Cosell column on Smith's performance

[iHATEdodgers]

So as far as the blame game, is anyone else as pissed off at Dixon?

Haha. Ah man I dunno he's hardly been used probably shouldn't have been in there, I was hoping for some more imaginitive playcalling there.

 

[MW49ers5]

So as far as the blame game, is anyone else as pissed off at Dixon?

Ha ha ha...nah, mohawk is innocent of all charges...

 

[Crimsoncrew]

You just blamed him again so you are in fact blaming him for the loss. There's no regardless of Williams' mistakes, allowing the punt to deflect off his knee was an unforced error - a mental error, an error which this team was not known for and was not built to overcome - that was a killer in a closely fought defensive battle. No regardless by a long shot. Not many teams overcome that. Eli and the Giants wouldn't have been able to if the tables were reversed not in that game not even close. There may have been some regardlesses (Bradshaw fumble, non calls on holding, missed INT opportunities) but THAT was not one of them.

Smith couldn't do it in the 4th quarter?! (I seem to remember a game-tying FG drive) First of all that's blatantly ridiculous if I didn't know better I'd say you didn't follow the Niners. Smith and the Niners had 6 4th quarter comebacks this year 7 if you count the two comebacks they produced against the Saints just last fucking week in the muthatruckin playoffs. You cannot expect that out of your QB and team every single game. Secondly Smith wasn't alone out there on the field, the team as a whole couldn't come back after the unforced errors.

Like I said plenty of blame to go around what did I just list? Sure there were other factors in the loss, playcalling, personnel issues, a couple bad calls, a couple bad turns, a couple bad passes. Smith ain't perfect but blaming him for this loss is just fucking dumb... the Niners lost because they (meaning Williams) fucked up at the wrong time in the wrong game - which they hadn't done all season long. End of story.

Smith is largely to blame!? Holy mother. My last post evidently didn't sink in or you chose to ignore all the FACTS I pointed out. Were you watching the same game? Our receivers couldn't get open on a fucking empty plain dude. Why we weren't running the ball - like we ran it down the field to tie the game with a FG? Why the fuck Williams was in the same zipcode of that tumbling punt is what's ridiculous. Well that and blaming this loss solely or as you put it "significantly" on Smith.

When you say I am "blaming Smith" for the loss, I take it to mean that you think I believe he is solely to blame. I don't think anyone is solely to blame for the loss. If I had to point the finger at one person, it would be Kyle Williams. After that, I'd point at the coaching staff that still had Williams out there returning kicks after a risky return of a bouncing punt last week, a diving catch this week, and then a ball off his knee. But there is plenty of fault to go around, and Smith was a big part of an offense that couldn't get anything going.

I believe our defense dominated this game, and if the offense had played at even a mediocre level in the 4th quarter, we win the game. We didn't. In the final two full drives, Smith threw four incompletions and took a sack. I can't recall the exact details of the sack, but at least two of the incompletions should have been completed.

Smith did help to lead a game-tying drive, but he was helped out by a return that put the ball on our 45. He had a very good scramble in what was his third-best play of the game, but the drive petered out on NY's seven when Smith completed two of three for eight yards (his only passing yards of the drive).

I read your last post. I just think it's misguided. Smith had a tremendous game last week, basically winning it for us with some great passes. But he played pretty poorly in this one. I don't think many unbiased observers would disagree with that.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

So as far as the blame game, is anyone else as pissed off at Dixon?

I was mostly pissed off Dixon was in on that crucial third down. Gore would have picked it up IMO.

 

[MHSL82]

I'm not blaming Smith for the loss. Acting as if he didn't play a significant role in the loss is ridiculous, though. He completely fell apart in the 4th quarter. If the offense had managed to put together a single drive in the fourth quarter or OT, we in. Regardless of Williams' mistakes. We couldn't do it, and Smith is largely to blame.

I think you have enough credibility with me to give you the benefit of the doubt on all this. I still feel that with two more opportunities for drives, we might have gotten one to go, we wouldn't have been forced to go for three on our last score (I think if the score was 14-10 still we would have kicked the FG by choice and stopped them from tying - or we could have gone for it (not f-ing likely with Harbaugh) but with the score 17-14 we had to go for the FG). Regardless, what I mean to say is that we wouldn't have needed one of those drives to work if Manning didn't get gifted the TD. So I can't say regardless of KW mistakes, just like I can't say regardless of Alex's miss on the long KW pass.

 

[MHSL82]

We have one playmaker in the passing game who has been virtually unstoppable in the playoffs. We lack elite talent at WR, just as we lack elite talent at QB. Smith made two nice throws and had one or two good runs. Otherwise, he really struggled in this game. Denying it won't change it.

