Jose Abreu is the best young hitter in the game

[pumpkinhead33793]

You said it's pretty much a certainty that Abreu will be even better (post #81)....so if I can show you two Cuban players who had their first full years in their mid-20s and didn't get any better afterwards, how is it "pretty much a certainty" that Abreu will get better?

You're not being consistent with your argument here...one second it's a certainty he will get better, and the next it might not be.

It is not a certainty but it is very likely. Sorry.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

You just said Trout was not at his prime. Wouldn't that imply that he would get significantly better from now to 27? Not be consistently as good?

Again, no shit. Your prime baseball ages are usually around 27-30. You know where Pujols continued putting up his monster numbers and winning 2 of his MVP's? His numbers then steeply dropped from then on(still doing well at 34 though!!!)

Trout has had even better success by 23.

There is no way to know what a player will do next year or in 5 years. But Trout has already sustained success at a much younger age. Like Pujols.

Abreu has 1 year. He hasn't yet proven if he can replicate it and he is 3 years out from when most start to decline.

You do realize that when you start at age 20-21 some years will be better than others right?

Lebron James has been in his prime. Every year his numbers fluctuate slightly but he remains the best in the game because he can do it all. Just like Mike Trout.

 

[pumpkinhead33793]

Again, no shit. Your prime baseball ages are usually around 27-30. You know where Pujols continued putting up his monster numbers and winning 2 of his MVP's? His numbers then steeply dropped from then on(still doing well at 34 though!!!)

Trout has had even better success by 23.

There is no way to know what a player will do next year or in 5 years. But Trout has already sustained success at a much younger age. Like Pujols.

Abreu has 1 year. He hasn't yet proven if he can replicate it and he is 3 years out from when most start to decline.

You do realize that when you start at age 20-21 some years will be better than others right?

Lebron James has been in his prime. Every year his numbers fluctuate slightly but he remains the best in the game because he can do it all. Just like Mike Trout.

So Pujols was already in his prime at age 23 just like the numbers suggest. Who knows if Trout is it is not in his prime. So far, he got worse in year 3.

Btw, Abreu is hitting 374 since the break.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

So Pujols was already in his prime at age 23 just like the numbers suggest. Who knows if Trout is it is not in his prime. So far, he got worse in year 3.

Btw, Abreu is hitting 374 since the break.

So Pujols had a 10 year prime lol. And it looks like Trout is on that same path.

Keep proving my point.

 

[pumpkinhead33793]

So Pujols had a 10 year prime lol. And it looks like Trout is on that same path.

Keep proving my point.

You said Trout would not be in his prime for 3-4 years. Now you change that stance?

Btw, thanks for answering my question, lol. You are so in love with Trout you can't even admit someone had a better year than him.

 

[StanMarsh51]

So Pujols was already in his prime at age 23 just like the numbers suggest. Who knows if Trout is it is not in his prime. So far, he got worse in year 3.

Btw, Abreu is hitting 374 since the break.

And his power is severely down, so it's not all dandy...just 6 HR and 29 RBI in 51 games since the break.

 

[pumpkinhead33793]

And his power is severely down, so it's not all dandy...just 6 HR and 29 RBI in 51 games since the break.

Because everyone is pitching him away and he is taking what they give him. And no one is fucking on base to give him RBI chances.

 

[da55bums]

Again, you have to factor in experience. In baseball, a players prime as far as their physical ability goes well past 27. You can't possibly tell me that someone that is in their first year at 27 will not approve based on experience at age 28, 29, 30 when they become more acclimated to pitchers.

I agree with you, 27 is the proven age that a MAJORITY of the time is the beginning of the PEAK years....always exceptions to every rule but easily proven by stats of all players. Sure they will get better after 27 but there is more of a jump before 27.


Trout may have had his prime, its about adjustments, he will have to adjust to stay at a high level. Pitchers have watched more film....Abreu could actually have peaked too, ol Bob Hamilin example


Its really not a debate, its been a proven model for decades now.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

You said Trout would not be in his prime for 3-4 years. Now you change that stance?

