cousin market 17 -20 mill range

[gkekoa]

The Jets, Likely the Browns as they are about to likely draft yet ANOTHER QB. The Bears if they were smart.

Now I ask you... name me a rookie QB who you really think its worth wasting the next three years, and some of our best players careers on. We wasted the careers of Chris Samuels, Stephen Davis and a few others trying to MAKE guys like Jason Campbell and Patrick Ramsey into QBs worth building around. I get it, Kirk might not be Arron Rogers, but in the grand scheme of things, an extra $10 million a year for a solid QB is worth a fuckton more than starting a rookie and once again likely looking at another rebuild in three years. At WORST if given time, I think Kirk develops into yes, another Andy Dalton. And realistically, even on a deal that averages $17 million a year.. much like Tannehill, the first two years will be well below that cap wise, and the team will make sure they have an out if he fails.

The other option is to waste half that on the next RG3. And i dont mean the player himself. I mean the contract. $17 million a year average over 4 years comes out to $68 million IF he performs. Reality is it will come out to $30 million if he flops. $20 million guaranteed, another $25 in salaries over the 4 years, and the rest in roster and performance incentives.

We paid $21 million for our last QB failure.

I didn't forget the Browns but right now they are looking at Johnny Football. he has looked good enough to take the starting job.

 

[gkekoa]

All that being said, to me its worth an Extra $9 million to not have to go through another rebuild in three years. Or worse, since I think we finish just well enough to be drafting a 2nd/3rd tier rookie QB and end up throwing him to the wolves because we were too CHEAP to keep a guy who is developing into a solid QB because he wasnt sexy enough.

Nothing to do with sexy. Flacco isn't sexy but is one of the best QBs in the league. He literally is playing with nothing now.

 

[Sharkinva]

Flynn was paid 10 mil per...what did I say my expectation for KC was?

The teams that are not in need of a QB won't likely draft one that high.

Flynn was paid $10 million a year 4 years ago.

4 years ago I could have gotten an I phone for $250-300... If I walked into Verizon right now and said I wanted an Iphone 6 ( MInd you not the top model, but a step below) for what i would have paid for an Iphone 5s 3 years ago, you think they would give me a break because my brother thinks thats all the 6 is worth??

Reality is, a STARTING QB in this league is going to go in the $14-20 Million dollar range next year. Supply and demand. Sure we can go after a rookie, but unless we totally tank, we wont be getting one of the top three. And if we do totally tank, Kirk wont be an option in any case.

 

[Sharkinva]

I mentioned the Jets. I doubt they would overpay KC when they still don't know what they have in Geno.

As for playing with the cap...why doesn't NE play with it like we do? Because it is stupid and doesn't work.

Actually what doesnt work is starting over every three years in search of the golden boy. We should have learned this already. The market is what it is, you either have a QB you are going to ride with, and you pay him as such ( Flacco, Tannehill, and a few others) Or you are drafting a new QB in the first rounds every 3-4 years ( See Browns, Redskins, and a few other teams).

 

[Sharkinva]

Nothing to do with sexy. Flacco isn't sexy but is one of the best QBs in the league. He literally is playing with nothing now.

You do realize over his career Flacco has thrown 3 TDs for every 2 INTs roughly right?? What saved him was the Defense.

 

[Sportster 72]

I have to tell you that I am loving this. Just a few weeks ago some were saying he is nothing more than a backup QB. Now folks are talking about how much it will cost to keep him.

I was not in favor of trading all those draft picks in 2012. I remember stopping in a restaurant next to the river in Occoquan to have lunch with my SO and her daughter. We walked out and I looked at my phone and saw the Skins drafted Cousins. I fist pumped. I said "YES, Shanahan knows he has to have an insurance policy."

It is not 100% that I was right on about Kirk but it sure is trending in that direction. We'll see, I am rooting for him. I'll also root for Griffin and his future. If this works out here for Kirk I believe Griffin will go else where but I will pull for the kid to turn it around.

