Lets Get Real

[Mike]

Talking with friends, and talking with many fans at the Casino in Charles Town there are so many people that are either stupid, blind or just delusional......I don't know which??? I keep hearing we need to fire Dana, and we will never go anywhere with him. How great we were and how we don't belong in the Big 12. Look at UCF and ask them where they would rather be??

20 years in the Big East and we won two (2) out right conference titles and five (5) shared titles, many of which were shared with 3-4 teams.

Big East Conference Index | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

West Virginia has finished a season ranked in at least one of the Associated Press (AP) or Coaches polls on 20 occasions. The Mountaineers have finished ranked amongst the top 10 in college football on five occasions. That has been since 1936. That is 81 years of poles That is about 25% of the time, Since Dana has been the coach we have finished ranked 2 times in 7 years, (this year is still to be determined)

West Virginia has had 9, 10 win or more seasons in 106 years 2 has been under Holgersen. That is less than 9% of the time we win 10 games or more, Holgersen has had 2 of them in 8 seasons, that is 25% of the time.

Someone please show me where I'm missing our eliteness? I see a pattern and I don't see where we are doing any worse under Holgersen than before him.

We are who we are and no matter what I will always love my Mountaineers till I take my last breath. People better be careful what they wish for the grass is not always greener on the other side of the fence.

 

[Anotherwvufan]

Great stats but no B12 conference championship or even second. His best teams have faltered down the strech and above all he has failed to beat Oklahoma. 8-3 is not bad for any coach, but this year we had a team that could have done far better. Haters will have a lot to talk about this offseason.

Holgerson is an offensive genius and is great at developing QBs and WRs. He has done well at developing depth and recruiting skill positions. At 8-3 and full stadiums, I doubt Holgs is anywhere near a hot seat. Had he won last night he may have a job for life.

Defense has been another story. No matter the alignment, fundamentals like tackling and avoiding blocks become important. I would not be surprised to see a shakeup on that side of the ball. A few years ago we missed out on Venebles to Clemson. We see how that worked out. Dana is cheap, no balls need to get a real good D coordinator.

 

[bbwvfan]

Good post Mike!

IMO, most of Dana’s haters are truly delusional. They feel everything is in place... talent... facilities... to compete for NC’s on a regular basis.

This team had talent at some of the skill positions.

It was short on talent at CB and LB.

Everyone knew that heading into the season. But, for some reason... as the season moved forward... and our team was moving up into the top 10 status... it became a forgotten fact.

Dana did a great job getting this team to 8-3. Vegas had our win total around 7.

 

[Slaton10]

Talking with friends, and talking with many fans at the Casino in Charles Town there are so many people that are either stupid, blind or just delusional......I don't know which??? I keep hearing we need to fire Dana, and we will never go anywhere with him. How great we were and how we don't belong in the Big 12. Look at UCF and ask them where they would rather be??

20 years in the Big East and we won two (2) out right conference titles and five (5) shared titles, many of which were shared with 3-4 teams.

Big East Conference Index | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

West Virginia has finished a season ranked in at least one of the Associated Press (AP) or Coaches polls on 20 occasions. The Mountaineers have finished ranked amongst the top 10 in college football on five occasions. That has been since 1936. That is 81 years of poles That is about 25% of the time, Since Dana has been the coach we have finished ranked 2 times in 7 years, (this year is still to be determined)

West Virginia has had 9, 10 win or more seasons in 106 years 2 has been under Holgersen. That is less than 9% of the time we win 10 games or more, Holgersen has had 2 of them in 8 seasons, that is 25% of the time.

Someone please show me where I'm missing our eliteness? I see a pattern and I don't see where we are doing any worse under Holgersen than before him.

We are who we are and no matter what I will always love my Mountaineers till I take my last breath. People better be careful what they wish for the grass is not always greener on the other side of the fence.