Btw, thanks for answering my question, lol. You are so in love with Trout you can't even admit someone had a better year than him.

No I said a player prime is around 27.

Yet you actually got so confused in your moronic argument you actually made a case for Trout(and Pujols) being so good that they started at 20 in their primes and continue with that for a decade!!!

You are so in love with Abreu you lack anything formulating a rational thought or any sort of baseball knowledge. And you sure as shit don't use any support to wild claims.

 

[pumpkinhead33793]

Abreu is good, very good but he is already in his prime. Trout is still about 4 seasons from his prime. Which is quite literally fucking scary.

Here you straight up said he was 4 years from his prime, NOT that he was already in his prime. When you say this, it implies you think he will still significantly improve from now till 27. What you really should have said was "Trout is already in his prime at 23, and since the average prime age starts at 27, he probably is gonna continue to be in his prime for the next decade, like Pujols demonstrated. And since Abreu is at an age of 27 already, his body won't develop any further and his physical attributes are already in its prime. He should continue to get better for a year or two though as he gains more experience while still in the same prime years." That is what you should have said.

All of this is moot anyway. The fact of the matter is Abreu had a spectacular rookie season and it is not unreasonable to think that he, and Trout could be the best hitters in the game the next few years with Trout lasting even longer because of being a few years younger.

Are we done?

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Here you straight up said he was 4 years from his prime, NOT that he was already in his prime. When you say this, it implies you think he will still significantly improve from now till 27. What you really should have said was "Trout is already in his prime at 23, and since the average prime age starts at 27, he probably is gonna continue to be in his prime for the next decade, like Pujols demonstrated. And since Abreu is at an age of 27 already, his body won't develop any further and his physical attributes are already in its prime. He should continue to get better for a year or two though as he gains more experience while still in the same prime years." That is what you should have said.

All of this is moot anyway. The fact of the matter is Abreu had a spectacular rookie season and it is not unreasonable to think that he, and Trout could be the best hitters in the game the next few years with Trout lasting even longer because of being a few years younger.

Are we done?

I said if we are going to play by your logic then Trout would be in his prime now and it would extend for another 7 years. Which further proved my point of Trouts longevity of greatness. Abreu has 3 years.

Sure we can be done. Since everyone on here agreed Abreu had a great season. Just no one agreed he is young or quite the best.

 

[Indrid Cold]

I suspect that Abreu will end up being the next Cecil Fielder...Big Daddy had his breakout season at age 26 upon returning from Japan, hit 51 HRs and nearly slugged .600 when that kind of wasn't happening. Fielder was easily a good enough hitter to play in the majors before leaving for Japan, but he was up against a far more fit Fred McGriff with the Jays and the team was wary of his conditioning in general.
Fielder was an effective power hitter for several more seasons, but never matched his big year and more or less got a little worse every season. Cecil's last season as a starter came at 32 and he was done at 35. Of course, Fielder was also a giant man and a terrible first baseman.
Maybe Abreu will surprise me again...I didn't think he'd be this good in '14. I agree with most of the posts here that comparing him to Trout as a "young" hitter is a mistake.

 

[pumpkinhead33793]

Yup, that one poster was right. If I said best NEW hitter, people wouldn't have gone apeshit over a technicality. Oh well.

 

[HammerDown]

 

[cezero]

...If I said best NEW hitter, people wouldn't have gone apeshit over a technicality....

well, yeah.

describing him as a young hitter was 100% inaccurate.

describing him as a new hitter would have been 100% accurate.

no technicality, bro. just pure wrongness.

 

[HammerDown]

 

[Rock Strongo]

keep an eye on mookie

 

[navamind]

Lmao

 

[navamind]

2015-18:

Abreu: .289/.346/.500, 130 OPS+
Trout: .308/.435/.596, 183 OPS+

Trout's also had a higher OPS+ in three of his last four seasons (2015, 2017, 2018) than Abreu's rookie season (173). He was one point short in 2016 (172).

 

[Pure Steel]

The Japanese league is arguably on par with our league. The Dominican league is not on that level. Also Ichiro improved substantially from his rookie year.

Classic....