cousin market 17 -20 mill range

[SoCalWizFan]

The Skins have wasted a shit ton of time, energy and resources on multiple positions over the last decade not just QB. They kept FG kicker John Hall around for 5 games into his fourth season with the Skins. And that was after he missed 8 games in his 2nd season and 6 games in his 3rd. They made 2 for 1 trades for two RBs, Portis and TJ Duckett, a DE, Jason Taylor, and a LB, Rocky McIntosh. They drafted 2 safeties with the top 6 pk and the top 5 pk in the draft and signed another to a then NFL record setting deal for safeties all within 4 years.

And sure, it would be nice to go into a season being set at QB free of the turmoil that's accompanied the position the last couple years. Be even nicer if it wasn't in stop-gap for a couples years mode.

No reason for it to be a stop gap & all of the things that you mentioned above should provide us with major encouragement since the Redskins finally have a competent FO.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

BTW - drafting one of those safeties with the #5 pick was one of the few good things that the previous regime actually did!! They could not foresee the tragedy that would subsequently occur.

 

[Breed]

Dude, he is completing about 70% of his passes. In fact had the WRs caught just half of the 8 drops in the Pats game, he would have completed.. stick with me here... 70% of his passes in that game.

67.9% placing him fourth in the NFL in that category. But his 6.8 YPA only ranks 25th in the league and that's with the huge bump of 13 YPA after the Saints game.

Matt Jones is the first Redskins player to have a 100 yard receiving game this year. And looking at some box scores, of Jones' 131 yards. 135 is accounted as YAC.

 

[Sportster 72]

When does YAC not count? How many 40 yard in the air passes did you seen to Jerry Rice from Young and Montana. It's the West Coast Offense. That is how it works. Why are people trying to put square peg in a round hole?

 

[Breed]

BTW - drafting one of those safeties with the #5 pick was one of the few good things that the previous regime actually did!! They could not foresee the tragedy that would subsequently occur.

I realize that. Making the drafting of Landry and the AA signing completely asinine.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

I realize that. Making the drafting of Landry and the AA signing completely asinine.

Top 20 of Vinny Cerrato's Worst Personnel Moves - Fanspeak Washington Redskins Blog

Chalk it all up to one Vinny Cerrato - IMO worst GM ever to go along with Spurrier probably being worst coach ever. BTW - the AA signing was horrible regardless of what they already had at this position.

All of this again should provide us with tremendous hope since this team has the first actual legit GM in probably over 20 years. Should be fun.

 

[Breed]

When does YAC not count? How many 40 yard in the air passes did you seen to Jerry Rice from Young and Montana. It's the West Coast Offense. That is how it works. Why are people trying to put square peg in a round hole?

It has nothing to do with pegs and holes. Almost every team in the NFL employs some variation of the west coast or a get the ball out quick with short passes passing game. And the ideal way the west coast is supposed to work is hitting WRs in stride with short passes giving them the opportunity to pick up yards after catch. KC's 6.8 ypa is an indication that isn't happening. That in turn calls his impressive looking comp % into question.

 

[Breed]

Top 20 of Vinny Cerrato's Worst Personnel Moves - Fanspeak Washington Redskins Blog

Chalk it all up to one Vinny Cerrato - IMO worst GM ever to go along with Spurrier probably being worst coach ever. BTW - the AA signing was horrible regardless of what they already had at this position.

All of this again should provide us with tremendous hope since this team has the first actual legit GM in probably over 20 years. Should be fun.

I'm neither a Vinny fan or a Vinny apologist, but imo there's quite a few Gibbs 2.0 moves on that list being attributed to Vinny.

 

[Stymietee]

To me there has to be some sort of compromise in this. How about a contract that is more cap friendly? a bit of guaranteed money (signing, roster and or bonus totaling that 17-20 mil) , annual salary in the 5-7 million range with performance escalators. I'm still not sold on KC, but hell, for what he's being asked to do or not do, that has to be a factor in negotiations.

 

[skinsdad62]

Misquoting me again DAD. I said if you offer a contract today, because that is how that convo started, it should be for 5 mil per season. I said, I expect it to be 8-10 mil after the season because I don't expect him to go at his current rate. If he plays better...obviously more.

There are not as many teams looking for questionable QBs in FA as in the past bc of the rookie cap. To pay KC 17 mil/season is insane unless he takes us to the playoffs and continues at his current rate. If he does...I am all for 17 mil per season.

i believe i said staring point which pretty much covers what you said

 

[Sportster 72]

It has nothing to do with pegs and holes. Almost every team in the NFL employs some variation of the west coast or a get the ball out quick with short passes passing game. And the ideal way the west coast is supposed to work is hitting WRs in stride with short passes giving them the opportunity to pick up yards after catch. KC's 6.8 ypa is an that isn't happening. That in turn calls his impressive looking comp % into question.