 

[mad2mc]

Mike - I’m not sure if you were on the CBS boards but you may have heard us talk about Banned Sleepy and King. Banned was an Arkansas fan and King was a Texas A&M fan who would come over a tell us about ourselves. At that time you couldn’t tell me shit because RR had us humming and we beat Georgia and OU in Bowl games. Those 2 kept on hammering us. The 1st ACC raid kind of opened my eyes, but I still felt those 2 guys were asshats. Then the wheels fell off the cart with the 2nd raid and all of a sudden we were the big fish in a meaningless conference. My son said what a lot of people remember as the good ol’ days ‘Give me RR. At least he gave us a winning program’. I wanted to check him in a room at the Medical Center but decided to go home and ask my wife if he was really mine.
What I’m attempting to say in a long winded post is that some cannot get past our BE days and realize that we are new to an established conference who has 2 historical programs. We do not have anything close to what these 2 programs have. But this year, we beat one and should have beaten the other. We weren’t good enough again to do it. Ya, I grimaced when Dana didn’t go for 3 in the 1st half, but I was alright with it. That didn’t cost us the game and it didn’t cost us an opportunity to tie the game. We lost 2 opportunities with the strip sacks both returned for 14 points. We lost an opportunity with the blocking out of bounds call, which I still haven’t seen a replay of the call or the game. At the end of the night, we still had an opportunity to win that game. I’m good with this season. Didn’t end the way I wanted. I’m good with Dana. I’m good with Spavital leaving, which may have saved Gibby’s job for some reason. I wish we can bring in recruits and get the hell out of that 3-3-5. Jeighmonee would bitterly disagree but enough is enough.

 

[OBMayhem]

I don’t follow WV, so I don’t know that much about Holgerson. However, if Grier were still at Florida, I think we’re 11-1 right now. That’s a difference in QB’s at Florida and maybe a difference in coaching at WV

 

[bbwvfan]

I don’t follow WV, so I don’t know that much about Holgerson. However, if Grier were still at Florida, I think we’re 11-1 right now. That’s a difference in QB’s at Florida and maybe a difference in coaching at WV

Not sure I'm following you.

Are you saying our coaching cost us this year more so than our defense?

Grier had a great season. In order for us to have a special season, he had to perform exactly the same as Kyler Murray though. Our defense was not able to help our offense win against Okie St and OU. When your offense scores 41 and 56 points... it should win.

UF is in need of better talent at the skilled positions. UF won this year despite a mediocre offense. Your defense was better than WVU's. Your defense faced much weaker offenses over the course of the year than WVU.

 

[WVUDAD]

Are you saying our coaching cost us this year more so than our defense?

Both were horrible at times!!! Our ballsy coaching won us the Texas game, and may have cost us the OU game. This WVU slightly overachieved the pre season expectations, but once we saw what the team was capable of, they greatly underperformed the potential!!! For all of Grier's upside and the games he won with his heroics, those same attributes cost us at critical times this year. I think the coaches got in his head over the picks thrown to Kansas to where he was afraid to throw against ISU, there were guys open that he did not throw to. He has to learn to take a sack and secure the ball when protection breaks down. I am disappointed in this season, while I expected about 7 wins in Sep, I started expecting more as the season played out, even after the IAST loss, I expected a run at the conference championship, the league was down as a whole this year, and WVU had the talent on the field to win it, I believe we gave away our best opportunity to date of winning the B12. I truly think we were the most complete team in the league this year.

 

[bbwvfan]

Both were horrible at times!!! Our ballsy coaching won us the Texas game, and may have cost us the OU game. This WVU slightly overachieved the pre season expectations, but once we saw what the team was capable of, they greatly underperformed the potential!!! For all of Grier's upside and the games he won with his heroics, those same attributes cost us at critical times this year. I think the coaches got in his head over the picks thrown to Kansas to where he was afraid to throw against ISU, there were guys open that he did not throw to. He has to learn to take a sack and secure the ball when protection breaks down. I am disappointed in this season, while I expected about 7 wins in Sep, I started expecting more as the season played out, even after the IAST loss, I expected a run at the conference championship, the league was down as a whole this year, and WVU had the talent on the field to win it, I believe we gave away our best opportunity to date of winning the B12. I truly think we were the most complete team in the league this year.