We'll see ... I have been saying and will continue to say I am trusting in SM to make the decisions that need to be made. Most of all I want the Redskins to win more games than they have been. I like what I see this year although I think we need some more players but it seems the team is changing the mind set.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Here's a article from a cat who's very much in favor of signing Cousins. In fact the writer thinks it should be done right now. The writer, at least imo, uses at least one stat, comp %, in too much of a void. And just when you start to think, he's riding KC's jock like a fan-boy. He brings it back with an honest criticism of KC. He (the writer) thinks Cuz can be a top ten QB.

Why The Redskins Should Extend Kirk Cousins Today

Dave, do you know who this writer is and if so. What are your thoughts on him.

17 to 20 million......a year, at least imo, is too much to pay for KC at this point in time.

No I don't know him. And I agree, completion percentage is overblown in this offense of short passes. Hell like Eli sacks too when you are doing three step throws in 2 seconds. But like you said he does make some good points but I just don't see him ever being a top QB.

It's like this guys, they have no choice. As someone posted if they ket him go we back up another 2 years.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

No I don't know him. And I agree, completion percentage is overblown in this offense of short passes. Hell like Eli sacks too when you are doing three step throws in 2 seconds. But like you said he does make some good points but I just don't see him ever being a top QB.

It's like this guys, they have no choice. As someone posted if they ket him go we back up another 2 years.

As far as Cousins ever being a top QB I don't think that he really needs to ever get to this level (if you are talking about truly elite QBs like Brady & Rodgers). The only thing that matters is can he lead them to a high level of success on a consistent basis.

Consider the starting QBs of the last 4 SB champions. I certainly don't believe that Cousins will ever be at the level of Brady & probably not even Wilson (who has a unique skill set). However - I see no reason why he can't be as good as Eli or Flacco eventually. Also - as both of those guys have proven - you don't need to be lights out every week, every year - just when it counts. In a weird way the mistakes that Cousins has made early in his career may be a blessing in disguise & eventually make him a much better QB. Only time will tell.

 

[gkekoa]

You do realize over his career Flacco has thrown 3 TDs for every 2 INTs roughly right?? What saved him was the Defense.

I know but that is an overblown statistic without looking at circumstance. You brought up sexy...that is not a sexy stat. If you put him in NE, he would be very close to Brady.

 

[Sharkinva]

I know but that is an overblown statistic without looking at circumstance. You brought up sexy...that is not a sexy stat. If you put him in NE, he would be very close to Brady.

And if you let Cousins continue to develop, he will end up very close to Flacco or better I believe. And as i have said, the other options are.. a rookie and another thre years of saying just wait

Keep Griffin and waste another year down that road.

Or sing one of the FA QBs who have shown to be no better than Cousins.

$17 million appears to be about where the ball starts for a starting QB these days, $5-7 million for a GOOD backup.

 

[Breed]

As far as Cousins ever being a top QB I don't think that he really needs to ever get to this level (if you are talking about truly elite QBs like Brady & Rodgers). The only thing that matters is can he lead them to a high level of success on a consistent basis.

Consider the starting QBs of the last 4 SB champions. I certainly don't believe that Cousins will ever be at the level of Brady & probably not even Wilson (who has a unique skill set). However - I see no reason why he can't be as good as Eli or Flacco eventually. Also - as both of those guys have proven - you don't need to be lights out every week, every year - just when it counts. In a weird way the mistakes that Cousins has made early in his career may be a blessing in disguise & eventually make him a much better QB. Only time will tell.

The above statements seem to be in conflict with one another.

To your point though about hitting when it counts. I can't recall the circumstances of Eli's situation too well, but I do recall Flacco's situation. I'm not a Flacco fan, but yeah, he certainly hit when it counted. What he's done in the last 2.5 years since his big playoff run in 2012, both stat-wise and W/L-wise 20-21 including 2-7 this year, and will have made the playoffs once going 1-1 in the 2014 postseason. Isn't all that impressive to me.

Now could the Ravens have done worse in the last 2.5 years had they not paid Flacco? Most certainly and they very likely would've w/o him, but are we (the Skins fans here at SportsHoopla) Looking at the Skins giving Cousins 17-20 mill a year just to be a middle of the pack team and hoping that maybe one year Cuz gets hot at the perfect time. As opposed to likely staying a near bottom tier team if they don't sign him?