I guess I am lost. You were commenting that Jones 131 yards of Jones 135 yards was YAC. Could be I didn't understand your post. That 6.8 ypa can't be design? Are you 100% sure that his high completion percentage vs. YPA is because he is off target? I think you would need to detail that to prove it is fact. Then too all of us see what we want to see. I see a guy who has been improving which as a fan is want I want to see. Is he the long time answer? We'll see at the end of the year how things stack up. There is still a lot of room for growth but Cousins has been saying that too.

 

[skinsdad62]

i have always been of the philosophy of , if you dont have a franchise qb that you need one , however since there hasnt been any that we have been in position to draft (right place right time right guy ) then you need to add talent elsewhere .

our previous regimes failed at this in FA and through the draft

we have a new GM . he should be able to spot a good qb ,

in the meantime we can use an avg guy like KC

depending on what ranking system you use he typically falls anywhere between 13 and 18 . or simply avg.

he is on pace for 4000 yd season 25 tds and 16 ints . what is that worth ?

 

[Sportster 72]

That would exceed my hopes for the beginning of the year in regards to Cousins. I was hoping for 3500-4000 yards, 20 TDs, 15 INTs. Pretty close to what you forecast dad.

I am not ready to predict his final level. He only has 18 starts. Maybe we saw his high water mark last week. He does have two come from behind wins. I like that. His teammates like and that is a good sign. I think it is all about the TOs. If he can keep them at an acceptable level I don't know what there isn't too like.

 

[skinsdad62]

That would exceed my hopes for the beginning of the year in regards to Cousins. I was hoping for 3500-4000 yards, 20 TDs, 15 INTs. Pretty close to what you forecast dad.

I am not ready to predict his final level. He only has 18 starts. Maybe we saw his high water mark last week. He does have two come from behind wins. I like that. His teammates like and that is a good sign. I think it is all about the TOs. If he can keep them at an acceptable level I don't know what there isn't too like.

well that is only a projection and projections are what they are . a scientific wild ass guess

 

[Breed]

I guess I am lost. You were commenting that Jones 131 yards of Jones 135 yards was YAC. Could be I didn't understand your post. That 6.8 ypa can't be design? Are you 100% sure that his high completion percentage vs. YPA is because he is off target? I think you would need to detail that to prove it is fact. Then too all of us see what we want to see. I see a guy who has been improving which as a fan is want I want to see. Is he the long time answer? We'll see at the end of the year how things stack up. There is still a lot of room for growth but Cousins has been saying that too.

If the 131yards/135yac is accurate it just means Jones was beyond the LOS during some or all of his receptions. Which in and of itself is no biggie. Except that its taken more than half a season for the Skins to have their first 100+ yards pass catcher and its a RB. And Jackson not playing for the first 8 games doesn't explain it all away.

You talk about how hard Garcon might be to replace. At present his receiving stats are as follows
On 67 targets he has 43 catches/4.7 catches per game
430 rec yards/10 yards per catch/47.8 yards per game
3 TDs/26 first downs/36 yards is his longest pass play of the season thus far

Far as catches and receiving yards go he is the Skins leader this year. I think that's pretty pathetic personally. And maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see those stats as being all that difficult to replace as their fairly pedestrian for a #2 or #3 WR. For a guy in the #1 WR spot that's fairly shitty production. You spoke of Garcon's blocking being an asset to his game and I won't disagree with that. He doesn't block that well to out n out dismiss those receiving stats.

KC's YPA ties directly into all of the WR's ypc metric.

And if someone were to opine that now that Djax is back the passing game will improve marginally or even considerably. I'd opine that depending on the level of improvement. Maybe it should be Djax and not Cousins who we're discussing making 17 to 20 mill a year.

As for thinking if KC's 6.8 ypa is by design. I guess I could be, but as it puts him in the bottom fourth of the league I'm gonna say I don't think so. And I didn't say KC's 6.8 ypa is w/o question due to him being off-target. I said it calls his impressive looking comp % into question.

Or look at it like this. These are the top QBs by comp % in the NFL. 2015 NFL Passing Statistics | The Football Database KC ranks an impressive looking 4th in the league in this category.

But looking at the top QBs by YPA. 2015 NFL Passing Statistics | The Football Database He plummets to 25th in the league, or put another way, of the comp% leaders, KC takes the biggest drop-off when it comes to ypa.

Pros n Cons when it comes to the metrics used to measure a QB by.
Which Metric Matters Most When Evaluating NFL QBs?

"It's not pretty and it neglects sacks, but if you were to stack quarterbacks up by yards per attempt, you'd be closer to their real value than you'd find in stats like win-loss record, yardage, passer rating and completion percentage," said Football Outsiders assistant editor Rivers McCown. "All of those stats have a degree of context where scheme and teammates matter, but yards per attempt less so than others."

