Anthony Collins

[BKBroiler9000]

All I know is we had BETTER resign Brandon Ghee! That guy is great!!

 

[flamingrey]

A 3rd or 4th rounder might be expecting a bit high for Collins. In any case, you aren't finding a player with Collins' ability in the 3rd or 4th round.

And I don't care if we had the best o-line in the league without Collins. It can always be better. That's the point.

 

[flamingrey]

First, a player's self worth is always over valued.

Secondly, Rey is a dumbass because the Bengals certainly paid him twice what he was worth considering his poor play every single game since he's been drafted.

edit: I don't think Hall or Atkins, or Dunlap would agree.

We can debate the merit of letting him walk, but the reality is, you can't pay everyone what they want each year. Can't do it. Could the Bengals have afforded to pay him? I'm sure they could have worked it, but they opted to save that cash and use it elsewhere. It is what it is.

The OL will be just fine, as it was last year, when he didn't play.

 

[bengaldoug]

It's a good thing for us there is an 89% floor. Mike Brown will stay as far under the cap as he can get away with.

 

[Cincyfan78]

It's a good thing for us there is an 89% floor. Mike Brown will stay as far under the cap as he can get away with.

My understanding is that it is an average of 89% over a 4 year period starting in 2013. To reach that % this year, would mean that the Bengals would need to spend 118MM on their roster this year (roughly). At nearly 28MM under, that would put the Bengals at roughly 105MM total cap usage, after signing Polak and their recent cuts...

 

[bengaldoug]

You have a better understanding of it than I do, but my point is Brown is cheap, and he's going to pocket as much as he can while spending as little as he can get away with, because winning just isn't first to him. As far as Collins goes Brown likes the extra 10 million over five years more than he likes his oline being the best it can be.

 

[Cincyfan78]

You have a better understanding of it than I do, but my point is Brown is cheap, and he's going to pocket as much as he can while spending as little as he can get away with, because winning just isn't first to him. As far as Collins goes Brown likes the extra 10 million over five years more than he likes his oline being the best it can be.

That is pretty basic. I know they have carry-over, and I'm not 100% how that affects the numbers.

But, if what I was looking at is pretty close to accurate you have to think:

at 105MM currently on the cap, to reach 118MM isn't that hard. You figure, what? 8MM for draft picks? That puts you at 113MM, then if you figure in RFA signing tenders, and insurance for replacing injured players, and incentives expected to be hit by players, so let's say anothher 5MM, that alone puts the Bengals at 118MM, or 89% of the 133MM cap. That doesn't include any additional Free Agent signings, which could add an additional 4-5MM, and that would put the cap at 122MM, and then I guess the carry-over would go towards paying AJ and Dalton, and Burfict at some point.

Again, this could be off because I don't know how the carry-over reflects against the cap.

 

[cincygrad]

Hobs says that we spent the 2nd most money in the league last year and that we are right up agains the cap.

Every other source says we have some of the most cap money in the league.

Hobs should work for the government.

 

[alf8478]

Why do they make it sound like the extensions for AJ/Burfict and I guess Dalton are going to take up like 99% of the cap? nevemind, I know the answer.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Hobs says that we spent the 2nd most money in the league last year and that we are right up agains the cap.

Every other source says we have some of the most cap money in the league.

Hobs should work for the government.

I don't think we are "right up" against the cap, but I do think that the Bengals have spent money that will keep them in the 90ish % of the cap. If they are able to carry over the extra from this year into next year, it is only going to be roughly 10MM.

Looking at Calvin Johnsons' contract, the base pay for 2014 is 5MM, but the overall cap hit is 13MM

2015 base 12.5MM and overall cap hit of 20.5MM
2016 base 15.9MM and overall cap hit of 24MM
2017 base 17.0MM and overall cap hit of 21MM

So, looking at the overall numbers of the middle of the contract, it is reasonable to assume that AJ is going to command in the neighborhood of 12-13 against the cap in the early years, and anywhere from 18-22MM in the later years. With more money on the cap, the price could increase, we'll see.

So, today's "extra" 15MM in cap space is tomorrows AJ contract extention. Which, again, can be spread out with bonuses and the like, but the bengals are still going to have to account for a large, large chunk of money against the cap.

