Kiper and McShay's podcast

[redskinsfan]

Then we can select Kikaha in the 3rd who is just as good as Fowler

Or we can trade down, get more picks and let McCloughan pull off his magic in hitting on draft picks.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

SO I will simply ask again... .how is fixing the O-line NOT thinking long term?? Scherff projects to be a great O-lineman. Is the hangup that he would actually address a current and future need?? Or rather that by addressing the need now, we should be getting RID of that particular need in the future.

I've answered this question every possible way I can but I'll try again: First off you are one of the very few who actually considers Scherff a top 5 talent. So for starters I do not believe he is close to a top 5 talent. By selecting Scherff at 5 you are IMO (and in most people's opinion) taking a lower rated player to fill an immediate need. You are also taking a player at a position that can be filled later in the draft. That goes triple if he is converted to guard. I'll take the word of the Iowa fan who was another who said he really struggles in pass protection, the one thing this team needs the most, and that he will probably have to play guard.

The positive of immediate gratification by getting a probable opening day starter is offset and then some by the feeling that down the road 2-4 years you would have been better off long term drafting the better player. Again look at my Jordan example. Sam Perkins was a damn solid player who played for 18 years and won a gold medal. He also would have filled a giant need for the Bulls for the upcoming season. He is Brandon Scherff. But it should be obvious that the Bulls were thinking long term, not quick fix, so they drafted Michael Jordan even though they were set for the next year at least at shooting guard with Quinton Daily, just as we appear set at WR for the upcoming year.

This really is not that hard to understand, I honestly do not know how else I can explain it. You are better off long term drafting the highest rated player. And I believe there are several players who carry a higher grade and those should be the targets, not the guy who can offer the quick fix at the expense of passing over a player who projects to be better down the road.

 

[Lonewate44]

I've answered this question every possible way I can but I'll try again: First off you are one of the very few who actually considers Scherff a top 5 talent. So for starters I do not believe he is close to a top 5 talent. By selecting Scherff at 5 you are IMO (and in most people's opinion) taking a lower rated player to fill an immediate need. You are also taking a player at a position that can be filled later in the draft. That goes triple if he is converted to guard. I'll take the word of the Iowa fan who was another who said he really struggles in pass protection, the one thing this team needs the most, and that he will probably have to play guard.

The positive of immediate gratification by getting a probable opening day starter is offset and then some by the feeling that down the road 2-4 years you would have been better off long term drafting the better player. Again look at my Jordan example. Sam Perkins was a damn solid player who played for 18 years and won a gold medal. He also would have filled a giant need for the Bulls for the upcoming season. He is Brandon Scherff. But it should be obvious that the Bulls were thinking long term, not quick fix, so they drafted Michael Jordan even though they were set for the next year at least at shooting guard with Quinton Daily, just as we appear set at WR for the upcoming year.

This really is not that hard to understand, I honestly do not know how else I can explain it. You are better off long term drafting the highest rated player. And I believe there are several players who carry a higher grade and those should be the targets, not the guy who can offer the quick fix at the expense of passing over a player who projects to be better down the road.

Thing is......AS I have said repeadly, maybe Scot feels he is a top 5 talent player..We dont know..and if he pulls off the pick, we must assume that he feels that he is worthy of the pick..you like others seem to think the MOCKS that have him going 10-15 is his value...That is NOT.....That is where "experts" feel he will go...Not what his value or talent is...Mocks have nothing to do with who is the higher player...It has to do with where these "experts" have him going based on team needs ahead of said pick...

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Thing is......AS I have said repeadly, maybe Scot feels he is a top 5 talent player..We dont know..and if he pulls off the pick, we must assume that he feels that he is worthy of the pick..you like others seem to think the MOCKS that have him going 10-15 is his value...That is NOT.....That is where "experts" feel he will go...Not what his value or talent is...Mocks have nothing to do with who is the higher player...It has to do with where these "experts" have him going based on team needs ahead of said pick...

Oh I agree. I've said it repeatedly as well. If GMSM take Scherff it will be because he feels he is the BPA, not because he fills a need, and I will be in total support of the pick. I'd be shocked it happens though.

 

[redskinsfan]

Oh I agree. I've said it repeatedly as well. If GMSM take Scherff it will be because he feels he is the BPA, not because he fills a need, and I will be in total support of the pick. I'd be shocked it happens though.

If that happens, Shark will be insufferable.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

LOL How about we trade back a few spots, grab a 3rd, and then take Scherff where he should be selected? Talk about a win/win.

 

[Lonewate44]

Oh I agree. I've said it repeatedly as well. If GMSM take Scherff it will be because he feels he is the BPA, not because he fills a need, and I will be in total support of the pick. I'd be shocked it happens though.

It may seem like im on the sherrf bandwagon, which im not...I just see people thinking he is the 9th best player based on Mocks, which mean nothing....

I am just overjoyed that we have a first round pick!!! and If we make a selection I hope it is a great player for years to come..But in this draft..the #5 pick sure has some enticing possabilities for trade down, and I am not opposed to that...for sure!!!

