Expectations For 2025

[BigKen]

We all have ideas about what should be done and how we think that things should be done to turn the NE Patriots around in 2025.

Now comes the really difficult thing. What do you honestly expect that the Krafts will do in 2025 to begin to turn this aircraft carrier into the wind so that it can launch aircraft. Or do you honestly believe that as long as Robert Kraft is steering it, that this team will never have a jet launch from it again?

What are your true expectations for next season?

 

[BigKen]

I don't expect the Kraft Hierarchy to move away from their comfort zone.

They will do the legal interviews and then they will offer Mike Vrabel the HC position.
I expect that Vrabel will instill much, much more discipline.
I expect that Vrabel will make a real effort tostrip the OL position clean of the dead weight and dead heads.
I expect that Vrabel will make an effort to bring in a real #1 WR at any cost.
I expect Vrabel will force Wolfe to deal Milton III for an extra 2025 first round draft pick and use it to draft a young edge.
I expect Vrabel to force Wolfe to spend the Cap Space in a waythat will create problems in the front office and Wolfe will be told that he's the Personnel Guy and not the GM.

I expect to see the Patriots win at least twice as many games in 2025 and possibly sneak into a wild card slot.

BUT, BIG BUT, Vrabel must get Josh McDaniels back to Foxboro as his OC, unless he has a real surprise to clean up the mess.

 

[cdumler7]

I don't expect the Kraft Hierarchy to move away from their comfort zone.

They will do the legal interviews and then they will offer Mike Vrabel the HC position.
I expect that Vrabel will instill much, much more discipline.
I expect that Vrabel will make a real effort tostrip the OL position clean of the dead weight and dead heads.
I expect that Vrabel will make an effort to bring in a real #1 WR at any cost.
I expect Vrabel will force Wolfe to deal Milton III for an extra 2025 first round draft pick and use it to draft a young edge.
I expect Vrabel to force Wolfe to spend the Cap Space in a waythat will create problems in the front office and Wolfe will be told that he's the Personnel Guy and not the GM.

I expect to see the Patriots win at least twice as many games in 2025 and possibly sneak into a wild card slot.

BUT, BIG BUT, Vrabel must get Josh McDaniels back to Foxboro as his OC, unless he has a real surprise to clean up the mess.

I would say if you could get anything above a 4th round pick for Milton you should be counting your lucky stars some team fell for the 1-game sample size against backups. You don't go from a 6th round pick the year before to a 1st round pick the next year based on 1 good game.

 

[BigKen]

You don't go from a 6th round pick the year before to a 1st round pick the next year based on 1 good game.

Unless you have a starving partner in the deal who can't draft an NFL level QB where they sit.
That and you refuse to deal him for anything less. Right now, the Giants are rowing a 16 foot dingy with one oar.

 

[YankeeRebel]

I would say if you could get anything above a 4th round pick for Milton you should be counting your lucky stars some team fell for the 1-game sample size against backups. You don't go from a 6th round pick the year before to a 1st round pick the next year based on 1 good game.

I cannot see more than a 4th either. The sample size on him is to small. He looked great against Buffs 3rd stringers not exactly compelling proof he warrants more than a 4th

 

[cdumler7]

Unless you have a starving partner in the deal who can't draft an NFL level QB where they sit.
That and you refuse to deal him for anything less. Right now, the Giants are rowing a 16 foot dingy with one oar.

I get that some NFL teams get desperate especially at the QB position, but that is a major leap from 6th round pick to 1st round pick the very next year all based off one good game against a team that didn't care whether they won or lost. I don't think NFL teams are that crazy. Throw in this might be one of the better FA classes of QB's that we have seen in a while. Darnold, Wilson, Fields. Geno Smith is rumored to be available for a trade. Wouldn't shock me to see Cousins and Rodgers cut so could give a team a year gap while they work to find their guy. Derek Carr is expected to get cut. So why would you trade your 1st when you can just go sign one of those guys and keep your 1st?

I could see a team contacting the Patriots and offering say a 4th round pick for him. And you are right Patriots can refuse that deal and decide he is worth more as a cheap backup for the next few years. Honestly with today's NFL you need a quality backup that can come in and not have the ship crash just because the starter is out for a few weeks.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

I would say if you could get anything above a 4th round pick for Milton you should be counting your lucky stars some team fell for the 1-game sample size against backups. You don't go from a 6th round pick the year before to a 1st round pick the next year based on 1 good game.

That was the topic on my 104.5 The Zone ride to work this morning, who should the Titans get as QB with the #1 pick.

All three talking heads agreed.




Joe Milton III.

 

[YankeeRebel]

That was the topic on my 104.5 The Zone ride to work this morning, who should the Titans get as QB with the #1 pick.

All three talking heads agreed.




Joe Milton III.

So the local talking heads picked the local kid?

