In state talent

[DCWV4life]

The Charleston Gazette | Mitch Vingle: State football recruiting and WVU

Like what I am hearing...

 

[Slaton10]

It has always been a mystery to me why Wv can't produce at least 12 D-1 kids every year...forget about the small state BS...I am talking 12 kids!!!

 

[MI Nightmare]

It's not quite WV, but St. Clairsville produced your new transfer in Michael Ferns. That kid should be a stud LB and I'm hearing better things about his younger bro.

 

[DCWV4life]

It has always been a mystery to me why Wv can't produce at least 12 D-1 kids every year...forget about the small state BS...I am talking 12 kids!!!

I think it is a combination of factors:

Small state equals small schools equals athletes playing multiple sports....being a athlete is not a problem, but being a player on the Div 1 level requires a lot of commitment and focus on the craft.

Knowledgeable coaches... I was lucky enough to coach a youth team in Florida....this was a team of 11-13 players...on our coaching staff (7 coaches) 6 had played on the Div 1 level. WV youth are not exposed to that kind of knowledge until they attend camps which is usually only once a year. Also the strength training to help build them up is lacking at most of the schools, strength and conditioning is looked at as running hills and maybe a couple of bench presses. There is a science to it that most are never exposed.

Facilities and equipment...small schools equal small budgets....some of the training facilities in high schools in Ohio, Virginia, Maryland, and PA are on a college level...bet only a handful in WV can say that.

Talent level...The top players in WV do not face top talent most weeks...watch some of these games televised on ESPN. There are Div 1 players on both sides of the ball going head to head. Gives coaches a better idea of what this player is going to do in a couple of years facing the same players.

Exposure...Since there is a lack of top notch talent there are not many big times games for these players to showcase themselves. Coaches are not making trips to see most of these guys play, they watch them on tape and that is about it.

WV is not a football state on the high school level. Football is seasonal in the mountain state. August through November. In other states they have spring ball and then most of the kids participate in some sort of travel (no pads) team. Not to mention they have been doing this since they were tykes. They are more advanced and knowledgeable about the game than athletes coming out of WV.

12 does not seem like a lot to ask, but I think there is a lot to overcome for athletes coming out of this state.

 

[Anotherwvufan]

It has always been a mystery to me why Wv can't produce at least 12 D-1 kids every year...forget about the small state BS...I am talking 12 kids!!!

Scout only lists 5 kids as tops in WV. 3 have Div 1 scholarships. I am sure that there is more talent under the radar, we just need to look deeper

 

[Slaton10]

I think it is a combination of factors:

Small state equals small schools equals athletes playing multiple sports....being a athlete is not a problem, but being a player on the Div 1 level requires a lot of commitment and focus on the craft.

Knowledgeable coaches... I was lucky enough to coach a youth team in Florida....this was a team of 11-13 players...on our coaching staff (7 coaches) 6 had played on the Div 1 level. WV youth are not exposed to that kind of knowledge until they attend camps which is usually only once a year. Also the strength training to help build them up is lacking at most of the schools, strength and conditioning is looked at as running hills and maybe a couple of bench presses. There is a science to it that most are never exposed.

Facilities and equipment...small schools equal small budgets....some of the training facilities in high schools in Ohio, Virginia, Maryland, and PA are on a college level...bet only a handful in WV can say that.

Talent level...The top players in WV do not face top talent most weeks...watch some of these games televised on ESPN. There are Div 1 players on both sides of the ball going head to head. Gives coaches a better idea of what this player is going to do in a couple of years facing the same players.

Exposure...Since there is a lack of top notch talent there are not many big times games for these players to showcase themselves. Coaches are not making trips to see most of these guys play, they watch them on tape and that is about it.

WV is not a football state on the high school level. Football is seasonal in the mountain state. August through November. In other states they have spring ball and then most of the kids participate in some sort of travel (no pads) team. Not to mention they have been doing this since they were tykes. They are more advanced and knowledgeable about the game than athletes coming out of WV.

12 does not seem like a lot to ask, but I think there is a lot to overcome for athletes coming out of this state.

DCW I am buying partially what your sellling...but what you have messaged looks just the same as it did when I played 100 years ago!!...things must have improved a little bit..especially off season training...back in 1927 all we did was sit around and wait for summer practice..these kids these days no matter where they live have a much improved off season training...which you would think would produce bigger and possibly better athletes.......as far as the talent level...I don't know I just watched the Maryland High School Championships and kids from AA schools had D-1 scholarships..remember Dunbar home of William Crest and Tavon AWESOME is AA..and Wv own Wes Tonkery is from Bridgeport a AA school

 

[DCWV4life]

DCW I am buying partially what your sellling...but what you have messaged looks just the same as it did when I played 100 years ago!!...things must have improved a little bit..especially off season training...back in 1927 all we did was sit around and wait for summer practice..these kids these days no matter where they live have a much improved off season training...which you would think would produce bigger and possibly better athletes.......as far as the talent level...I don't know I just watched the Maryland High School Championships and kids from AA schools had D-1 scholarships..remember Dunbar home of William Crest and Tavon AWESOME is AA..and Wv own Wes Tonkery is from Bridgeport a AA school

Your comparing the schedule and talent of atheletes crest and Tavon played to Bridegport?