 

[Breed]

Shark,

I've been wanting to say this all day now. Another legitimate possibility for KC's ypa. Play calling. How many times have you seen the Skins in a 3rd n long and not a single WR, TE, or RB, runs a pattern that can gain a first down by just catching a pass. To gain the first gain they have to catch the pass and then make some YAC.

Maybe its me, but the Skins seem to run a lot of plays similar to the above.

And truthfully, I think Cousins throws a pretty decent mid-range ball 10-20 yards. As well as a pretty decent deep ball 30-35+ yards. So I'm not saying w/o doubt its on Cousins or its his accuracy that's the main reason for his ypa. Maybe its Gruden trying to protect him. Which I can understand to an extent, but if over-protection is taking place. It stunts both your QB and the offense's ability to hit on big plays and have quick scoring drives among other things. Everything becomes kinda trudging downfield.

 

[Sportster 72]

If the 131yards/135yac is accurate it just means Jones was beyond the LOS during some or all of his receptions. Which in and of itself is no biggie. Except that its taken more than half a season for the Skins to have their first 100+ yards pass catcher and its a RB. And Jackson not playing for the first 8 games doesn't explain it all away.

You talk about how hard Garcon might be to replace. At present his receiving stats are as follows
On 67 targets he has 43 catches/4.7 catches per game
430 rec yards/10 yards per catch/47.8 yards per game
3 TDs/26 first downs/36 yards is his longest pass play of the season thus far

Far as catches and receiving yards go he is the Skins leader this year. I think that's pretty pathetic personally. And maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see those stats as being all that difficult to replace as their fairly pedestrian for a #2 or #3 WR. For a guy in the #1 WR spot that's fairly shitty production. You spoke of Garcon's blocking being an asset to his game and I won't disagree with that. He doesn't block that well to out n out dismiss those receiving stats.

KC's YPA ties directly into all of the WR's ypc metric.

And if someone were to opine that now that Djax is back the passing game will improve marginally or even considerably. I'd opine that depending on the level of improvement. Maybe it should be Djax and not Cousins who we're discussing making 17 to 20 mill a year.

As for thinking if KC's 6.8 ypa is by design. I guess I could be, but as it puts him in the bottom fourth of the league I'm gonna say I don't think so. And I didn't say KC's 6.8 ypa is w/o question due to him being off-target. I said it calls his impressive looking comp % into question.

Or look at it like this. These are the top QBs by comp % in the NFL. 2015 NFL Passing Statistics | The Football Database KC ranks an impressive looking 4th in the league in this category.

But looking at the top QBs by YPA. 2015 NFL Passing Statistics | The Football Database He plummets to 25th in the league, or put another way, of the comp% leaders, KC takes the biggest drop-off when it comes to ypa.

Pros n Cons when it comes to the metrics used to measure a QB by.
Which Metric Matters Most When Evaluating NFL QBs?

Lots of ways to play with numbers. He is 14th in yards, 11th in attempts. Tied with two or three guys at 6.8 yards. He is 167 yards below 7.3 ypa. He could have most of the back just in drops against NE or with a healthy Jackson for 7 games. Is it reasonable to think that he can get an extra 300 yards total for the season with DJax there. I would certainly think so. Like I said everyone has an opinion. The kid is learning that is the important thing. He has brought them from behind to win twice. I expect this Sunday is going to be a tough game for him. I expect the news and forums to do a 180 if that happens. Like I have said all season the proof is in the pudding and the pudding isn't finished yet.

 

[dcrising]

KC is going to get a good deal if they let him walk. If he leads the team to the PO or damn close to it i can see a team giving him 17 mil a year.

 

[j_y19]

KC is going to get a good deal if they let him walk. If he leads the team to the PO or damn close to it i can see a team giving him 17 mil a year.

If he gets this team to the playoffs this year, we will give him 17M a year!

 

[j_y19]

Lots of ways to play with numbers. He is 14th in yards, 11th in attempts. Tied with two or three guys at 6.8 yards. He is 167 yards below 7.3 ypa. He could have most of the back just in drops against NE or with a healthy Jackson for 7 games. Is it reasonable to think that he can get an extra 300 yards total for the season with DJax there. I would certainly think so. Like I said everyone has an opinion. The kid is learning that is the important thing. He has brought them from behind to win twice. I expect this Sunday is going to be a tough game for him. I expect the news and forums to do a 180 if that happens. Like I have said all season the proof is in the pudding and the pudding isn't finished yet.

You got that right. There is a subset of our fan base that is waiting for KC to make a blunder so they can proclaim him a back up at best. Most of these also believe RG3 got a raw deal. Unfortunately He will make some mistakes going forward, all QBs do. There is a real possibility that he will have another multiple INT game, maybe this week. But anyone looking at KC objectively has to admit that he is improving with more experience. I don't know where he tops out, but I don't believe we have seen the finished product yet.