As for the throws in the dirt, the ones I'm thinking of occurred in the second-to-last drive. 1:40ish left, three TOs, and there's little doubt on at least one of them that Crabtree could have gotten out of bounds. We would have been facing third-and-five instead of third-and-ten. Who knows? Maybe we would have converted our first third-down of the game. Arguing that the clock was an issue is pretty weak. By throwing the ball into the dirt, we gave the Giants ample time for another drive.

I do have DVR and I rewatched it. It looks like the defenders would have a pretty good shot at getting the pass had it been higher on both passes, one more than the other. They weren't clear INTs but I can see what he was thinking. Down the field risks may be worth it some times, 4 yards? Not for me. I would have loved to continue the drive, but it looked to me that Smith made the right decision with dirting them. He may have been better off targetting someone else, though. So I can't confirm the reads being right.

 

[iHATEdodgers]

When you say I am "blaming Smith" for the loss, I take it to mean that you think I believe he is solely to blame. I don't think anyone is solely to blame for the loss. If I had to point the finger at one person, it would be Kyle Williams. After that, I'd point at the coaching staff that still had Williams out there returning kicks after a risky return of a bouncing punt last week, a diving catch this week, and then a ball off his knee. But there is plenty of fault to go around, and Smith was a big part of an offense that couldn't get anything going.

I believe our defense dominated this game, and if the offense had played at even a mediocre level in the 4th quarter, we win the game. We didn't. In the final two full drives, Smith threw four incompletions and took a sack. I can't recall the exact details of the sack, but at least two of the incompletions should have been completed.

Smith did help to lead a game-tying drive, but he was helped out by a return that put the ball on our 45. He had a very good scramble in what was his third-best play of the game, but the drive petered out on NY's seven when Smith completed two of three for eight yards (his only passing yards of the drive).

I read your last post. I just think it's misguided. Smith had a tremendous game last week, basically winning it for us with some great passes. But he played pretty poorly in this one. I don't think many unbiased observers would disagree with that.

See even there you say sure he led the game tying drive BUT really it was the return that did it. Either he led the drive or he didn't. There's no BUTS. Show me where anyone was open on those passes at the end of the drive. Why they didn't run it there is beyond me after they ran it down to that point. If anything I blame the playcalling at the end of that drive for not producing a TD - the offense did not execute but defintely not solely Smith's fault. He can't will those sorry motherfuckers to run themselves open.

When you say:

Smith played a bad game. He had numerous opportunities to make a play, and he came up short time and again.

Again you disregard the other components of the offense. He did not miss wide open WRs - because there weren't any (I know he missed Williams once on a bomb he hit two other long passes for TDs so 2/3 ain't bad). The entire offense came up short you could say - but you didn't.

Acting as if he didn't play a significant role in the loss is ridiculous, though. He completely fell apart in the 4th quarter. Regardless of Williams' mistakes. We couldn't do it, and Smith is largely to blame.

You seem to be (are) completely disregarding the terrible attempt at playing football made by Crabtree and Williams (he did get open on that long one Smith missed). Previous to your last post in this thread you did disregard the mistakes Williams made on the punt returns. You say things like Smith is "largely to blame" and "he came up short time and time again" to which my response is - you are blaming Smith. That's the only way to read that.

This was a defensive battle some games are like that. The Giants D was outstanding ours was even better. Despite that Smith and our offense outplayed Eli and his offense. They scored enough points to win the game. And it was all blown on one boneheaded play.

I'm not here to blindly defend Smith like plenty of morons have done in the past, in this instance I think it is well justified - but your previous posts were pulled right from the espn board if you ask me. You could have chosen to say the offense is largely to blame - to which I would say nah Williams is, but you chose to say Smith was largely to blame - to which I say nah Williams is. Which you agree with I understand now. But that was not apparent in your previous posts.

Fuck it. We blew that game the Giants are some lucky motherfuckers and I hope they beat the shit out of the Patriots because, Fuck Tom Brady and Bill Belichick. I am mad as hell and now I've wasted my goddamn night rehashing shit I am trying to forget.

 

[MHSL82]

See even there you say sure he led the game tying drive BUT really it was the return that did it. Either he led the drive or he didn't. There's no BUTS. Show me where anyone was open on those passes at the end of the drive. Why they didn't run it there is beyond me after they ran it down to that point. If anything I blame the playcalling at the end of that drive for not producing a TD - the offense did not execute but defintely not solely Smith's fault. He can't will those sorry motherfuckers to run themselves open.

When you say:

Smith played a bad game. He had numerous opportunities to make a play, and he came up short time and again.