And I bet training has not changed that much state wide... Well the proof is in the numbers...

 

[DCWV4life]

Its not only WV

The Best Football Prospect Nobody Has Ever Heard Of | Bleacher Report

 

[bbwvfan]

New Mexico sounds a lot like WV in terms of recruiting.

When I was a kid, there was a high school QB in Grafton, WV who was pretty good… but, nobody was interested in him because he was doing things in AA/AAA.

So… he left his senior year to play football in San Antonio, TX in order to help get some notice. He ended up being a four year starter for Pitt… and played a while as a back up in the NFL.

Alex Van Pelt…

 

[DCWV4life]

BB what was that kids name from Nitro that did that for baseball, ended up as a back up for WVU for a bit? JR House I think.

my post is just my opinion of the situation having been involved in these sports in WV and other states and comparing the two. I feel that the average athlete in most states is exposed to a lot more of the things that make better players than they are in WV. Most of the players that come out of WV do it on god given talent, there is not (or one that I know of) a football factory like there are in most other states. There is not a coach that just keeps developing these young players into college material year in and year out...even what the state considers the best programs...Martinsburg, Parkersburg, Bridgeport, Moorefield etc etc are not churning out Div1 player after Div1 player.

Besides Randy Moss can you think of many players who have made a huge splash in the college game from WV in recent years? Hell we are going on 20 for Randy.

 

[Slaton10]

Your comparing the schedule and talent of atheletes crest and Tavon played to Bridegport?

And I bet training has not changed that much state wide... Well the proof is in the numbers...

I am to some degree..the inner city schools have absolutley no athletic budget and very view resources...and the talent level in the Baltimore area is really just average ...most of the better athletes are playing Soccer, Lacrosse, Swimming or hoops.. which brings up another point about Wv kids...there really isn't any other sports competing for thier time like it is around here in DC...

 

[Slaton10]

BB what was that kids name from Nitro that did that for baseball, ended up as a back up for WVU for a bit? JR House I think.

my post is just my opinion of the situation having been involved in these sports in WV and other states and comparing the two. I feel that the average athlete in most states is exposed to a lot more of the things that make better players than they are in WV. Most of the players that come out of WV do it on god given talent, there is not (or one that I know of) a football factory like there are in most other states. There is not a coach that just keeps developing these young players into college material year in and year out...even what the state considers the best programs...Martinsburg, Parkersburg, Bridgeport, Moorefield etc etc are not churning out Div1 player after Div1 player.

Besides Randy Moss can you think of many players who have made a huge splash in the college game from WV in recent years? Hell we are going on 20 for Randy.

Ryan Switzer UNC- GW

One of the most electrifying players in college football with his ability to return punts and make defenders miss • Tied the NCAA record with five punt return touchdowns last year and is now just three shy of the career mark held by Texas Tech's Wes Welker and Oklahoma's Antonio Perkins • Became the first Carolina true freshman to earn first-team All-America honors in 2013.

2014 - Sophomore Season
All-America return man became a consistent weapon in the passing game as a sophomore • Appeared in all 12 games and started eight at wide receiver, finishing with team highs of 55 catches and 703 yards • Scored four receiving touchdowns and also threw a touchdown pass at East Carolina •

 

[Slaton10]

Add Jerry Kelly out of Fairmont made a splash at BC before getting hurt........

 

[bbwvfan]

BB what was that kids name from Nitro that did that for baseball, ended up as a back up for WVU for a bit? JR House I think.

my post is just my opinion of the situation having been involved in these sports in WV and other states and comparing the two. I feel that the average athlete in most states is exposed to a lot more of the things that make better players than they are in WV. Most of the players that come out of WV do it on god given talent, there is not (or one that I know of) a football factory like there are in most other states. There is not a coach that just keeps developing these young players into college material year in and year out...even what the state considers the best programs...Martinsburg, Parkersburg, Bridgeport, Moorefield etc etc are not churning out Div1 player after Div1 player.

Besides Randy Moss can you think of many players who have made a huge splash in the college game from WV in recent years? Hell we are going on 20 for Randy.

There has been some recent discussion about the changes in scholastic sports and development of kids on other boards and radio sports talk shows the past couple of years.

I no longer live in WV, but my parents still live in Motown. MHS has been pretty solid at developing Division 1 football players. They have a football program, and the kids seem to have bought in to the work necessary to make them the best player they can be.

Since Morgantown is home to WVU… a lot of former players come back to town to make a living. Pro Performance is a private company that provides year round training for athletes… and it can be very sport specific.