If the team was really that interested and we have know way of knowing. Milton plus the number 4 pick in exchange for the number 1 pick. Pick up Jackson Dart or Will Howard late

 

[Yankee Traveler]

So the local talking heads picked the local kid?

If the team was really that interested and we have know way of knowing. Milton plus the number 4 pick in exchange for the number 1 pick. Pick up Jackson Dart or Will Howard late

Well, He's from FL, so he's local to you I guess...?

Just sharing.
I'm not saying he is good, great, bad, that the Titans would entertain offering up there first, a fourth or should sit on their hands.
Just sharing the local talking heads...not Titans Insiders...ran through the attributes of every FA and potential FA QB, and then one said Milton.
Then they all agreed that they thought he would be the best QB for TN.

My reaction was Fuck you, you can't have him, but you know, 1) not my decision and 2) everything has a price.

Milton plus #4 for #1 doesn't feel like a great deal though.

 

[cdumler7]

So the local talking heads picked the local kid?

If the team was really that interested and we have know way of knowing. Milton plus the number 4 pick in exchange for the number 1 pick. Pick up Jackson Dart or Will Howard late

That would mean we are talking about the 12th pick in the draft value wise by making that trade for Milton. Yeah sorry Milton is not worth the 12th overall pick. I could see in the 2nd round an exchange of picks of 35 for 38 and Milton. That would be closer to the actual value a team would give up.

 

[cdumler7]

That was the topic on my 104.5 The Zone ride to work this morning, who should the Titans get as QB with the #1 pick.

All three talking heads agreed.




Joe Milton III.

To me the smarter move would be sign Sam Darnold then try to package the #1 overall pick to get draft capital to surround him with talent and move back a few spots then take someone of value outside of the QB position. That to me makes a ton more sense as we have seen an entire season of what Darnold can look like and it is a top-10 type QB.

 

[YankeeRebel]

That would mean we are talking about the 12th pick in the draft value wise by making that trade for Milton. Yeah sorry Milton is not worth the 12th overall pick. I could see in the 2nd round an exchange of picks of 35 for 38 and Milton. That would be closer to the actual value a team would give up.

I don't think you are looking at this correctly.

1. I said if that's what the Titans want. If they do, if they think he is their QB of the future you are getting a starting QB and the #4 pick in the draft. That is more than okay, if they feel that way.

2. Never listen to the talking heads

 

[nefansince75]

Milton plus #4 for #1 doesn't feel like a great deal though.

Milton + round 2 pick #4 seems more like it. You really need to think about who the Pats want versus who will be available at 4. There's a chance Hunter is there at 4, but any tackle they want will be there at 4 too. So why waste Milton on probably very little gain in value?

 

[cdumler7]

I don't think you are looking at this correctly.

1. I said if that's what the Titans want. If they do, if they think he is their QB of the future you are getting a starting QB and the #4 pick in the draft. That is more than okay, if they feel that way.

2. Never listen to the talking heads

My issue is that what the Titans would be giving up value wise in that situation is equal to the 12th overall pick. So the Titans would have to decide is Milton really worth the 12th overall pick to drop from 1 to 4? Couldn't they just as easily say trade with the Giants who are looking for QB help and get their 1st, 2nd, and say 4th round pick then trade Milton and pick 3 for Patriots and pick 4? Even moving from pick 3 to pick 4 is a 2nd round pick in value.

I just think some here are overvaluing what the NFL will think of Milton. I have no doubt they got some phone calls but I have a hard time believing even the Patriots were saying hey we are not trading him unless you give us your 1st round pick. My bet would be Patriots start with a 3rd and the teams calling offer a 5th and they meet in the middle with a 4th if he is actually traded.

 

[nefansince75]

My issue is that what the Titans would be giving up value wise in that situation is equal to the 12th overall pick. So the Titans would have to decide is Milton really worth the 12th overall pick to drop from 1 to 4? Couldn't they just as easily say trade with the Giants who are looking for QB help and get their 1st, 2nd, and say 4th round pick then trade Milton and pick 3 for Patriots and pick 4? Even moving from pick 3 to pick 4 is a 2nd round pick in value.

I just think some here are overvaluing what the NFL will think of Milton. I have no doubt they got some phone calls but I have a hard time believing even the Patriots were saying hey we are not trading him unless you give us your 1st round pick. My bet would be Patriots start with a 3rd and the teams calling offer a 5th and they meet in the middle with a 4th if he is actually traded.

You are reading too deeply into the situation. Nobody was saying he's worth any first round pick in an ordinary year. But a draft without much top level QB talent isn't a usual year. A lot of us remember Rohan Davy and the popular thought he'd be traded for a low first. I haven't put a lot of stock in backups since.

I guess the feeling on Davy was probably based on experienceing tb12. While lightning does strike, good luck predicting where.

Back to Milton, he looked valuable enough to keep unless something ridicules is offered. A trade up a couple slots when the player we want is probably at 4 makes little sense.