Again you disregard the other components of the offense. He did not miss wide open WRs - because there weren't any (I know he missed Williams once on a bomb he hit two other long passes for TDs so 2/3 ain't bad). The entire offense came up short you could say - but you didn't.

Acting as if he didn't play a significant role in the loss is ridiculous, though. He completely fell apart in the 4th quarter. Regardless of Williams' mistakes. We couldn't do it, and Smith is largely to blame.

You seem to be (are) completely disregarding the terrible attempt at playing football made by Crabtree and Williams (he did get open on that long one Smith missed). Previous to your last post in this thread you did disregard the mistakes Williams made on the punt returns. You say things like Smith is "largely to blame" and "he came up short time and time again" to which my response is - you are blaming Smith. That's the only way to read that.

This was a defensive battle some games are like that. The Giants D was outstanding ours was even better. Despite that Smith and our offense outplayed Eli and his offense. They scored enough points to win the game. And it was all blown on one boneheaded play.

I'm not here to blindly defend Smith like plenty of morons have done in the past, in this instance I think it is well justified - but your previous posts were pulled right from the espn board if you ask me. You could have chosen to say the offense is largely to blame - to which I would say nah Williams is, but you chose to say Smith was largely to blame - to which I say nah Williams is. Which you agree with I understand now. But that was not apparent in your previous posts.

Fuck it. We blew that game the Giants are some lucky motherfuckers and I hope they beat the shit out of the Patriots because, Fuck Tom Brady and Bill Belichick. I am mad as hell and now I've wasted my goddamn night rehashing shit I am trying to forget.

Your name should be "I wish I had a Dodger" because if Williams had dodged the ball we'd be in the Super Bowl (I know, I know, if Smith hit Williams or Walker we'd be there, too - which is why the game was so frustrating. I'd rather have a 4 TD, no INT, 320 yard passing, blowout loss than this one - not really, but I'm venting.)

 

[iHATEdodgers]

Your name should be "I wish I had a Dodger" because if Williams had dodged the ball we'd be in the Super Bowl (I know, I know, if Smith hit Williams or Walker we'd be there, too - which is why the game was so frustrating. I'd rather have a 4 TD, no INT, 320 yard passing, blowout loss than this one - not really, but I'm venting.)

Heheh. Fuck the Dodgers. Not to rehash yet another fucking play - but I do believe Walker was held on that play and it would have been a TD too. He was calling for a flag at the end of the play and he was happy when he saw one - I don't think he realized it was for an unrelated offense. Check that on your DVR if you get a minute. Also I think Smith hits Williams if he didn't have a Giant bearing down on him at the end of the throw - I'm not defending him he seems to push those throws high when he has someone coming right at him. I'm sure that's typical of most QBs but still bummer. And poor Williams he just went full retard there what the fuck you gonna do.

Hey fuck this I'm going to sleep after I go smash my head against the wall.

 

[Kinzu]

Eli's QBR vs. 49ers: Why so low? - Stats & Info Blog - ESPN

QB Rating
Alex Smith - 97.6
Eli Manning - 82.3

QBR ESPN
Alex Smith - 30.5
Eli Manning - 30.9

My God that Eli is just carrying the Giants this year. He is just so much better than his older brother. I mean he just thoroughly out played and abused Alex Smith in the NFC Championship.

My favorite line for the article,
"Of the four plays that increased New York’s win probability the most, Manning was a part of zero. Of the eight plays that decreased New York’s win probability the most, Manning was a part of six."

*claps and cries*
Eli is just so great.

Funny thing is even though I can't find it, I'd bet several of the throws Alex made were part of our top win % gains. If not for Kyle Williams then Eli Manning would be in his rightful place right now getting abused by the very same media that wants to crown him the best of the Mannings. I doubt many of them even watched the game.

 

[Yadahell]

on the NEXT game if you can remember to, don't re-watch this game, hell i'm not into cruelty. everyone who keeps saying this should do it, and you don't have to do it all game. before the end of the 1st quarter you'll realize we're not predictable.

i did this during the Nolan years and again during Singletary. you'd think they'd be even more predicatable, but was surprised. didn't do it this year cause there was much less 'conservative' posting.

everyone shares the blame cause its a team loss, thats how everyone should go publically. if you really want me to lay blame, take your list and remove play calling.

Haha- ok I'll try it out and see what happens. During the Nolan years that is pretty tough to do- speaking of cruelty.

