Game Thread: LSU vs Clemson

[CrashDavisSports]

I am going to wear the rose colored glasses and say we finally got lucky and it is our turn to take over, same as NE was crap before Brady. Now it is our time.

We sucked the right year this time.

 

[cincygrad]

The way I understood targeting is when the tackling player lowers his head and launches himself at the opposing player. Ward never left his feet, he just ducked his head at the point of impact the same as Lawrence and the top of his helmet grazed the ear of Lawrence. It is a natural instinct to cover and protect yourself when you are preparing for a violent hit. Ward never left his feet to make impact. The guy from Clemson last night did become horizontal and left his feet making contact with the crown of his helmet. There is a difference in that action.

Here's the thing.... As long as players are going to continue to put their face down and lead with the crown of their helmet, there will be problems. It's not the way they are taught tackling and it is not good for their future prospects. Eyes need to stay up.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

Here's the thing.... As long as players are going to continue to put their face down and lead with the crown of their helmet, there will be problems. It's not the way they are taught tackling and it is not good for their future prospects. Eyes need to stay up.

I do not disagree with that. What I am saying is that the definition of targeting, Wade did not commit.

Targeting does not solely occur when players initiate helmet-to-helmet contact. It's defined as occurring when a player "takes aim at an opponent for purposes of attacking with forcible contact that goes beyond making a legal tackle or a legal block or playing the ball." Instances include, but are not limited to:

• Launch--a player leaving his feet to attack an opponent by an upward and forward thrust of the body to make forcible contact in the head or neck area.
• A crouch followed by an upward and forward thrust to attack with forcible contact at the head or neck area, even though one or both feet are still on the ground.
• Leading with helmet, shoulder forearm, fist, hand or elbow to attack with forcible contact at the head or neck area.
• Lowering the head before attacking by initiating forcible contact with the crown of his helmet.

That is not targeting. It was a bullshit call then that changed the momentum of the game, and it is still a bullshit call. But we can agree to disagree.

 

[cincygrad]

You pasted the words Crash..... "Lowering the head before attacking by initiating forcible contact with the crown of his helmet."

The OSU player lowered his head before attacking by initiating focible contact with the crown of his helmet..... Yes, it sucked that Lawrence started ducking make it head to head....But the minute the defender lowers his head to make contact with the crown, this is the risk that takes place.

 

[Cincyfan78]

The way I understood targeting is when the tackling player lowers his head and launches himself at the opposing player. Ward never left his feet, he just ducked his head at the point of impact the same as Lawrence and the top of his helmet grazed the ear of Lawrence. It is a natural instinct to cover and protect yourself when you are preparing for a violent hit. Ward never left his feet to make impact. The guy from Clemson last night did become horizontal and left his feet making contact with the crown of his helmet. There is a difference in that action.

Here's the thing, if you go and read the rule - it does not state that the player has to "launch" as part of the tackle to be targeting.

Any of the following can be flagged for targeting, and not all of the points have to be met to be flagged:

• Launch--a player leaving his feet to attack an opponent by an upward and forward thrust of the body to make forcible contact in the head or neck area.

• A crouch followed by an upward and forward thrust to attack with forcible contact at the head or neck area, even though one or both feet are still on the ground.

• Leading with helmet, shoulder forearm, fist, hand or elbow to attack with forcible contact at the head or neck area.

• Lowering the head before attacking by initiating forcible contact with the crown of his helmet.

To me, the OSU player falls under either of the final two points - so, by definition - yes, it was targeting. Now, If you disagree with the rule - that's something all together different - but by the rule, they got it right.

*Edit - I see you already posted this point - I again argue that it would be under either of the last two points. His crown of the helmet hit Lawrence in the head/neck area. Yes, he dropped his shoulder/head into the target area - but defenders simply cannot lead with the crown of the helmet any longer.

 

[Cincyfan78]

s

I am going to wear the rose colored glasses and say we finally got lucky and it is our turn to take over, same as NE was crap before Brady. Now it is our time.

We sucked the right year this time.

Hold on - the year Brady won his first Super Bowl, wasn't Bledsoe the QB, and they were actually doing pretty darn well, right? Am I mis-remembering?

 

[alf8478]

s


Hold on - the year Brady won his first Super Bowl, wasn't Bledsoe the QB, and they were actually doing pretty darn well, right? Am I mis-remembering?

I believe Bledsoe got knocked out in week 2 of that season.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

You pasted the words Crash..... "Lowering the head before attacking by initiating forcible contact with the crown of his helmet."

The OSU player lowered his head before attacking by initiating focible contact with the crown of his helmet..... Yes, it sucked that Lawrence started ducking make it head to head....But the minute the defender lowers his head to make contact with the crown, this is the risk that takes place.

Wade's chest made forcible contact with Lawrence's shoulder, the helmets made incidental contact. Not targeting.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

s


Hold on - the year Brady won his first Super Bowl, wasn't Bledsoe the QB, and they were actually doing pretty darn well, right? Am I mis-remembering?

The Patriots were 0-2 that year including a loss to the Cincinnati Bengals to open their season before Brady got his first start against the Colts.

