Griff to Roberts Film Breakdown

[Darrell Green Fan]

OK, so lets keep playing. I will grant you that MOST coaches coming off a 3-13 season would get fired. How ever I dont conceed the whole RG3 is light years above other QBs in situations like that. Simply put, aside from his rookie year which was stellar in an offense tailored to his skill set, what has he done?? Last year he was average. And yes I know I know, he was injured. But again I will say if he was to hurt to play effectively, should he have been playing at all?? Right now he looks average, and by average I mean Jason Campbell average. I agree with j_y, at some point we need to see the skills set that made him special, or a dramatic improvement in the skill set he is trying to master. But to say well he earned the right to be unquestioned start this year because of what he showed two seasons ago in an entirely different passing offense is a stretch.

If he was "average" then how would you describe Troy Aikman's first 2 seasons? Please show me where Akili Smith, Andre Ware, Blaine Gabbert or a hundred other QBs on bad teams ever showed any success in the NFL. If you can't concede that Griffin's resume is not even close to those then I don't know what to say.

Around and around we go huh?

 

[Sharkinva]

If he was "average" then how would you describe Troy Aikman's first 2 seasons?

Around and around we go huh?

Again, you want to compare him to hall of fame QBs. But fact is around 70% of drafted Qbs taken in the top ten fail. Aikman had a different skill set and EVEN with his below average stats his first two years, on trait i have seen in alot of BAD QBs that you didnt see in Aikman was a tendency to hang onto the ball to long or be late with throws.

If he continues to wait until he see's the WR as open, we will continue to see contested balls, sacks and other sundry issues that we dont or didnt see in the Qbs you want to compare him to. Im fine with looking at just him and his body of work in total. Compare him to the QB community at large and NOt try and cherry pick and say well this guy or that guy struggled and they stuck with him and look how that turned out. Because for every Aikman there ARE 5 Gabberts.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Again, you want to compare him to hall of fame QBs. But fact is around 70% of drafted Qbs taken in the top ten fail. Aikman had a different skill set and EVEN with his below average stats his first two years, on trait i have seen in alot of BAD QBs that you didnt see in Aikman was a tendency to hang onto the ball to long or be late with throws.

If he continues to wait until he see's the WR as open, we will continue to see contested balls, sacks and other sundry issues that we dont or didnt see in the Qbs you want to compare him to. Im fine with looking at just him and his body of work in total. Compare him to the QB community at large and NOt try and cherry pick and say well this guy or that guy struggled and they stuck with him and look how that turned out. Because for every Aikman there ARE 5 Gabberts.

Again the point continues to be passing judgement after year 2, or even year 3, is an overreaction, especially when the backup has not realy shown to be worthy of an open competition. Still waiting for your response about the other teams passing on Cousins.

I can replace Aikman with a dozen other QBs who struggled early, then learned to play the position. I'm sure with 36 INTs in 2 years Cowboy fans were questioning his ability to read defenses, that's kind of an important part of playing QB. How is failing to read a defense a lot different than Griffin's habit of holding the ball too long? Both can be changed with experience. Will it happen? Who knows? But I do know I'm willing to give it time to find out. xcuse in an attempt to dismiss the success Griffin has had. Blaine Gabbert has not come close to this sort of success, again apples and telephone poles.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

I am just not meant to post on a board with a 5 minute limit on edits.

What I was trying to say at the end was saying Griffin's only success was in a gimmick offense is another excuse to diminish his performance. At least he has had success, great success. This was never the case with Gabbert, he showed nothing from day one. Again 2 totally different situations.

 

[Sharkinva]

Again the point continues to be passing judgement after year 2, or even year 3, is an overreaction, especially when the backup has not realy shown to be worthy of an open competition. Still waiting for your response about the other teams passing on Cousins.

I can replace Aikman with a dozen other QBs who struggled early, then learned to play the position. I'm sure with 36 INTs in 2 years Cowboy fans were questioning his ability to read defenses, that's kind of an important part of playing QB. How is failing to read a defense a lot different than Griffin's habit of holding the ball too long? Both can be changed with experience. Will it happen? Who knows? But I do know I'm willing to give it time to find out.