I'd good with that. In retrospect I would move Crabtree's inability to get open up over play-calling. At least its taken this long to get into serious draft talk Deep. The last several years, draft talk has started pretty early around here.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

I do have DVR and I rewatched it. It looks like the defenders would have a pretty good shot at getting the pass had it been higher on both passes, one more than the other. They weren't clear INTs but I can see what he was thinking. Down the field risks may be worth it some times, 4 yards? Not for me. I would have loved to continue the drive, but it looked to me that Smith made the right decision with dirting them. He may have been better off targetting someone else, though. So I can't confirm the reads being right.

I'll have to take a look myself at some point - not sure when. I think one of them was pretty easily completed. We needed something to spark the offense here, and I think four or five yards to our offense at that moment could have been something. We were flailing, and Smith's two passes in the dirt while rolling right summoned visions of 2009. Any pass has a chance of being intercepted. We needed our QB to make a play and he didn't. IMO, running a few yards and sliding would have been preferable because at least it would keep the clock running.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

See even there you say sure he led the game tying drive BUT really it was the return that did it. Either he led the drive or he didn't. There's no BUTS. Show me where anyone was open on those passes at the end of the drive. Why they didn't run it there is beyond me after they ran it down to that point. If anything I blame the playcalling at the end of that drive for not producing a TD - the offense did not execute but defintely not solely Smith's fault. He can't will those sorry motherfuckers to run themselves open.

When you say:

Smith played a bad game. He had numerous opportunities to make a play, and he came up short time and again.

Again you disregard the other components of the offense. He did not miss wide open WRs - because there weren't any (I know he missed Williams once on a bomb he hit two other long passes for TDs so 2/3 ain't bad). The entire offense came up short you could say - but you didn't.

Acting as if he didn't play a significant role in the loss is ridiculous, though. He completely fell apart in the 4th quarter. Regardless of Williams' mistakes. We couldn't do it, and Smith is largely to blame.

You seem to be (are) completely disregarding the terrible attempt at playing football made by Crabtree and Williams (he did get open on that long one Smith missed). Previous to your last post in this thread you did disregard the mistakes Williams made on the punt returns. You say things like Smith is "largely to blame" and "he came up short time and time again" to which my response is - you are blaming Smith. That's the only way to read that.

This was a defensive battle some games are like that. The Giants D was outstanding ours was even better. Despite that Smith and our offense outplayed Eli and his offense. They scored enough points to win the game. And it was all blown on one boneheaded play.

I'm not here to blindly defend Smith like plenty of morons have done in the past, in this instance I think it is well justified - but your previous posts were pulled right from the espn board if you ask me. You could have chosen to say the offense is largely to blame - to which I would say nah Williams is, but you chose to say Smith was largely to blame - to which I say nah Williams is. Which you agree with I understand now. But that was not apparent in your previous posts.

Fuck it. We blew that game the Giants are some lucky motherfuckers and I hope they beat the shit out of the Patriots because, Fuck Tom Brady and Bill Belichick. I am mad as hell and now I've wasted my goddamn night rehashing shit I am trying to forget.

A few things and then we can let this rest.

First, I absolutely agree that we outplayed the Giants and should/would have won this game if not for Kyle Williams inexplicably botching not one but two punts. That's what made the difference, and I'm not denying that.

I also question the playcalling. We seemed to go away from the run in the second half, or we would throw on early downs and run on second and long, etc. That seemed like a mistake, especially as the passing offense struggled. I would have liked to have seen a few designed passes to Hunter, as passing to the RBs did seem to be working, and the Giants have struggled to keep up with Hunter's speed and quickness. We largely put the game in Smith's hands, and maybe that was a mistake, but we did have some chances that we failed to capitalize on.

The only reason we were still in that game was because of an absolutely phenomenal performance by our defense, and that has nothing to do with Smith. Smith made two great throws and had a good scramble. Those effectively led to all 17 of our points. Smith deserves credit for those, and maybe saying he had a "terrible" game is not fair. The two TD passes alone might raise it to a solid game. On the whole, though, I found his performance to be below average. He had three balls batted at the line and missed several throws badly. He looked like the Alex Smith of a couple years ago. While our receivers had some trouble getting open, Smith also missed them when they were. As Cosell points out, on at least three occasions he missed open receivers who were quite open. And in two of those cases, he didn't just miss the throw, but he never made it. I wasn't focusing on the WRs, so I can't say if they were getting separation or not, but I can say that Smith missed several throws, looked skittish in the pocket, and could not make a play when we desperately needed on. He is far from the only person to blame for this loss, but he does deserve some the blame for the loss. Our offense simply couldn't function, and at the end of the day, that always comes back to the QB. I have defended Smith based on mitigating circumstances in the past, but this time I don't think there is much defense.