 

[kramer1]

Lol @ the optimism in the thread. You poor, poor bastards.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

Lol @ the optimism in the thread. You poor, poor bastards.

Only need to hope Burrow is the next Brady, Manning, Brees. You get one of those, you change your franchise.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Lol @ the optimism in the thread. You poor, poor bastards.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Wade's chest made forcible contact with Lawrence's shoulder, the helmets made incidental contact. Not targeting.

fast forward to the .35 second mark, or the 1:05 mark. It's clear as daylight.

His crown of the helmet clearly hits Lawrence in the head. I don't know what else to tell you - it was 100% targeting.

 

[richig07]

I keep thinking of how the Bengals will screw this up.

here's my thinking.

Mike Brown will not pay Burrow what he's asking, so he basically sits out the entire first year of his contract while Dalton leads the team to mediocre 8-8, which makes our fan base go into a drunken frenzy as he passes for 400 yards against some crappy teams.

By year 2, Burrow's agent is insisting that we let him go or trade his rights to another team. finally, the NFL steps in and brokers a deal, and Burrow is in camp for his 2nd year as a Bengal.

he signs a 4 year deal, which includes the year he didn't play.

By the end of preseason 2021, he is injured, and we go to our backup QB (Ryan Finley I guess) who actually does ok, but not good enough for the playoffs. Burrow comes into the picture and leads a meaningless late season surge.

2022,2023: Burrow improves and makes the playoffs by 2023, we somehow lose to Houston's backup QB in OT, due to some suspect penalties.

2024: Burrow leads the Chargers to the Superbowl and bad mouths the bengals organizations in interviews.

Your premise falls apart before it starts. Salaries are slotted for NFL draft picks. His salary isn't negotiable and won't become negotiable until after his 3rd season. Only some small structuring stuff is up for negotiation. Rookie holdouts are essentially a thing of the past and have been for quite a few years.

Oh, and Dalton is gone.

 

[cincygrad]

The Patriots were 0-2 that year including a loss to the Cincinnati Bengals to open their season before Brady got his first start against the Colts.

This. The Patriots lost the the Bengals in week 1 in Cincinnati and Jets in week 2 in NE..... Bledsoe was hurt very late in that game. At that point in time, Belicheck's record with the Patriots stood at 5-13. Not very good for a coach that cost draft picks to acquire.

In week 3 of 2001, the Patriots put a beatdown on Indy. You can see the game on youtube. A friend and I were watching a few minutes of it a couple years ago after they did this big puff piece on Brady.... It's sort of interesting because Brady looks nothing like he would look later. He sort of looks shaky. I sort of wonder if the deal he made with the devil occurred during halftime of that game.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Your premise falls apart before it starts. Salaries are slotted for NFL draft picks. His salary isn't negotiable and won't become negotiable until after his 3rd season. Only some small structuring stuff is up for negotiation. Rookie holdouts are essentially a thing of the past and have been for quite a few years.

Oh, and Dalton is gone.

Trade Dalton. Tag and trade AJ - not only will you get some mid-round picks - you'll free up a good chunck of Salary that can be used to upgrade a lot of positions of need - specifically OL, TE, and LB.

Then use the draft to start building up that depth - going to need CB/DT/S, more OL WR - etc...

 

[DanBengalfan]

Your premise falls apart before it starts. Salaries are slotted for NFL draft picks. His salary isn't negotiable and won't become negotiable until after his 3rd season. Only some small structuring stuff is up for negotiation. Rookie holdouts are essentially a thing of the past and have been for quite a few years.

Oh, and Dalton is gone.

that's good to know.

unfortunately, we can't say Dalton is gone until he's actually gone.

I guess Burrows will just demand a trade then. something bad has to happen, and the other option is that he has a Ki-Jana moment.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

that's good to know.

unfortunately, we can't say Dalton is gone until he's actually gone.

I guess Burrows will just demand a trade then. something bad has to happen, and the other option is that he has a Ki-Jana moment.

How many of our first round picks "do not" have this moment?

 

[Cincyfan78]

How many of our first round picks "do not" have this moment?

Well, first off - ACL's are hardly career ending anymore.

Secondly, yikes - I mean, not sure this is the stance I would take considering the injury history of our 1st round picks recently. I mean, just in the last 4 drafts: Jonah Williams, Billy Price, John Ross, William Jackson. Cedric was coming off an ACL tear and missing a year, and I believe Dennard missed time his 1st year, and then you have Eifert.

I mean - no, maybe they haven't had the "Ki-Jana" moment to end a career, but it's not exactly a who's who list of health and prosperity...LOL

 

[CrashDavisSports]

Well, first off - ACL's are hardly career ending anymore.

Secondly, yikes - I mean, not sure this is the stance I would take considering the injury history of our 1st round picks recently. I mean, just in the last 4 drafts: Jonah Williams, Billy Price, John Ross, William Jackson. Cedric was coming off an ACL tear and missing a year, and I believe Dennard missed time his 1st year, and then you have Eifert.

I mean - no, maybe they haven't had the "Ki-Jana" moment to end a career, but it's not exactly a who's who list of health and prosperity...LOL

The list is daunting. Hopefully, Burrow is the key to break all our bad luck. Bad management decisions, poor coaching, injury prone players, etc.