I need to be careful responding to you... I don't trust you at all. Your trolling behavior lingers with me...

But, I'll discuss your points.

1. Grier had a special year. As I said, he needed to have a Kyler Murray... Baker Mayfield... Trevone Boykin... type year to overcome our defense's weaknesses. Like you said, Grier's major flaw... wanting to be a gunslinger... wanting to make a big play with his arm... bit him and our team in losses this year.

2. I don't know if coaches got in his head following the KU game or not. Some speculate he got his bell rung earlier in the season... and injured his head against KU... resulting in his poor play at ISU. I don't go there though. IMO, Grier is not the brightest kid. I have nothing to support this opinion except for on the field decisions. In the TT game's 2nd half, he repeatedly kept trying to run the ball against a bear front. Against ISU, he kept trying to throw the ball against an 8 man cloud defense. Those decisions baffled my mind.

3. Our defense replaced 8 starters this year? Something like that. We started the year desperately thin in the LB and CB Corps. The CB situation was so bad, we moved Pitts to CB from his more natural safety position. Our LB Corps lost Benton at the start of the first game of the season. Lost Hensley to injury... Tonkery had a groin injury he could not recover from... Campbell got a shoulder stinger he could not recover from. We moved a safety to our OLB position... SAM position... where a 5'8" kid is responsible for strong side help... forced to cover opponent's TE's.

4. For whatever reason, Gibby did not use many of the backups at WILL, SAM or MIKE... did not rotate many of the backups at any of our 5 safety positions throughout the year. The kids simply wore down at season's end. At midseason, the defense was considered one of the fastest... most athletic defenses we ever had. They did not look fast or athletic at season's end. They looked tired. They couldn't tackle... couldn't take angles... couldn't recover... as well as they did earlier in the season.

5. Okie St and OU provided the two most explosive... most athletic offenses we would face all season. Unfortunately, we faced both of them in back to back weeks at the end of the year. Our schedule was once again back loaded. And, despite the fact we built depth, injuries impacted this depth in critical areas for us.

6. Maybe Gibby could have called things more aggressively in the 2nd half of the Okie St game and for the entirety of the OU game? Maybe doing so would have been more costly? I trust he called the game the way he could knowing the status of his personnel better than any of us.

7. IMO, Gibby shared his defensive shortcomings with his good friend and HC. That is why we saw Dana take the risks he did on 4th down. Of note, Dana had not gone for 4th down conversions prior to the last 2 games this year like he had in years' past. I believe Gibby told him his defense was incapable of making stops. This wasn't the case earlier in the season.

 

[WVUDAD]

5. Okie St and OU provided the two most explosive... most athletic offenses we would face all season. Unfortunately, we faced both of them in back to back weeks at the end of the year. Our schedule was once again back loaded. And, despite the fact we built depth, injuries impacted this depth in critical areas for us.

That point is huge!!! WVU had Oklahoma State and OU the last two games of the year, Texas had IAST and Kansas.........I see the point that TAM, Colorado, Nebraska and Mizzou make about who runs the league!!! I also question the fact that officials work for the league, what was financially in the B12's interest at the end of the year? Texas vs OU for the championship......I would LOVE to hear the league office and head officials about the non call on the textbook targeting that put Simms out of the game against OU, the kid that should have been ejected played a huge part in the 2nd half........

 

[bbwvfan]

Big 12 officials got what they wanted.

Against Texas, it was always WVU's 11 vs 20. UT's 11 + 9 officials.

Same damn thing for the OU game. Like Dana said in his post game presser, how do you take 14 points off the board like they did last Friday night?

Targeting should have been called on the Simms play. The OU kid clearly fumbled the ball...

 

[WVUDAD]

the very definition of targetting!!!

