Pff preliminary grades, Bengals vs Packers

[bengaldoug]

Dalton -1.7
Rodgers -1.5

No real edge there. Rodgers' rating is a real credit to the Bengals' defensive performance. The much maligned and seemingly undermanned secondary of the Bengals had a great game, led by Leon Hall's +3.8 in pass coverage, shutting down slot star Randall Cobb to only 5 completions on 11 targets, and an interception. Michael Johnson was the dominant force on the line with 2 sacks, 2 hits, 1 hurry, and 1 very important batted pass, on the Packers' last play. His overall grade was a ridiculous +7.1 and he completely dominated rookie tackle David Bahktiari, who had a horrible day at -5.1....Carlos Dunlap rated +1.9 vs the run, and had a sack, a hit, a pressure, and two batted passes, including one on the penultimate play of the last drive. Adam Jones graded at +1.5, a herculean effort considering he was questionable going in with an abdominal injury. The defense overcame an unusually poor day from Geno Atkins who graded -2.9, and an also suprisingly poor day from Vontaze Burfict at -3.8. Burfict overran Johnathan Franklin twice leading to big plays in the Packers running game.

As for Dalton's day, just looking at his stats and 105 passer rating would make you think he was better than the -1.7 PFF gave him, but a close look at his day shows that out of 34 dropbacks only 7 passes were attempted 10 or more yards downfield, and much of the yardage(140 of 235) came after the catch. He was 3 of 7 ten yards and beyond, and his one interception came on an inaccurate pass under pressure. He was only pressured on 9 of 34 dropbacks but those nine pressures led to four sacks, an interception, a fumble, and only two completions. The breakaway running of Gio Bernard and Mohamed Sanu made him look better than he was.

 

[bengaldoug]

Top Grades for Bengals
DEFENSE
Michael Johnson +7.1
Leon Hall +3.0
Adam Jones +1.5

OFFENSE
Gio Bernard +1.9
Kyle Cook +1.5
AJ Green +1.4
A Whitworth +1.3
A Smith +1.3

 

[Tubbs1518]

How bad was BJGE rated?

 

[bengaldoug]

Worst grades for Bengals
DEFENSE
V Burfict -3.8
G Atkins -2.9
R Maualuga -2.3
B Thompson -1.9
D Peko -1.7

OFFENSE
J Gresham -3.6
K Zeitler -2.8
A Dalton -1.7
BJ Green-Ellis -1.5

 

[Servo]

Thanks for posting. I always enjoy reading this stuff. I wonder why Zeitler graded out so poorly.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Thanks for posting.

Dalton is always going to struggle to grade positively as the offense just doesn't call for a lot of shots down field. The underneath is going to be open a lot as teams shade their coverage towards AJ. Imagine the options underneath once Hawkins returns.

 

[kramer1]

Thanks for posting.

Dalton is always going to struggle to grade positively as the offense just doesn't call for a lot of shots down field. The underneath is going to be open a lot as teams shade their coverage towards AJ. Imagine the options underneath once Hawkins returns.

If Dalton didn't suck we'd call for passes down the field. This offense is being held back because of him and only him.

Sheesh.

 

[bengaldoug]

Thanks for posting. I always enjoy reading this stuff. I wonder why Zeitler graded out so poorly.

I was wondering the same. It didn't seem like too much pressure was coming up the middle. None of the guys he was playing against had particularly good days. Often when going against a 3-4 formation the guards don't have much to do when not helping on the nose tackle. Guess he didn't do a good enough job of getting to the second level against the inside backers.

 

[bengaldoug]

If Dalton didn't suck we'd call for passes down the field. This offense is being held back because of him and only him.

Sheesh.

You know who else really sucks? BenJarvus Green-Ellis. Every snap he takes from Gio is a snap stolen from the offense. Gio has the fifth best rating of all running backs, on only 81 snaps. Green-Ellis meanwhile gets the majority of the snaps and mires near the bottom of all backs.

 

[bengaldoug]

Thanks for posting.

Dalton is always going to struggle to grade positively as the offense just doesn't call for a lot of shots down field. The underneath is going to be open a lot as teams shade their coverage towards AJ. Imagine the options underneath once Hawkins returns.