 

[cdumler7]

You are reading too deeply into the situation. Nobody was saying he's worth any first round pick in an ordinary year. But a draft without much top level QB talent isn't a usual year. A lot of us remember Rohan Davy and the popular thought he'd be traded for a low first. I haven't put a lot of stock in backups since.

I guess the feeling on Davy was probably based on experienceing tb12. While lightning does strike, good luck predicting where.

Back to Milton, he looked valuable enough to keep unless something ridicules is offered. A trade up a couple slots when the player we want is probably at 4 makes little sense.

You are right this is not a great QB draft. This is however a great FA QB market. So my guess is those teams that cannot get one of the top-2 guys will turn more towards a FA option to be a 2-year bridge. And those evaluations that teams had of Milton that led to him falling clear to the 6th round hasn't been erased because he had one good game against backups.

So while I do think the Patriots can get more for him than what they gave to get him, I don't think that value increases clear to say the 12th pick in the draft level. I could see a team that misses out on QB in FA and the draft then say day 2 get desperate and trade a 3rd round pick to get him. I'll eat my crow if I am wrong on this, but I just don't think we have ever seen a guy taken in the 6th then after one season or especially after one game then become that big of a trade asset.

 

[YankeeRebel]

My issue is that what the Titans would be giving up value wise in that situation is equal to the 12th overall pick. So the Titans would have to decide is Milton really worth the 12th overall pick to drop from 1 to 4? Couldn't they just as easily say trade with the Giants who are looking for QB help and get their 1st, 2nd, and say 4th round pick then trade Milton and pick 3 for Patriots and pick 4? Even moving from pick 3 to pick 4 is a 2nd round pick in value.

I just think some here are overvaluing what the NFL will think of Milton. I have no doubt they got some phone calls but I have a hard time believing even the Patriots were saying hey we are not trading him unless you give us your 1st round pick. My bet would be Patriots start with a 3rd and the teams calling offer a 5th and they meet in the middle with a 4th if he is actually traded.

I agree that some are over valuing Milton based on a small sampling. But again it all depends on the Titans and what they think. Personally I don't think they have interest in him, I think a lot of this is media fodder

 

[nefansince75]

You are right this is not a great QB draft. This is however a great FA QB market. So my guess is those teams that cannot get one of the top-2 guys will turn more towards a FA option to be a 2-year bridge. And those evaluations that teams had of Milton that led to him falling clear to the 6th round hasn't been erased because he had one good game against backups.

So while I do think the Patriots can get more for him than what they gave to get him, I don't think that value increases clear to say the 12th pick in the draft level. I could see a team that misses out on QB in FA and the draft then say day 2 get desperate and trade a 3rd round pick to get him. I'll eat my crow if I am wrong on this, but I just don't think we have ever seen a guy taken in the 6th then after one season or especially after one game then become that big of a trade asset.

All true but your initial comments were judging this board for over valuing Milton based on statements made in Tennessee. The statements here i took as rhetorical responses and not that Milton was now a top of the draft talent. My take on trading him to go from 4 to 1 are only about not seeing good value. The point system 1800 going to 3000 just doesn't pass the scratch and sniff test. A good backup has good value.too.

Let's face it, succeeding the way Milton did wasn't as impressive as it appeared, but he put some really nice stuff on tape. Strong arm, great elusiveness, a size that will pull through a lot of grasping arms, as well as some good decisions and high rate of completions. Sure thing? No.

As far as FAs go.... They come with crippling salaries. Also, bridge QBs are a bridge to mediocrity. A good enough one keeps you winning enough to ruin draft position. At least young QBs don't break the bank.

 

[BigKen]

Back to expectations.

Kraft said yesterday that Wolfe and (forgot his name already) will be involved in the search for the new HC.

Media is already in a panic because they feel that Wolfe will not recommend anyone who wants to have final say on personnel that will be signed.

Again, it's as if Kraft doesn't want to expose himself to any more possible negative press in his quest to see himself in the HOF. That is, he doesn't want to be inducted post mortem.

I expect that Johnathan will get involved and Mike Vrabel will be offered the job before the MNF is over.

 

[YankeeRebel]

Back to expectations.

Kraft said yesterday that Wolfe and (forgot his name already) will be involved in the search for the new HC.

Media is already in a panic because they feel that Wolfe will not recommend anyone who wants to have final say on personnel that will be signed.

Again, it's as if Kraft doesn't want to expose himself to any more possible negative press in his quest to see himself in the HOF. That is, he doesn't want to be inducted post mortem.

I expect that Johnathan will get involved and Mike Vrabel will be offered the job before the MNF is over.

Coaches do not count against cap space, so if the Pats want Vrabel, then make him an offer he cannot refuse. The Kraft's act as if they are tired of losing and they say all the right things to the media, but actions speak louder than words. Let's see actions and stop with speeches