Doug Farrar: Russell Wilson No Better Than .500 QB On Indy & What This Means For RGIII

[redskinsfan]

russell wilson is a career 63.4 % passer he has 72 tds and 26 ints and his rating is 98.6 and he has a shade under 10,000 yds . pedestrian my ass

I was talking about his stats last year. Look at those. Near the bottom of the league in attempts, yards, and TD passes. Like I said, the best comparison he's got is with Alex Smith.

And answer the question Farrar and I have posed before: how would Wilson do if he played in Indy? If you think he'd be anything more than a .500 QB struggling to keep his job, you'd be fooling yourself. If Wilson doesn't have help around him, he's very, very pedestrian.

 

[skinsdad62]

I was talking about his stats last year. Look at those. Near the bottom of the league in attempts, yards, and TD passes. Like I said, the best comparison he's got is with Alex Smith.

And answer the question Farrar and I have posed before: how would Wilson do if he played in Indy? If you think he'd be anything more than a .500 QB struggling to keep his job, you'd be fooling yourself. If Wilson doesn't have help around him, he's very, very pedestrian.

you cant cherry pick the stats you want , and alex smith had no where near the numbers this kid has put up

 

[redskinsfan]

you cant cherry pick the stats you want , and alex smith had no where near the numbers this kid has put up

It is hardly cherry picking. His 2014 stats represent the result of a regressive career arc. How do you view someone that averages 217 yards per game and 20 TDs as anything but, at most, pedestrian. And when I use the term "pedestrian" I'm being kind. Those stats aren't just bad, they are Redskins QB bad.

But setting aside the numbers, respond to Farrar's question as to how Wilson would do playing in Indianapolis? His answer was he'd be, at best, a .500 QB. And the reason for that is simple: Wilson is the product of a system that surrounds him with a wealth of talent. Without that talent, he's basically Brian Hoyer.

I don't want to hazard a guess as to what's holding up Wilson's contract talks, but I might suppose that Seattle is thinking something of the same thing. They may be trying to strike a Kap-like deal which obligates the team for the first couple of years but provides them an escape hatch afterwards. Why? Because Kap is simply a product of the Niners system. So too is Wilson. And his numbers starkly bear that out.

 

[skinsdad62]

really well i dont see it that way . he is doing what he is asked and has shown he can pass with the best of them over the totality of his career

 

[redskinsfan]

really well i dont see it that way . he is doing what he is asked and has shown he can pass with the best of them over the totality of his career

You can say the same for QBs like Jason Campbell. He did what the Redskins asked. The question you have to ask yourself is why, in an era that's so passer friendly, the Seahawks didn't ask Wilson to pass more. The answer can be expressed this way: if a QB can pass, a team will ask him to pass; if a QB can't pass, they'll look elsewhere. Wilson fits the latter. He's good at what he's asked to do. But he's not asked to do a whole lot as a passer.

If you doubt this, ponder the hypothetical previously posed above: how would Wilson do if he was asked to win games for the Colts, who've got no o-line, no running game, no receivers, no defense, and, outside of Vinatieri, no special teams?

 

[skinsdad62]

You can say the same for QBs like Jason Campbell. He did what the Redskins asked. The question you have to ask yourself is why, in an era that's so passer friendly, the Seahawks didn't ask Wilson to pass more. The answer can be expressed this way: if a QB can pass, a team will ask him to pass; if a QB can't pass, they'll look elsewhere. Wilson fits the latter. He's good at what he's asked to do. But he's not asked to do a whole lot as a passer.

If you doubt this, ponder the hypothetical previously posed above: how would Wilson do if he was asked to win games for the Colts, who've got no o-line, no running game, no receivers, no defense, and, outside of Vinatieri, no special teams?

could be that the wrs corp and te's are subpar

and i dont buy the andrew luck mantra . he has/had better wrs the seatle and tes

and RW isnt JC by a long shot

 

[redskinsfan]

The JC comparison was simply to illustrate a point you made, not to make a comparison between the two.

And please don't tell me that you believe Wilson's supporting cast is anywhere near Luck's. I might concede that both have about the same WR and TEs. But what about everything else Wilson has that Luck doesn't? If Wilson is on the Colts or on the current version of the disintegrating Niners, he'd be lucky to keep his job. If Luck played on the Seahawks, he might be on the verge of setting some NFL passing records that may never be broken.

 

[skinsdad62]

The JC comparison was simply to illustrate a point you made, not to make a comparison between the two.