And i could replace him with twice as many Qbs that came in with great fanfare and never really got it. You say the backup never did anything to warrant an open competition. And i say griffin does not warrant being named unquestioned starter. Mark Sanchez went to the AFC title game his first two years, and look at where he is now. And i actually thought Sanchez could transition to being a good QB in the NFL. I had my questions on RG3 from the moment it was mentioned we would try and get him. And nothing he has done, including his rookie season has changed my opinion of that.

 

[j_y19]

Me thinks someone is a little sensitive this morning.

naw, Dad is always like this

 

[Sportster 72]

Again the point continues to be passing judgement after year 2, or even year 3, is an overreaction, especially when the backup has not realy shown to be worthy of an open competition. Still waiting for your response about the other teams passing on Cousins.

I can replace Aikman with a dozen other QBs who struggled early, then learned to play the position. I'm sure with 36 INTs in 2 years Cowboy fans were questioning his ability to read defenses, that's kind of an important part of playing QB. How is failing to read a defense a lot different than Griffin's habit of holding the ball too long? Both can be changed with experience. Will it happen? Who knows? But I do know I'm willing to give it time to find out. xcuse in an attempt to dismiss the success Griffin has had. Blaine Gabbert has not come close to this sort of success, again apples and telephone poles.

Once again the defense of Griffin is made with the backup has proven in 4 games that he is not worthy to start.

How many teams passed on Tom Brady? I know it isn't the rule but ... just saying.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

And i could replace him with twice as many Qbs that came in with great fanfare and never really got it. You say the backup never did anything to warrant an open competition. And i say griffin does not warrant being named unquestioned starter. Mark Sanchez went to the AFC title game his first two years, and look at where he is now. And i actually thought Sanchez could transition to being a good QB in the NFL. I had my questions on RG3 from the moment it was mentioned we would try and get him. And nothing he has done, including his rookie season has changed my opinion of that.

You said the other day you were fine with the idea of trading up for a franchise QB, just not this QB. Who did you have in mind? Luck wsa not possible, the target was clearly RGIII once the trade was made, and Tennehill did not require a trade up.

 

[Sharkinva]

You said the other day you were fine with the idea of trading up for a franchise QB, just not this QB. Who did you have in mind? Luck wsa not possible, the target was clearly RGIII once the trade was made, and Tennehill did not require a trade up.

Now you get it. I dont think he is a franchise QB. I dont think he will be an elite QB. And I thought then and still think now we would have been better off not making the trade and drafting Tannehill. I would have been fine with making this move for Bradford or Sanchez (which I admit in hind site would have ALSO been a mistake). But long term I think the whole push for Rg3 was a mistake, and even in spite of his rookie season, that opinion really hasnt changed for me.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Yeah I was really high on Bradford, not so with Sanchez. But again Tannehill would not have required a trade up. Did I read that post incorrectly? Me? I was not hitching my wagon to a converted WR playing QB. He has performed better than I expected but again let's not get ahead of ourselves on Ryan Tannehill.

My team dared to be great. I admire them for having the guts to make this trade and not settling for a QB with a lower ceiling. I'll back the idea even if RGiII turns into Vince Young.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Once again the defense of Griffin is made with the backup has proven in 4 games that he is not worthy to start.

How many teams passed on Tom Brady? I know it isn't the rule but ... just saying.

No what I've said repeatedly is that Kirk has not earned the right to an open competition let alone the starting job as you are implying here. You are asking a lot of your team. You are asking, just one year removed from a spectacular rookie season, to put the guy you have invested so much of your future in to be put on the bench in favor of his backup, a guy who really hasn't done much in limited action. Teams simply do not make this dramatic of a move very often for obvious reasons.