Unfortunately, it appears a kid is forced to make a commitment to a sport… and specifically train for that sport to gain a competitive edge. To go along with that… a kid needs exposure. They have to be seen by the right people. In football… the scouts for Rivals… 24/7 and Scout… hold their own camps to evaluate kids. There are national 7 on 7 tourneys. College football coaches no longer have to do much leg work.

It is no different in other sports. For kids to get recognition in basketball… they have to play AAU… they have to earn national rankings in recruiting sites. These sites base their rankings on how a kid looks in AAU. Baseball requires kids to play travel baseball. They have to play in national tournaments and showcases in front of scouts and assistant coaches. No different in lacrosse… soccer… field hockey.

And, if you don't have the money to pay for personal training… pay for private coaches…. pay for travel… pay for camps… your kid is not going to be noticed.

Unless the kid is a freak. Like Randy Moss…

Sorry for the long post. But, I am currently involved in this process with my children. One is a really good field hockey player and the other a pretty good baseball player. And, I have been given the road map to a college schollly for both. And, it don't come cheap….

 

[DCWV4life]

Ryan Switzer UNC- GW

One of the most electrifying players in college football with his ability to return punts and make defenders miss • Tied the NCAA record with five punt return touchdowns last year and is now just three shy of the career mark held by Texas Tech's Wes Welker and Oklahoma's Antonio Perkins • Became the first Carolina true freshman to earn first-team All-America honors in 2013.

2014 - Sophomore Season
All-America return man became a consistent weapon in the passing game as a sophomore • Appeared in all 12 games and started eight at wide receiver, finishing with team highs of 55 catches and 703 yards • Scored four receiving touchdowns and also threw a touchdown pass at East Carolina •

I think we view splash a little different....Moss was a game changer and IMO would have been apart of a championship team no matter where he played...

While Switzer is a good player....he does not dominate the game. UNC is a mere 13-13 in his two seasons. Look at his drop off from year one to two in the return game. My point being players like Moss bring attention to the area, players like Switzer are more of a nice surprise when it comes to turning heads for recruiters to look to WV. Switzer is only a couple more grabs better than Jordan Thompson stat wise.

Just my humble opinion

 

[DCWV4life]

Interesting stat for this conversation:

85% of the players in the Super Bowl Sunday were 3 star guys or below coming out of High School

I think it is very telling....player drive is totally underestimated(and hard to measure) in the evaluation process.

 

[Slaton10]

I think we view splash a little different....Moss was a game changer and IMO would have been apart of a championship team no matter where he played...

While Switzer is a good player....he does not dominate the game. UNC is a mere 13-13 in his two seasons. Look at his drop off from year one to two in the return game. My point being players like Moss bring attention to the area, players like Switzer are more of a nice surprise when it comes to turning heads for recruiters to look to WV. Switzer is only a couple more grabs better than Jordan Thompson stat wise.

Just my humble opinion

I guess I am looking at it from a D-1 caliber kid...not a 5 star.... So back to my original Comment and be clearer ...if Wv could produce twelve 3 star kids a year that would be a program difference maker...

 

[DCWV4life]

I guess I am looking at it from a D-1 caliber kid...not a 5 star.... So back to my original Comment and be clearer ...if Wv could produce twelve 3 star kids a year that would be a program difference maker...

If they had more 5 star guys the 3 star guys would get noticed is my point.

Example Moss got Howard a scholly at ND.

 

[DCWV4life]

@JonathanKMartin: I wouldn’t be shocked to see 3/4 West Virginia boys in #WVU’s class of 2016. Lots of talent in this state coming up.

Here you go

 

[GoldRusher]

Most of my opinions on this have been covered already by DC and bb but I would add economics to the equation as well. bb is spot on about the year round circuit in all sports now, schools want to get a return on investment with their scholarships, they want talent, that happens to be highly skilled in one area and with experience, preferably vs like talent.

Most don't understand just how poor the state is. For a lot of in state residents, making the circuits all over the places where the combines and camps ect. are held is out of the question because they simply cant afford it. Not to mention even travel back and forth to their own high schools for "voluntary workouts" ect.. many of the high schools have consolidated through the years and its a haul for many kids to even get to school once in a day, much less twice or find a way home if they stay late ect.

I do agree with DC about the state overall though. IMO a few schools in state seem to be upping their game when it comes to development as far as spring football and upgrading their programs and again JMO I think we may begin to see some of those 3* type of kids come down the pike a lil more often. I like what I've been seeing in the Kanawha valley as far as the future goes. Capital HS, South Charleston HS and George Washington HS and Martinsburg up in the panhandle is doing a good job too.

Another problem is travel. A coach has limited time when it comes to contacting kids and creating and maintaining relationships with HS coaches. If a coach in Morgantown wants to go see a recruit in certain parts of southern WV he could be looking at a possible 4-6 hour trip one way in a car depending on where the kid lives. Compare that to a 1-3 hour drive into PA and the Pittsburgh area and better populated areas and schools ect.. and its a no brainer, gotta do what you gotta do, you wont go south unless the kid is an absolute freak and a no doubt D1 talent.