Matt Cassel signing...thoughts?

[RAZORBACKG]

Exactly the same amount as Cassel under Turner...

But, since you asked. His first year was a locked out year. Meaning he had NO offseason work with the coaches at all his rookie year. No big deal, we had McNuggetts, so Ponder could sit and learn...

OOOops.. Mister "I didnt even know a football game could end in a tie" isnt worth a crap (which wasnt much of a surprise to most of us) and they toss Ponder in there and he does ok (for a rookie that was supposed to just sit and learn and only had 7 weeks on the job training).

His first FULL year with the coaches, he goes 10-6 and gets us into the playoffs. Joe Webb takes us out of the playoffs...

LAST year, if not for the defensive play calling and the fact the coaches made the great decisions they made all year (like not starting Rhodes, not starting CPat, ect), the Vikings would have been 10-5-1 at the VERY least and you wouldnt be making that stupid comment...

K?

so.....you give Ponder credit for getting us to 10-6 and making the playoffs? It was the AP show and hope Ponder does not have to throw down the field. I just think the Vikings should have a better QB who will look at his options downfield and watching Ponder throughout his career he does not seem to have that ability.

 

[Remember Met Stadium]

Nope, I didnt say I gave Ponder credit for it. Its a TEAM game, and the TEAM wins or loses. And when the DEFENSE fails, so does the TEAM. Cassel wasnt responsible for the wins he got, the DEFENSE playing better was. And you know it.

I was just pointing out the facts to the "Cassel can walk on water" crowd that Ponder did in fact do a better job than Cassel did last year, and for that matter his whole career so far. And I think Turner can release his potential, whereas I honestly think Cassel will never get better than he is. And he isnt as good as Ponder is right now, and the facts support that statement.

 

[Remember Met Stadium]

And again I will point out that Ponder had 9 passes of 30+ yards last year to Cassels 8. And Ponder also had the longest completion (in the air) at 42 yards. So much for the "cant go downfield" argument.

 

[Nosferatu]

And again I will point out that Ponder had 9 passes of 30+ yards last year to Cassels 8. And Ponder also had the longest completion (in the air) at 42 yards. So much for the "cant go downfield" argument.

I wonder if we could find a more useless stat to try and prove who's the better QB.

 

[JohnRandle]

Exactly the same amount as Cassel under Turner...

But, since you asked. His first year was a locked out year. Meaning he had NO offseason work with the coaches at all his rookie year. No big deal, we had McNuggetts, so Ponder could sit and learn...

OOOops.. Mister "I didnt even know a football game could end in a tie" isnt worth a crap (which wasnt much of a surprise to most of us) and they toss Ponder in there and he does ok (for a rookie that was supposed to just sit and learn and only had 7 weeks on the job training).

His first FULL year with the coaches, he goes 10-6 and gets us into the playoffs. Joe Webb takes us out of the playoffs...

LAST year, if not for the defensive play calling and the fact the coaches made the great decisions they made all year (like not starting Rhodes, not starting CPat, ect), the Vikings would have been 10-5-1 at the VERY least and you wouldnt be making that stupid comment...

K?

No need to be a dickhead about it.
He stated that he lives in Arkansas, doesn't get much info.

 

[JohnRandle]

Nope, I didnt say I gave Ponder credit for it. Its a TEAM game, and the TEAM wins or loses. And when the DEFENSE fails, so does the TEAM. Cassel wasnt responsible for the wins he got, the DEFENSE playing better was. And you know it.

I was just pointing out the facts to the "Cassel can walk on water" crowd that Ponder did in fact do a better job than Cassel did last year, and for that matter his whole career so far. And I think Turner can release his potential, whereas I honestly think Cassel will never get better than he is. And he isnt as good as Ponder is right now, and the facts support that statement.

You can throw up all the stats that you want.
I watched the games with my own two eyes. Cassel is more comfortable in the pocket, more decisive in his throws, looks at more than 1 target, commands the huddle better(according to the people actually in the huddle)....I'm sure there's more, but that is enough.

That doesn't mean Ponder can't be coached up. Turner might be able to get him ready to start next season, but the Vikes couldn't afford to assume that. They had to make sure they had their bases covered, and Cassel was the best option imo. And it should be his job to lose..

 

[Remember Met Stadium]

All true, but the fact remains... Stat for stat, Ponder is the better QB. Theres no denying it.

And being in Ar Kansas isnt exactly the other side of the world. He has the same access to the internet (obviously) that I do. And being a trucker, thats pretty much the only access I have as well, so frankly its no excuse.

 

[JohnRandle]

All true, but the fact remains... Stat for stat, Ponder is the better QB. Theres no denying it.

And being in Ar Kansas isnt exactly the other side of the world. He has the same access to the internet (obviously) that I do. And being a trucker, thats pretty much the only access I have as well, so frankly its no excuse.

If that pans out...I'm all for it.

 

[Nosferatu]

All true, but the fact remains... Stat for stat, Ponder is the better QB. Theres no denying it.

And being in Ar Kansas isnt exactly the other side of the world. He has the same access to the internet (obviously) that I do. And being a trucker, thats pretty much the only access I have as well, so frankly its no excuse.

Ummm, yes there is, the stats absolutely don't back up your OPINION. Too bad he blocked me because I didn't agree with his OPINION, he would see that I proved he was wrong.