 

[cincygrad]

My issue is that the cap is at least 4 or 5 million more than they thought it would be.

With that extra money they could have made a fair offer to AC and locked down a position for the future. They could have done this and not been in much different position than they originally planned. Then again, as I said before, Whit doesn't want to play guard so they won't make him play guard.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Also, as stated before, the Bengals carried over 8MM towards this years' cap. Now, in adjusted cap, that would give the Bengals 141MM in spending money, and 8MM of it would be adjusted off the final total of whatever they spend. So, if I am correct, in theory, the Bengals would have 10MM left in cap, PLUS 8MM from the carry over that would not count towards the cap, but the Bengals COULD spend...for a total allowed of 18MM to spend. I don't know if that can be carried into next year or not. If not, then the Bengals would be very wise to get AJ under a new contract now, and give him most of his money up-front, so that his salary cap number in years 2, 3, 4, etc are much more cap friendly.

Again, I could be wrong on that part, as I'm not 100% sure how it works, but I think that is pretty close.

 

[Cincyfan78]

My issue is that the cap is at least 4 or 5 million more than they thought it would be.

With that extra money they could have made a fair offer to AC and locked down a position for the future. They could have done this and not been in much different position than they originally planned. Then again, as I said before, Whit doesn't want to play guard so they won't make him play guard.

I don't disagree at all. At this point, all we know is that the Bengals made a comparable offer, so they did at least offer him.

No, how much? I don't know, but I do agree I would liked to have seen them sign AC, slide Whit down to guard, and improve the line that way.

But, as with anything like this, it's not like there's anything we can do about it other than hope that the plan in place is better than the actions that occured. At least over the past few years, the plan has worked for the most part. The part that needs the most fixing isn't going to be rectified anytime soon, and that is getting a QB that can make plays and carry the offense, especially in the playoffs. The rest of the chips that fall are just details.

 

[flamingrey]

My issue is that the cap is at least 4 or 5 million more than they thought it would be.

With that extra money they could have made a fair offer to AC and locked down a position for the future. They could have done this and not been in much different position than they originally planned. Then again, as I said before, Whit doesn't want to play guard so they won't make him play guard.

Then they never would've made Collins an offer.

 

[flamingrey]

I don't disagree at all. At this point, all we know is that the Bengals made a comparable offer, so they did at least offer him.

No, how much? I don't know, but I do agree I would liked to have seen them sign AC, slide Whit down to guard, and improve the line that way.

But, as with anything like this, it's not like there's anything we can do about it other than hope that the plan in place is better than the actions that occured. At least over the past few years, the plan has worked for the most part. The part that needs the most fixing isn't going to be rectified anytime soon, and that is getting a QB that can make plays and carry the offense, especially in the playoffs. The rest of the chips that fall are just details.

Without knowing what their "plan" and/or goal was, how do you know it has worked (for the most part)? How do you know how much better we would/could have been had the Bengals actually spent the money they could? Don't be such a homer. This is a team that could be on the brinks of a deep playoff run. Most of the talent is there. Spending that extra available money on 1st tier FA's as opposed to 2nd and 3rd tier possibly could have pretty easily put us in the AFCCG. Whatever their "plan" is has led to 3 ugly first round playoff losses in a row. It has not worked - at least it should be that it hasn't from any fan's perspective.

 

[flamingrey]

Oh, and the cap is projected to get up to $160 million within a few years. Now is the time to spend money and lock players up.

 

[cincygrad]

Then they never would've made Collins an offer.

I have no idea what their offer was, but I have my doubts that it was competitive.

They were never serious about keeping Collins. If they were they would have put a tag on him to give themselves a year before making serious decisions about the line.

 

[kramer1]

I have no idea what their offer was, but I have my doubts that it was competitive.

They were never serious about keeping Collins. If they were they would have put a tag on him to give themselves a year before making serious decisions about the line.

Gotta stay at that 89%, yo.

 

[DanBengalfan]

the bengals clearly didn't think keeping Collins was life or death. the OL was decent without him, and they will likely find someone younger to take his place. if he wanted to stay here he could have stayed here.

 

[bengaldoug]

the bengals clearly didn't think