If that's the case, scenario #1 is preferable, but damn. That just makes the Skins an NFL version of a half-ass decent western conference NBA team. With a slightly better chance to win a Super Bowl than a real WC NBA team has at winning an NBA title.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

I've always hated the Flacco/Eli argument. As discussed a million times they are the exceptions, how many others not named Robert Horey have made a habit of being average and then lighting it up in the playoffs? You can count them on the hand of Three Finger Brown.

I've never demanded you need a QB the level of Brady. There are a dozen QBs in this league I believe are good enough to be considered franchise QBs, QBs who don't need everything perfect around them in order to have big time success. And I don't consider one and done in the playoffs to be success.

 

[Sharkinva]

The above statements seem to be in conflict with one another.

To your point though about hitting when it counts. I can't recall the circumstances of Eli's situation too well, but I do recall Flacco's situation. I'm not a Flacco fan, but yeah, he certainly hit when it counted. What he's done in the last 2.5 years since his big playoff run in 2012, both stat-wise and W/L-wise 20-21 including 2-7 this year, and will have made the playoffs once going 1-1 in the 2014 postseason. Isn't all that impressive to me.

Now could the Ravens have done worse in the last 2.5 years had they not paid Flacco? Most certainly and they very likely would've w/o him, but are we (the Skins fans here at SportsHoopla) Looking at the Skins giving Cousins 17-20 mill a year just to be a middle of the pack team and hoping that maybe one year Cuz gets hot at the perfect time. As opposed to likely staying a near bottom tier team if they don't sign him?

If that's the case, scenario #1 is preferable, but damn. That just makes the Skins an NFL version of a half-ass decent western conference NBA team. With a slightly better chance to win a Super Bowl than a real WC NBA team has at winning an NBA title.

Have to disagree. Keeping Cousins, even if he just turns out to be middle of the road, allows us to concentrate on fixing OTHER areas of the team over the next 3-4 years. Because lets be real here, we have burned a shit ton of time, energy and resources over the past 15 years trying to find a franchise QB. Mean while we have ignored until recently, the O-line, Pass Rush, Secondary... fuck I might even say we ignored the Water Boy position because we traded HIM away for rights to a QB.

I for one would be glad knowing we are going into the 2016 offseason without having to contemplate the question

Should we draft a QB with our first pick and/or should we try and trade up for (insert name of next messiah here)

SO again if Kirk shows consistently more good than bad, and improvement over the next seven games.... I have ZERO issues with him getting paid like an NFL starter.

On the flip, if he reverts to struggling more than improving.... it becomes a moot point.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

I've always hated the Flacco/Eli argument. As discussed a million times they are the exceptions, how many others not named Robert Horey have made a habit of being average and then lighting it up in the playoffs? You can count them on the hand of Three Finger Brown.

I've never demanded you need a QB the level of Brady. There are a dozen QBs in this league I believe are good enough to be considered franchise QBs, QBs who don't need everything perfect around them in order to have big time success. And I don't consider one and done in the playoffs to be success.

Disagree. Also - Eli has done it twice. If the Redskins simply spend the majority of time looking for the perfect QB they will likely fail. Remember - if there are say 4 QBs drafted in the 1st round next draft it is very likely that at least 3 (if not all 4) will never become elite. Happens just about every year.

Are you actually maintaining that Cousins needs everything to be perfect to succeed? That was not my pt at all. I am just stating that he doesn't have to be elite - huge difference. I never said that Eli was a game manager - there is a middle ground. Oh well - doesn't matter since none of us are actually making decisions for the Redskins.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Disagree. Also - Eli has done it twice. If the Redskins simply spend the majority of time looking for the perfect QB they will likely fail. Remember - if there are say 4 QBs drafted in the 1st round next draft it is very likely that at least 3 (if not all 4) will never become elite. Happens just about every year.