Finally, as I have said, I don't think Eli was much better and might have been worse. He had more yards, but he's lucky he didn't have two INTs. He was only in a position to win the game because of Williams' blunders. But I'm not interested in assessing Eli's performance here. I'm interested in why Smith struggled.

 

[MHSL82]

I'll have to take a look myself at some point - not sure when. I think one of them was pretty easily completed. We needed something to spark the offense here, and I think four or five yards to our offense at that moment could have been something. We were flailing, and Smith's two passes in the dirt while rolling right summoned visions of 2009. Any pass has a chance of being intercepted. We needed our QB to make a play and he didn't. IMO, running a few yards and sliding would have been preferable because at least it would keep the clock running.

We don't need our QB to make a 5 yard play that has a high chance of being intercepted, which is just my opinion from watching it. I could be wrong. We do need him to make a play and the farther the pass is the more justified the risk is, as long as the risk of INT is reasonable compared to the shorter pass. I agree that if he knew that it was dangerous enough to kill the pass by throwing it in the dirt, he should have scrambled, but to me, that's pretty hard to make that decision. Saying that it's pretty hard doesn't mean he couldn't have done better.

 

[yossarian]

I was rethinking about this game and I recall passes where he overthrew open receivers. I also wish that they had stuck more to the running game, maybe that would have given Harbaugh more of a basis to go for it on 4th and 1 in overtime when they were in Giants territory. I also wish that I could have had just one of the Williams turnovers back, or that the refs had not had such a quick whistle on the forward progress of Bradshaw. I also wish that either Brown or Goldson make that key interception where they collided. It was truly an offensive team loss all around, as Smith said after the game they were 1/13 on third down. Smith is a part of the loss. However, I don't think this is an indictment of Smith that he has reverted in some way, he made great strides this year and I think he will be even better next year. I think this team knows it has to improve its receiver situation, either through the draft or free agency or both, and that we will actually be the favorites with Green Bay to represent the NFC in the Super Bowl next year.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

We don't need our QB to make a 5 yard play that has a high chance of being intercepted, which is just my opinion from watching it. I could be wrong. We do need him to make a play and the farther the pass is the more justified the risk is, as long as the risk of INT is reasonable compared to the shorter pass. I agree that if he knew that it was dangerous enough to kill the pass by throwing it in the dirt, he should have scrambled, but to me, that's pretty hard to make that decision. Saying that it's pretty hard doesn't mean he couldn't have done better.

As said, I'll have to take a second look at this one. The play I'm thinking of, it looked like Crabtree had a step and the defender wouldn't have a play on even a passably-thrown ball.

 

[spacedoodoopistol]

One thing I heard yesterday.....for all the endless talk about 1 - 13, which was terrible, in the end the Giants had like 20 first downs and the 49ers had 15. Not a huge disparity. 3rd down was bad, but the other ones weren't as bad. I think some of the criticism there may be a bit over the top.

The other......I don't think anyone can defend Smith's accuracy that much. Not counting closely, I thought about 3 of his incompletions were nice passes and nice plays by the D, and about 3 were carefully thrown off-target to prevent INT.....but most of the rest were either thrown away while bailing out, or just bad throws. The biggest problem was definitely pulling up on plays too quickly and throwing it away......the few times you see Eli just standing there, waiting for a WR to come open, knowing he'll take the hit.....Smith does that sometimes, but didn't at all in the title game.

 

[erckm510]

Smith did the bare minimum to win the game with his 2 TD's. Yeah his receivers couldn't get open but he got 3 or 4 balls knocked down at the line and didn't make some throws that he needed to make. Throughout the game the underneath seemed open and the Niners didn't exploit it or when they tried Smith couldn't make the throw. Smith did not have a good game. But they still could have won which is a testament to how good the D is.

 

[Flyingiguana]

Smith did the bare minimum to win the game with his 2 TD's. Yeah his receivers couldn't get open but he got 3 or 4 balls knocked down at the line and didn't make some throws that he needed to make. Throughout the game the underneath seemed open and the Niners didn't exploit it or when they tried Smith couldn't make the throw. Smith did not have a good game. But they still could have won which is a testament to how good the D is.

so a defensive lineman jumps in the air and knocks a ball down...

u do realize that happens...

 

[iHATEdodgers]

so a defensive lineman jumps in the air and knocks a ball down...

u do realize that happens...

Heheh! Yeah I would say batted balls are maybe 10% QB 45% OL and 45% Good D. There was one batted ball from the game where on the replay our guy (I think it was Snyder) was barely even touching the guy he was defending... hey genius the pass is designed to go over your head maybe you should lock him up or something. Sigh. Some people just don't understand the ole football.