 

[bbwvfan]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Pretty sure my dude <a href="Tj Simmons (@a_scouts_dream) | Twitter">@a_scouts_dream</a> got flagged for this against Oklahoma but that’s none of my business <a href="https://t.co/qGoSd2r9fs">pic.twitter.com/qGoSd2r9fs</a></p>&mdash; kris morris (@kmorris4121) <a href="">December 1, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


Watch the block on the sideline...

 

[Anotherwvufan]

Got to agree with the posts of most out here

Coulda Shouda Woulda

 

[WVUDAD]

Speaking of getting real, No WVU player will ever win the Heisman, it is reserved for players on the blue blood teams anymore
Heisman Trophy finalists 2018: Tua Tagovailoa, Kyler Murray, Dwayne Haskins heading to New York

 

[Anotherwvufan]

Speaking of getting real, No WVU player will ever win the Heisman, it is reserved for players on the blue blood teams anymore
Heisman Trophy finalists 2018: Tua Tagovailoa, Kyler Murray, Dwayne Haskins heading to New York

Geno would have won it a few years ago, then we started losing. It helps when you are on a winning team.
We beat Oklahoma, Grier is top 3. If we went undefeated, he would win the Heisman.

 

[WVUDAD]

Geno would have won it a few years ago, then we started losing. It helps when you are on a winning team.
We beat Oklahoma, Grier is top 3. If we went undefeated, he would win the Heisman.

He would not have won it this year with great QBs at those three blue bloods. The only chance a guy at a WVU type school is if there is no stand out at any of the big boys.

 

[Anotherwvufan]

If we beat Oklahoma maybe twice, Grier ens up at #2. Tua has the stats, is on a better team and is a better player. Even with that, take away a bad game at Iowa State, one dropped pass against Okie State, and two fumbles against Oklahoma, WVU is #3 and in the playoff and Grier wins the Heisman.

The Heisman often goes to the best player on the best team. If your team can’t win it’s conference or make the playoff, a Heisman is almost impossible.

 

[DCWV4life]

WE HAD NO DEFENSE THIS YEAR.....Why did people think we were going to win the conf. We had a very solid season IMO....

I like Dana and i think he is doing a good job for us...I just want to see us win that big game that we are not supposed to win.

I have been so pissed about the Okie St game...I still can't believe our offense let us down the way it did this season. Iowa St good lord, Okie St could not do a damn thing in the second half, and Ok giving them 14 points...this was a hard season, not because of the record but how we got there.

 

[Slaton10]

Both were horrible at times!!! Our ballsy coaching won us the Texas game, and may have cost us the OU game. This WVU slightly overachieved the pre season expectations, but once we saw what the team was capable of, they greatly underperformed the potential!!! For all of Grier's upside and the games he won with his heroics, those same attributes cost us at critical times this year. I think the coaches got in his head over the picks thrown to Kansas to where he was afraid to throw against ISU, there were guys open that he did not throw to. He has to learn to take a sack and secure the ball when protection breaks down. I am disappointed in this season, while I expected about 7 wins in Sep, I started expecting more as the season played out, even after the IAST loss, I expected a run at the conference championship, the league was down as a whole this year, and WVU had the talent on the field to win it, I believe we gave away our best opportunity to date of winning the B12. I truly think we were the most complete team in the league this year.

I think there is some truth in there somewhere...I think Wv got predictable in play calling at times and you saw it in the Kansas game, )BTW IMHO I thought Kansas, for get the record had a pretty good year...they never quit)...and in the Iowa State game he was probably drilled during the week to protect the ball...I am sure a major contradiction of what he was told to do since spring football...Will shoulders the blame, he was the starting QB...but the O Line specifically at Right Guard never really gelled this year.. and you saw that fatal flaw in just about every game...go back all the way back an watch the Tennessee game, the RG was pancaked at least a half a dozen times in the game..

I told BBW at the beginning of the year I wasn't sold on the defense...as they began to lose the LB corp it went down hill from there....Bigelow started like a house on fire and ran out of gas mid way through the season