I have to side with Kman here. I just have to believe they don't throw it downfield more often because they just don't think Andy can succeed. They're going to have to try soon, or defenses will adjust and take the short stuff away, and yac will disappear. And Green was often single covered, and well, by Sam Shields.

 

[bengaldoug]

Michael Johnson's play is definitely justifying the franchise tag placed on him. His 15.6 accumulated rating is second only to Robert Quinn's 18.5 among all 4-3 DEs.

 

[bengaldoug]

Leon Hall's +6.2 ranks third among all corners. That one was for Kramer.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

I tend to think they don't throw it downfield much because our fucking WR's are not getting open down field. AJ Green has been blanketed the last two weeks, once by Ike Taylor with almost NO HELP, and then yesterday by a guy that got tore up by by San Fran and Washington. He had a little safety help from time to time yesterday, but Green is not getting open, he is sucking it up the last two games. Then, there is no one else even remotely getting open downfield until Dalton his Jones for that big 3rd down conversion on the 95 yard drive.

Our WR's are sucking at getting open deep, and our offense is a underneath passing offensive.

Face it, Dalton is not what many of you want, but you are overexaggerating all the offensive issues and blaming them all on Dalton, regardless of who is to actually blame. Blame them WR's for some of the downfield issues.

Dalton hit Green when he finally got open for a TD, and then he hit Jones on 3rd and long once Jones found some seperation. You all bitch when Dalton throws INT's, but then bitch he is not throwing it into tighter coverage and waiting for a more open WR. Make up your fucking minds.

Just drink some of the orange fucking koolaid and call it a fucking day will ya?

 

[bengaldoug]

Season to date ratings -- offense

Best players- Clint Boling +5.1 Andrew Whitworth +4.9 Andre Smith +4.9 Giovanni Bernard +4.1 Kevin Zeitler +3.6

Worst players - Jermaine Gresham -6.0 BenJarvus Green-Ellis -2.9 Mohammed Sanu -2.2 Andy Dalton -1.6

Defense

Best players - Michael Johnson +15.6 Leon Hall +6.2 Terrence Newman +2.2 James Harrison +1.6

Worst players - Rey Maualuga -6.4 Domata Peko -4.1 Wallace Gilberry -2.8 Vontaze Burfict -1.6

 

[bengaldoug]

Anyone surprised at some of the ratings? Three games is really not enough to make any real judgements in a vacuum, but notable is Rey M, who had a horrible season last year and doesn't show any real signs of improvement. Atkins has not dominated like last year either. Are opponents making adjustments and double teaming him more?

 

[CrashDavisSports]

Yeah, that Burfict is a piece of crap. He has the same negative rating as Dalton. We will not be anything on defense until that bum can get his shit together and become a better player, or we replace him with someone more talented.

 

[bengaldoug]

I tend to think they don't throw it downfield much because our fucking WR's are not getting open down field. AJ Green has been blanketed the last two weeks, once by Ike Taylor with almost NO HELP, and then yesterday by a guy that got tore up by by San Fran and Washington. He had a little safety help from time to time yesterday, but Green is not getting open, he is sucking it up the last two games. Then, there is no one else even remotely getting open downfield until Dalton his Jones for that big 3rd down conversion on the 95 yard drive.

Our WR's are sucking at getting open deep, and our offense is a underneath passing offensive.

Face it, Dalton is not what many of you want, but you are overexaggerating all the offensive issues and blaming them all on Dalton, regardless of who is to actually blame. Blame them WR's for some of the downfield issues.

Dalton hit Green when he finally got open for a TD, and then he hit Jones on 3rd and long once Jones found some seperation. You all bitch when Dalton throws INT's, but then bitch he is not throwing it into tighter coverage and waiting for a more open WR. Make up your fucking minds.

Just drink some of the orange fucking koolaid and call it a fucking day will ya?

He's been mediocre since he arrived crash, and he's still mediocre so far this year. For the record I haven't given up on him yet, but this is a talented team, and the success window is never very wide. He needs to improve. So do Green and the other WRs. Green is way too talented to not dominate more than he has this year.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

He's been mediocre since he arrived crash, and he's still mediocre so far this year. For the record I haven't given up on him yet, but this is a talented team, and the success window is never very wide. He needs to improve. So do Green and the other WRs. Green is way too talented to not dominate more than he has this year.