Are you actually maintaining that Cousins needs everything to be perfect to succeed? That was not my pt at all. I am just stating that he doesn't have to be elite - huge difference. I never said that Eli was a game manager - there is a middle ground. Oh well - doesn't matter since none of us are actually making decisions for the Redskins.

As I said I don't think you need an elite QB. There are a dozen QBs in the league that I feel can be good enough. I'm not sure I see our boy ever getting to that level but hey there's always hope.

 

[Sharkinva]

As I said I don't think you need an elite QB. There are a dozen QBs in the league that I feel can be good enough. I'm not sure I see our boy ever getting to that level but hey there's always hope.

So let me ask?? Why not?? The big knock on Kirk has been, well he tends to throw picks at bad times. But apparently he has done a better job at that. Even if you throw out the Saints game, he did pretty good against a good Patriots defense, on the road. He doesnt tend to take needless sacks, and his accuracy, presnap reads and over all decision making is improving. DO I expect him to become one of the elites?? Nope. DO I think he will improve enough to make it where we dont have to worry about the annual do we need a QB thread?? Yep.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

So let me ask?? Why not?? The big knock on Kirk has been, well he tends to throw picks at bad times. But apparently he has done a better job at that. Even if you throw out the Saints game, he did pretty good against a good Patriots defense, on the road. He doesnt tend to take needless sacks, and his accuracy, presnap reads and over all decision making is improving. DO I expect him to become one of the elites?? Nope. DO I think he will improve enough to make it where we dont have to worry about the annual do we need a QB thread?? Yep.

I'm trying not to get too excited about the last game seeing as every QB who has played the Saints have collectively put up numbers better than Tom Brady this year. True story. He did OK against the Pats but not until garbage time although obviously the drops hurt.

I think Kirk's accuracy issues have yet to be resolved completely and until that happens he may not ever be good enough.

 

[Sharkinva]

Dude, he is completing about 70% of his passes. In fact had the WRs caught just half of the 8 drops in the Pats game, he would have completed.. stick with me here... 70% of his passes in that game.

 

[Breed]

Have to disagree. Keeping Cousins, even if he just turns out to be middle of the road, allows us to concentrate on fixing OTHER areas of the team over the next 3-4 years. Because lets be real here, we have burned a shit ton of time, energy and resources over the past 15 years trying to find a franchise QB. Mean while we have ignored until recently, the O-line, Pass Rush, Secondary... fuck I might even say we ignored the Water Boy position because we traded HIM away for rights to a QB.

I for one would be glad knowing we are going into the 2016 offseason without having to contemplate the question

Should we draft a QB with our first pick and/or should we try and trade up for (insert name of next messiah here)

SO again if Kirk shows consistently more good than bad, and improvement over the next seven games.... I have ZERO issues with him getting paid like an NFL starter.

On the flip, if he reverts to struggling more than improving.... it becomes a moot point.

The Skins have wasted a shit ton of time, energy and resources on multiple positions over the last decade not just QB. They kept FG kicker John Hall around for 5 games into his fourth season with the Skins. And that was after he missed 8 games in his 2nd season and 6 games in his 3rd. They made 2 for 1 trades for two RBs, Portis and TJ Duckett, a DE, Jason Taylor, and a LB, Rocky McIntosh. They drafted 2 safeties with the top 6 pk and the top 5 pk in the draft and signed another to a then NFL record setting deal for safeties all within 4 years.

And sure, it would be nice to go into a season being set at QB free of the turmoil that's accompanied the position the last couple years. Be even nicer if it wasn't in stop-gap for a couples years mode.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Dude, he is completing about 70% of his passes. In fact had the WRs caught just half of the 8 drops in the Pats game, he would have completed.. stick with me here... 70% of his passes in that game.

Yep - trust me - as you may know - I have definitely not been a Cousins guy for the first part. However - you have to treat this situation exactly like you would for the folks making a case for RG3 (which as included me @ times). You have to ask are his problems correctable & is he showing signs of fixing his issues. It would definitely appear that there is major hope in this area.

Since the Jets game he has appeared to make major strides. The remainder of this season will be very telling. If Cousins plays well in the remainder of the games it is certainly no guarantee but should provide major hope & a reason to give him a good contract.