And please don't tell me that you believe Wilson's supporting cast is anywhere near Luck's. I might concede that both have about the same WR and TEs. But what about everything else Wilson has that Luck doesn't? If Wilson is on the Colts or on the current version of the disintegrating Niners, he'd be lucky to keep his job. If Luck played on the Seahawks, he might be on the verge of setting some NFL passing records that may never be broken.

no way to know that because wilson has other skills you dismiss

 

[redskinsfan]

Like what? The key point you're missing is that production is a reflection of a player's skillset. Look at what Luck did with virtually nothing. And then take a look at what Wilson did with things like a Hall of Fame running back and a championship caliber difference. Like I said, if he really was as great as you think he is, he'd do much better than 27th in passing yards, TDs, and attempts. There's a reason why his numbers are near dead last and Luck's are near the top.

I'd invite you to listen to what Doug Farrar had to say on this issue. He's a respect SI writer and a Seattle resident that's followed Wilson's career.

 

[skinsdad62]

i could care less what he has to say on it the numbers are in , he has been to 2 superbowls and made big plays .
the debate is useless

 

[skinsdad62]

Russell Wilson NFL Football Statistics | Pro-Football-Reference.com

here are his numbers . he is top ten in almost all categories

 

[redskinsfan]

i could care less what he has to say on it the numbers are in , he has been to 2 superbowls and made big plays .
the debate is useless

Apart from shining on a respected and knowledgeable commentator like Farrar, the 'winner' argument is a big loser too. The issue you keep missing is one of causation: why did Seatlle win? Answer: not because of Wilson's passing. If Superbowls are a proxy of QB prowess, I guess people like Trent Dilfer are 'winners' over others like Jim Kelly and Dan Marino who've won zip. And Wilson was lucky to have gotten into his second Superbowl. He single handle looked like he was on the Packer payroll for most of the NFC Championship game.

Those numbers you've cited hardly support your view. The guy hasn't passed for anything more than 217 yards per game in his career. How is that Top 10 in anything? If you want numbers, check this out. NFL Leaders - ESPN They show that Seattle finished 27th in passing yards in 2014 whereas the three stiffs we had for QBs finished 11th overall and outpassed him by about 600 yards.

More fundamentally, you keep ducking the question of what record Wilson would have if he played in Indy. If you respond with anything above .500, you're not being too honest.

 

[skinsdad62]

Apart from shining on a respected and knowledgeable commentator like Farrar, the 'winner' argument is a big loser too. The issue you keep missing is one of causation: why did Seatlle win? Answer: not because of Wilson's passing. If Superbowls are a proxy of QB prowess, I guess people like Trent Dilfer are 'winners' over others like Jim Kelly and Dan Marino who've won zip. And Wilson was lucky to have gotten into his second Superbowl. He single handle looked like he was on the Packer payroll for most of the NFC Championship game.

Those numbers you've cited hardly support your view. The guy hasn't passed for anything more than 217 yards per game in his career. How is that Top 10 in anything? If you want numbers, check this out. NFL Leaders - ESPN They show that Seattle finished 27th in passing yards in 2014 whereas the three stiffs we had for QBs finished 11th overall and outpassed him by about 600 yards.

More fundamentally, you keep ducking the question of what record Wilson would have if he played in Indy. If you respond with anything above .500, you're not being too honest.

he made plays to get them there period

 

[redskinsfan]

he made plays to get them there period

So did the kicker Hauschka. The amount and type of plays are the key. For that, look to Marshawn Lynch and that defense.

We can keep going around and around, but the numbers you cite and other evidence you offer only strengthen the side of the debate I'm advocating.

I'll ask one more time: what would the Colts record be if Wilson had been QB there? You can avoid answering it, and I won't ask anymore. If you do, please be honest.

 

[skinsdad62]

So did the kicker Hauschka. The amount and type of plays are the key. For that, look to Marshawn Lynch and that defense.

We can keep going around and around, but the numbers you cite and other evidence you offer only strengthen the side of the debate I'm advocating.

I'll ask one more time: what would the Colts record be if Wilson had been QB there? You can avoid answering it, and I won't ask anymore. If you do, please be honest.

well we might as well call it a day you arent changing my mind in the least and i am not changing yours

 

[redskinsfan]

well we might as well call it a day you arent changing my mind in the least and i am not changing yours

Yeah, but no answer to that question?

 

[skinsdad62]

my opinion the same

 

[redskinsfan]

You never gave a numerical answer. I'll give you mine: Wilson gets about six wins with Indy and loses his job to a journeyman vet QB like Matt Hasselbeck. Indy then starts looking for a new QB in the draft.

 

[skinsdad62]

You never gave a numerical answer. I'll give you mine: Wilson gets about six wins with Indy and loses his job to a journeyman vet QB like Matt Hasselbeck. Indy then starts looking for a new QB in the draft.

the same means he would win as much as luck would because wilson is a good qb

 

[redskinsfan]

the same means he would win as much as luck would because wilson is a good qb

You're probably the only one that believes that. If you're trying to compare Luck vs. Wilson, there's ZERO comparison to be made. Wilson would probably be benched by now. Do you really believe he'd throw for close to 4800 yards and 40 TDs and lead a team to 11 wins?