slow play is something that we all need to help address among ourselves, it can be very challenging to get new players to realize how slow play affects everyone without offending them or distracting our own selves during a round, and it can be infectious, 4 1/2 to 5 hour rounds on Sunday around here happen all the time, but when I am playing well I certainly appreciate a brisk pace, when you get in under 4 hours you can take a look back and see the benefit.

Golf is a great game, it brings much more to the table than might appear from the outside, values, respect, honesty, and when I have one of those good days, a great deal of satisfaction.

 

[TobyTyler]

One of the great aspects of playing golf is it teaches you to be honest, with others and most importantly, yourself. As it has been said, when you write down that score, you want it to be accurate, or in addition to being dishonest with your mates, you are cheating yourself. I never play gimme with my own ball at par or under, in most cases I try to putt out, but sometimes allow one for a double bogey or some other such indignity, during friendly rounds only of course.

Slow play is something that we all need to help address among ourselves, it can be very challenging to get new players to realize how slow play affects everyone without offending them or distracting our own selves during a round, and it can be infectious, 4 1/2 to 5 hour rounds on Sunday around here happen all the time, but when I am playing well I certainly appreciate a brisk pace, when you get in under 4 hours you can take a look back and see the benefit.

Golf is a great game, it brings much more to the table than might appear from the outside, values, respect, honesty, and when I have one of those good days, a great deal of satisfaction.

It sound corny but its true. "Fight On".

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Questions

A course we play a lot...2nd hole, short par 4 DL left, red stake up the right side from the tee to about 150 yds, then OB from that point at the 150' marker all the way up to the green. The markers/lines defining these areas used to be about 8 paces to the right of the cart path.

Recently they have been moved to the right edge of the cart path...obviously they no longer want you to play from right of the cart path on that hole.

#1...can a course redefine OB, even if it makes a hole less forgiving?

Keep in mind...before this change over the years of playing the course with various people...about 2 or 3 of 10 balls we'd find in play vs zero now.

lateral drop on slopped terrain.

Same hole...From the hzd line, two drivers lengths does get you on the FW/rough side of the hole and completely off the cart path, but not in a place where the ball will rest, even if placed. Ball would roll down hill away from the hole about 40' (actually giving a much better shot at the green).

We let him play it from the bottom of the hill where it rolled to away from the hole....I told him later, if this were a tourney he would've had to play from where he played the previous ball, the tee box in this case. He disagreed saying lateral hzd ruling was applicable.

#2 Where do you drop this ball?

 

[NEhomer]

The ball should be dropped twice and if it rolls further than the defined area for the drop it should be placed.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Okay...we pretty much played it right then.

The area of placing or dropping was on a steep bank which was under a tree and sort of hardpan, the ball was not going to stay when placed...it would roll to the bottom of the hill...we dropped it once, place it twice, given it was not nearer the hole we played it from there.

Given that he ended up playing substantially more than 2 clublengths from the hzd line and not really on the same path that he entered the hzd, I wasn't sure if it was a legal drop.

 

[TobyTyler]

Okay...we pretty much played it right then.

The area of placing or dropping was on a steep bank which was under a tree and sort of hardpan, the ball was not going to stay when placed...it would roll to the bottom of the hill...we dropped it once, place it twice, given it was not nearer the hole we played it from there.

Given that he ended up playing substantially more than 2 clublengths from the hzd line and not really on the same path that he entered the hzd, I wasn't sure if it was a legal drop.

Man, you guys must have been playing for some serious cash to go to that much trouble!

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Man, you guys must have been playing for some serious cash to go to that much trouble!

lol...there was some cash on the line, but not much...he called me over about his dropped is what started the whole thing...had the ball stayed when placed he had no shot, playing from the bottom of the hill was a clear shot to the green.

 

[TobyTyler]

lol...there was some cash on the line, but not much...he called me over about his dropped is what started the whole thing...had the ball stayed when placed he had no shot, playing from the bottom of the hill was a clear shot to the green.

Most of the rounds I play with my friends are for cash and are competitive but never combative. My response to any question someone has about their situation is "'You decide" or "whatever you think is right" because none of the guys I play with want to cheat purposely and over the years our money has probably changed hands, and will again, a million times, so its all good.

Tournament golf is different. In that case we'll always try to get it right for the benefit of the field.

 

[NEhomer]

If the ball could not be placed, which I've never see happen...not saying it couldn't, I believe the only legal option may have been to re-play the shot at a stroke and distance penalty. Haven't researched it but my gut tells me that you cannot play from wherever this ball happened to roll to.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Now you're seeing the picture...the terrain is basically high on the right side sloping hard to the FW in a valley...trees overhang the cart part also on the right so no grass grows there in the shady spot anymore ( tree have grow a lot over the years, should be a pinestraw area now actually) and the slope is serve enough where the ball wouldn't stay...had there been grass on the bank or a heavy covering of pinestraw/mulch a ball would easily stay but not on hardpanned clay.

It wasn't a big deal in terms of the match...I was mostly just kidding with him, but I didn't think he'd be able to play from where it rolled in a tourney. Just throwing it out to see what you guys thought.

 

[NEhomer]

It's definitely a tricky question as they often are. From what I could find, I think you guys made a mistake. According to this rules site

Rules of Golf: 13 07 Placing and Replacing a Ball ? Rule 20-3

The ball should have been placed at the nearest point that it would stay, not be allowed to roll to it's eventual resting spot if that's what you guys allowed it to do.

What must I do if my ball will not come to rest at the spot that I have to place or replace it?

The ball must be placed at the nearest spot where it will come to rest that is not nearer the hole. If it was in a hazard that spot must be in the hazard, if it was not then it must not be placed in a hazard, even if that is where the nearest point is.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

It's definitely a tricky question as they often are. From what I could find, I think you guys made a mistake. According to this rules site

Rules of Golf: 13 07 Placing and Replacing a Ball ? Rule 20-3

The ball should have been placed at the nearest point that it would stay, not be allowed to roll to it's eventual resting spot if that's what you guys allowed it to do.

What must I do if my ball will not come to rest at the spot that I have to place or replace it?

The ball must be placed at the nearest spot where it will come to rest that is not nearer the hole. If it was in a hazard that spot must be in the hazard, if it was not then it must not be placed in a hazard, even if that is where the nearest point is.

We did play it wrong then...the bank, from the cart part to the base of the hill, (where the ball rolled to rest) covers a span of about 50'. Where the hardpan area transitions to grass is about a 3rd of the way down the bank from the cart...even though it was dormant grass, I think we could've placed it there.

I never thought about going to a "ball not being able to stay at rest" as it relates to a penalty drop. Even that play would result in more than 2 club lengths if the enforceable rule was 26.1c...it appears this drop is governed by 2 rules.

 

[NEhomer]

Some crazy shit in golf. Every other sport has a defined playing area. Golf rules need to cover EVERYTHING.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Yep...this was unusual and it never played that way until the stakes were moved to the edge of the cart path. Before they moved the stakes, you had ample room to take a lateral drop...you didn't have a shot at the green, but you could punch out left to the FW.

IMO it had to be homeowners complaining about people playing shots that were OB from their back yard because we know most people just drop, or retrieve the ball and keep it moving if they hit OB. I can see that, but there was no reason (not a good one anyway) to also move the red stakes right up the edge of the cart path.

It's a tough little hole...bottomline, you just cannot go right...at all...it's going to be an OB re-tee, or hzd right, and mostly likely dbl or worse.