 

[JohnRandle]

Ummm, yes there is, the stats absolutely don't back up your OPINION. Too bad he blocked me because I didn't agree with his OPINION, he would see that I proved he was wrong.

No he wouldn't...
He's not going to change his opinion, I guarantee it.
As long as the name calling doesn't get out of hand, he'll be fine voicing his own opinion.

 

[Nosferatu]

No he wouldn't...
He's not going to change his opinion, I guarantee it.
As long as the name calling doesn't get out of hand, he'll be fine voicing his own opinion.

I never have a problem with someone voicing their opinion but when they try to make others look stupid for not agreeing with them thats redonkulous! Especially when their opinion is wrong.

 

[JohnRandle]

You and I both agree with our opinion, but Met doesn't.
We won't know about either until the season opens.
Met just needs to realize this isn't Fox, personal shit, like namecalling will not be tolerated here.
We don't put up with bullshit..difference of opinions is great, let's keep it civil..

 

[Remember Met Stadium]

Umm, JR, YOU are the one doing the namecalling. I said he wouldnt be making that stupid comment if the Vikings D had played better the first half of the season. That isnt name calling. I said the COMMENT was stupid, not that HE was.

YOU on the other head called me a dickhead.

Lol, now frankly, I dont care. Ive known you for years and took it in the spirit intended.

 

[RAZORBACKG]

Oh well, IMHO (and I realize that I do not have the final say), I think Ponder is at best a backup(and that is even questionable to me). I know Cassel is not a world beater but from the games I have seen both Cassel and Ponder play, I feel that Cassel gives us the best chance to win. I still say we need to draft or bring in another guys for the for the future of the Vikings! The cool thing about this thread is that we all bleed purple and want whats best for our team!

 

[Remember Met Stadium]

Oh, Im not disputing the fact that Ponder as he is right now isnt an NFL caliber starter. Never said he was. I said he was better than Cassel last year. And he was. Cassel has been a "starting caliber" QB once in his career. And I credit the system more than him for it.

But keep in mind Ponder hasnt had any coaching since he got to the NFL really. Cassel was brought in to give him veteran experince and help him. He hasnt.

I want you to do something, well, 2 somethings really. Go here:http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/P/PondCh00.htm

Then go here: Fran Tarkenton NFL Football Statistics - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Look at the similarities between Ponders numbers and Frans for the first 3 years. Now try as I might, I can not find info on who the Vikings OC and QB coaches were back in the 60s. But SOMETHING happened between year 3 and 4 that kicked Tark in the ass. His interceptions dropped, his yard per attempt jumped, his QBR went from an average of low 70s to 91.8. The only real additions to the roster were Milt Sunde and Carl Eller. Now maybe a guard was what Tark needed. Maybe a guard is what Christian needs also.

Not saying that Ponder will be a HoF QB someday. But the parallels are scarey similar.

Interesting to note that in 1964, the Vikings only had 3 WRs on their roster...

 

[ladyrockess]

Game has changed since 1964 though...

 

[Nosferatu]

I said he was better than Cassel last year. And he was

Funny, he keeps posting his opinions as facts.

 

[JohnRandle]

Umm, JR, YOU are the one doing the namecalling. I said he wouldnt be making that stupid comment if the Vikings D had played better the first half of the season. That isnt name calling. I said the COMMENT was stupid, not that HE was.

YOU on the other head called me a dickhead.

Lol, now frankly, I dont care. Ive known you for years and took it in the spirit intended.

No way dude...lol
I said no need to be a dickhead, just in case you were planning on it later..;-)
And I was pretty drunk, might have pissed off some Bears fans that night as well..

 

[Remember Met Stadium]

Oh NO!! Not - dum dum DA! Bears fans!!

Actually, if it werent for the Vikes, I'd probably be a Bears fan. They are the least revolting of the rest of the league (to me).

 

[azred]

Oh, Im not disputing the fact that Ponder as he is right now isnt an NFL caliber starter. Never said he was. I said he was better than Cassel last year. And he was. Cassel has been a "starting caliber" QB once in his career. And I credit the system more than him for it.

But keep in mind Ponder hasnt had any coaching since he got to the NFL really. Cassel was brought in to give him veteran experince and help him. He hasnt.

I want you to do something, well, 2 somethings really. Go here:Christian Ponder NFL Football Statistics - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Then go here: Fran Tarkenton NFL Football Statistics - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Look at the similarities between Ponders numbers and Frans for the first 3 years. Now try as I might, I can not find info on who the Vikings OC and QB coaches were back in the 60s. But SOMETHING happened between year 3 and 4 that kicked Tark in the ass. His interceptions dropped, his yard per attempt jumped, his QBR went from an average of low 70s to 91.8. The only real additions to the roster were Milt Sunde and Carl Eller. Now maybe a guard was what Tark needed. Maybe a guard is what Christian needs also.

Not saying that Ponder will be a HoF QB someday. But the parallels are scarey similar.

Interesting to note that in 1964, the Vikings only had 3 WRs on their roster...[/QUOTE


Those first few years were a bunch of rag/tag players thrown together. Fran and the rest had to grow as a team.
Ponder walked into to an experienced team with a super star at running back and some very good players, on both sides of the ball.
Cassel and Ponder won't get this team to the playoffs. So no, I don't think it was a good signing and we will need to draft a qb. I want Johnny football. Can't do any worse than what we have now. The way the team throws around money on qb's [ Freeman]. Might as well see what the kid can do. jmo

Go Vikes!!!