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Not sure why people knock the mocks so much. Sure there are misses but they seem to be pretty close year to year. It's impossible to predict who will slip and who will move up but when the dust settles there are very few surprises early in the draft. And those expectations come from mock drafts.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Ok this is literally the first mock I found, by WalterFootball. Here is their mock along with the actual pick in parenthesis for last year's draft.

1. Clowney (Clowney)
2. Robinson (Robinson)
3. Watkins (Bortles)
4. Evans (Watkins)
5. Mack (Mack)
6. Mathews (Mathews)
7. Manziel (Evans)
8. Donald (Gilbert)
9. Lewan (Barr)
10. Barr (Ebron)
11. Beckham (Lewan)
12. Martin (Beckham)

They hit 4 dead center and 9 out of 12 went within 3 spots of their projection. That's pretty damn close for a genre that everyone seems to think is always way off.

2014 NFL Mock Draft - WalterFootball.com
2014 NFL draft - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Sharkinva]

LOL How about we trade back a few spots, grab a 3rd, and then take Scherff where he should be selected? Talk about a win/win.

Sherff wont get past the Giants and Rams. Most of you want to trade back with the Browns. But as I said fuck it, I hope we either Draft Mariota, or trade back with Philly, take the pass rusher Dejour, and end up trying to trade up to take Cardale Jones next year.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Sherff wont get past the Giants and Rams. Most of you want to trade back with the Browns. But as I said fuck it, I hope we either Draft Mariota, or trade back with Philly, take the pass rusher Dejour, and end up trying to trade up to take Cardale Jones next year.

I agree he probably goes before 12, that's why I said trade back a few spots.

 

[redskinsfan]

Sherff wont get past the Giants and Rams. Most of you want to trade back with the Browns. But as I said fuck it, I hope we either Draft Mariota, or trade back with Philly, take the pass rusher Dejour, and end up trying to trade up to take Cardale Jones next year.

So, how good would you feel if McCloughan took Scherff at five? Just wondering.

 

[Sharkinva]

I agree he probably goes before 12, that's why I said trade back a few spots.

With WHO?? The Giants wouldnt make the deal unless they got to pork us in the process, So unless Atlanta panics and comes up for a WR, I dont see a trade that allows us to draft Scherff.

 

[Sharkinva]

Sorry guys, but you have to understand. I want us to take the guy who SHOULD help us for the next 5-10 years over the guy who could help us in the next 2-3 years. So not IM not willing to simply say we will totally suck ass this year but we got a guy that should be a starter for us two years down the road.

So sure, plan for the future, but also Improve for the now so that hopefully we have less work to actually do in the future.

 

[redskinsfan]

Sorry guys, but you have to understand. I want us to take the guy who SHOULD help us for the next 5-10 years over the guy who could help us in the next 2-3 years. So not IM not willing to simply say we will totally suck ass this year but we got a guy that should be a starter for us two years down the road.

So sure, plan for the future, but also Improve for the now so that hopefully we have less work to actually do in the future.

And those guys could and should be Andrus Peat / Ereck Flowers and La'El Collins / Laken Tomlinson. Two guys that are long term solutions over one guy that's a luxury, sexy pick.

 

[Sharkinva]

And those guys could and should be Andrus Peat / Ereck Flowers and La'El Collins / Laken Tomlinson. Two guys that are long term solutions over one guy that's a luxury, sexy pick.

Like i said dude, its fine to look at long term.. but its border line stupid to ignore present needs in order to say well I was looking towards the future. Thats like letting the lights get cut off to dump an extra $50 into your 401K. Last time i checked we still had to play this year. And unless we have decided to suck for Cardale, it makes no sense to look at this year as nothing more than a building year for three years down the road. YOu draft players that CAN actually help you now and in the future. We are NOT good enough to be drafting players for three years down the road for the simple fact that if we dont show some real improvement this year, we will be looking for a new coach next year and then once again all bets are off.

 

[Sharkinva]

So, how good would you feel if McCloughan took Scherff at five? Just wondering.

Id would feel like we made a smart move. Now if he followed that up with another premier O-line that happened to be there in the second round.. I would feel as if we actually addressed current needs with an eye towards the future as well.

 

[redskinsfan]

Id would feel like we made a smart move. Now if he followed that up with another premier O-line that happened to be there in the second round.. I would feel as if we actually addressed current needs with an eye towards the future as well.

Wait a minute . . . isn't taking someone in the second round "lesser talent"? Are you sure we should spend a pick filling a hole with that type of sub-par talent?

 

[Sharkinva]

Wait a minute . . . isn't taking someone in the second round "lesser talent"? Are you sure we should spend a pick filling a hole with that type of sub-par talent?

Dude... if you really want to know. I think they should take Scherff at five AND trade back into the first round to take Flowers if he is there in the late 20's. But you guys would totally flip your shit if Scot did that I suspect.

 

[redskinsfan]

Dude... if you really want to know. I think they should take Scherff at five AND trade back into the first round to take Flowers if he is there in the late 20's. But you guys would totally flip your shit if Scot did that I suspect.

I would trust Scot if he did that. But right now, that looks like another Vinny move. Really, dude.

Let's make a bet on Scherff being selected at five. If he does, I'll put the pic of Vinny as my avatar for a week. If he doesn't, you do it.

Deal?