Tom Brady gave the Pats a reason, he played great and the starter was an aging and ineffective Drew Bledsoe. Tony Romo gave the Cowboys a reason, he was tremendous in limited play and it didn't take much to replace again Drew Bledsoe who was now 4 years older. This is nothing like those situations. There is no logical reason, other than frustrated fans, to start Kirk Cousins or to even put him in an open competition any time soon with a QB starting his third season just one year removed from Offensive Rookie of the Year. He simply has not given them a reason to make such a dramatic and probably irreversible move (see Cutler in Denver).

 

[Sharkinva]

Yeah I was really high on Bradford, not so with Sanchez. But again Tannehill would not have required a trade up. Did I read that post incorrectly? Me? I was not hitching my wagon to a converted WR playing QB. He has performed better than I expected but again let's not get ahead of ourselves on Ryan Tannehill.

My team dared to be great. I admire them for having the guts to make this trade and not settling for a QB with a lower ceiling. I'll back the idea even if RGiII turns into Vince Young.

I read exactly what you said. I think you miss my point. I dont think we should have traded up for griffin. I would have been fine staying put and taking tannehill. And I think as a team we would be in better shape had we made that move instead. With the extra three picks, we could have addressed O-line, Safety, CB or a litany of other options. See my opinion of griffin didnt change because we DARED to be great. I thought he was going to be a mistake from the moment we made the trad, and NOTHING he has done to this point has changed that opinion.

 

[skinsdad62]

No what I've said repeatedly is that Kirk has not earned the right to an open competition let alone the starting job as you are implying here. You are asking a lot of your team. You are asking, just one year removed from a spectacular rookie season, to put the guy you have invested so much of your future in to be put on the bench in favor of his backup, a guy who really hasn't done much in limited action. Teams simply do not make this dramatic of a move very often for obvious reasons.

Tom Brady gave the Pats a reason, he played great and the starter was an aging and ineffective Drew Bledsoe. Tony Romo gave the Cowboys a reason, he was tremendous in limited play and it didn't take much to replace again Drew Bledsoe who was now 4 years older. This is nothing like those situations. There is no logical reason, other than frustrated fans, to start Kirk Cousins or to even put him in an open competition any time soon with a QB starting his third season just one year removed from Offensive Rookie of the Year. He simply has not given them a reason to make such a dramatic and probably irreversible move (see Cutler in Denver).

DGF , they dont get that , brady came in when asked and seized the opportunity . KC did not ,now that doesnt mean i think he sucks . all i have been saying is he wasnt all that great while he was in .

as for the Rg3 trade , i was against it also because it is against my principles to do that . i would have been perfectly happy with trading down for extra picks and taking tannehill with a good o/line and some weapons around him

i also give the pick 3 years to work out not 1 and a 1/2 (maybe ) .

you watch DGF , if Rg3 goes out and performs well the detractors wont give him any credit and if he plays poorly they will be all over him

been that way around here for years

the thing i argue is the tend to buy into the negative way before they believe the positive

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

It's not just here, this board is a pretty good reflection of the Redskins fan base. There is probably 20-30% very vocal group who are done with Griffin and fit the description you have posted above. A large group that are in the "I'm concerned" category and despite my posts that's where I am.

 

[Sportster 72]

I am not asking anything of my team. I am not asking that Cousins start. I was just commenting on how often those who support Griffin almost blindly have to attack Cousins to support their position. As far as earning a right to compete in all my years of football you earn that when you try out for the team. It doesn't mean there aren't politics that keep you that right but the guy started one game in his first year that he won, while also bringing the team back to win the Baltiimore game. So you are basing your opinion on three games at the end of a 3-10 season.

I don't know what we don't get for not following the Soylent Green theory of he is our QB so we won't critique him. I watched several QBs play today that had more pocket presence. Please note I did not say they were better, I am just commenting on their pocket presence.

I believe I have been advocating the same thing as dad, this kid needs to play to his skills and they are not the skills of a pocket QB. He shouldn't be replaced by Cousins. Yes Kirk has way more presence in the pocket but Griffin has done nothing in one week to be replaced. I said yesterday I think that his coach needs to help him out. It is a learning process for both.

As a fan and since this is a forum I reserve the right to critique, Griffin, Snyder, Allen or any other member of the team. If that makes me one of "them" I can live with that.