I know Dalton can be a little more productive downfield, but you are all acting like, until we can start throwing bombs way downfield, this offense will be pedestrian. THat all starts with the WR's beating their man coverage, not with Dalton like some of you like to think. Our WR's have not been doing a very good job of geting open downfield. Defensive coordinators have done a good job game planning around our WR's, to our game plan though it has meant more open targets for Gresham and Eifert, along with short routes for Gio.

I saw two passes yesterday that Dalton threw deeper, only those two passes did the WR actually beat their coverage, and he completed both of them. One to Green on the TD and one to Jones on the 3rd and long conversion to keep the 95 yard drive going. Dalton went deep a few other times yesterday, to "take a shot" but Green was covered like white on rice. Until Green can start beating more coverage, Dalton is goign to throw the ball short to an open guy.

I don't know why people are so interested in seeing Dalton's INT's go way the hell up by him forcing balls that have no right to be thrown.

Does he have a laser like Elway and Farve used to have? Of course he does not. He never will. So it is hard for Dalton to throw a ball that leaves a hole in the underneath defender 2 foot wide as it exits him, and then lands in the WR's hands. He just does not have that arm strength. But, Dalton is pretty dang accurate, can throw a nice deep ball when a guy gets open, and can hit intermediate routes if his WR's can get a little padding. Dalton is not going to throw a fucking laser 40 yards downfield to a guy double covered and he has exactly 2 feet of window with a guy running full speed across the field. That is not Dalton's game, and just because that is not his game does not mean he is holding this team back. It means he is going to make smarter decisions, and he is going to hit the target who was able to get seperation in his route from the defender, unless it is a timing route, then it is up to the whether the defender read the play and jumped the route, or Dalton hit his guy in stride.

To restate, Dalton is not holding this team back, our QB just requires that our recievers get just enough seperation from their defenders to make him comfortable throwing them the ball. AJ Green who winds up side by side with a defender 10 yards down the field is actually open for a deep pass, because if Dalton can loft it out there 40 yards, Green will typically outrun the defender to the ball as long as it is not over thrown and there is no safety help over the top.

I do not see Dalton as an issue right now, I see the WR's as the issue right now. Them not getting seperation at all from defenders.

And yes, I agree about Gio. Dude should be starting, and he should get at least 15 carries a game, and 5 touches in the passing game every Sunday. You want to throw BJGE in there on 3rd and short or at the GL, I am cool with that, or to just give Gio a breather. The offense is just not as exciting with Gio and Eifert on the field.

 

[Cincyfan78]

He's been mediocre since he arrived crash, and he's still mediocre so far this year. For the record I haven't given up on him yet, but this is a talented team, and the success window is never very wide. He needs to improve. So do Green and the other WRs. Green is way too talented to not dominate more than he has this year.

Mediocre since he arrived...he arrived as a rookie who was thrust into starting right away, in less than ideal circumstances, with another rookie WR. The guy has done good. Does he need to get better? Yes. Do I think that the offense is held back soley because of him? No. The plan was never to have him start. They wanted Palmer back, and wanted Dalton to sit and learn, like Palmer did under Kitna.

AJ is the only legit deep threat. He's doubled. Sanu doesn't have the speed, and Marvin Jones hasn't shown he can get open deep with his speed OR catch the ball consistently, and Hawkins is a slot whos speed is utilized underneath against LB's and YAC.

So, other than a doubled AJ, who else is going to be open enough to throw it deep? I can gaurantee you that if Dalton started throwing 10+ more balls deep down field, and they started getting picked off, or stalling drives and 3-outs because of double coverage or whatever, everyone on this board would be screaming bloody murder that he doesn't "check" down and take what the defense gives him.

I'm not saying he's the best QB to step up, but he gets a lot of flack beacuse he's the QB, and some of the issues stem from areas that don't involve him. He can't make Sanu faster for deep routes, he can't make Marvin catch mall balls...etc...

 

[bengaldoug]

Here are some interesting quarterback grades and ranking. These will surprise.
6(t) Jake Locker +5.2 (including +5.5 passing)
8. Ryan Tannehill +5.0 (+6.3 passing)
27. Tom Brady -3.1 (-2.1 passing)
33. Colin Kaepernick -6.0 (-6.2 passing)
34. RG III -6.1(-4.0 passing)