All-Time Roster of Non-HOF Players

[Omar 382]

Stan's thread got me on the topic of HOF, so I will make a list of position players and 5 SP's who are not in the Hall, but are the best players at their position to not be in.

RULES:

• Only players who are off the ballot and need to be voted in by the Veteran's Committee. So, no Bonds, Clemens, etc.
• It doesn't matter if they are banned from baseball, i.e. Rose and Joe Jackson qualify
• As usual, most games played at the position matter in my qualifications, i.e. Musial is a 1B. If you don't like it, go to Church (yes, I stole that one from Ice Cube, but I couldn't think of a wittier remark. I'm hopeless)
• If you're in as a manager or something, but not as a player, you qualify, i.e. Joe Torre
• The SP are in no order
• I'm not doing RP, but if you have the vigor, go the hell for it

C- Joe Torre
1B- Dick Allen
2B- Bobby Grich
3B- Graig Nettles
SS- Bill Dahlen
LF- Joe Jackson
CF- Kenny Lofton
RF- Reggie Smith

SP- Jim McCormick
SP- Tommy Bond
SP- Rick Reuschel
SP- Charlie Buffinton
SP- Kevin Brown

 

[Iffster]

Coot Veal and Ted Lepcio

 

[Omar 382]

And..... RIGHT on time, Iffster adds nothing to the board

 

[Voltaire26]

Stan's thread got me on the topic of HOF, so I will make a list of position players and 5 SP's who are not in the Hall, but are the best players at their position to not be in.

RULES:

• Only players who are off the ballot and need to be voted in by the Veteran's Committee. So, no Bonds, Clemens, etc.
• It doesn't matter if they are banned from baseball, i.e. Rose and Joe Jackson qualify
• As usual, most games played at the position matter in my qualifications, i.e. Musial is a 1B. If you don't like it, go to Church (yes, I stole that one from Ice Cube, but I couldn't think of a wittier remark. I'm hopeless)
• If you're in as a manager or something, but not as a player, you qualify, i.e. Joe Torre
• The SP are in no order
• I'm not doing RP, but if you have the vigor, go the hell for it

C- Joe Torre
1B- Dick Allen
2B- Bobby Grich
3B- Graig Nettles
SS- Bill Dahlen
LF- Joe Jackson
CF- Kenny Lofton
RF- Reggie Smith

SP- Jim McCormick
SP- Tommy Bond
SP- Rick Reuschel
SP- Charlie Buffinton
SP- Kevin Brown

Why is Alan Trammell and Lou Whitaker not included on your list?

 

[navamind]

3B is a tough one. Nettles is a reasonable choice, but these guys also deserve consideration:

Buddy Bell
Darrell Evans
Ken Boyer
Sal Bando
Robin Ventura

Could argue Dwight Evans or Reggie Smith as well, maybe even Wes Farrell if you include batting for pitchers. He had a 100 OPS+ and 12.8 WAR as a batter, on top of a 116 ERA+ and 48.8 pitching WAR. He had a pretty nice run from 1929-36 where he finished in the top 5 in pitching WAR and IP along with a 128 ERA+. He batted .285/.350/.466 over that timeframe.

 

[Omar 382]

Why is Alan Trammell and Lou Whitaker not included on your list?

They were close, just neither made the cut

 

[broncosmitty]

Why is Alan Trammell and Lou Whitaker not included on your list?

Omar's been eatin Trailer Park subs again.

 

[DrewScott]

1b - Crime Dog

 

[broncosmitty]

Eddie Cicotte
Frank Tanana
Mike Mussina
Mickey Lolich
Tommy Bridges

 

[navamind]

I'd probably go with Trammell over Dahlen, especially if you think Trammell faced much better quality competition in the 70s/80s than Dahlen did in the deadball era. Not sure how reliable those defensive numbers are for Dahlen either (Rfield has him at +139). Grich/Whitaker is kind of a tossup, though I'd lean Grich. It's a joke neither of them are in the HOF, same with Trammell.

 

[Omar 382]

Omar's been eatin Trailer Park subs again.

How'd you know? Just got the "Fuck Detroit Over" meatball sub from the chinks. How is this place not more well known? They even had normal drinking water in an effort to mock Flint

 

[jwolt92]

Vern Stephens?

His 162 game numbers compared to Nettles:

175 to 134 in hits
29 to 20 in doubles
tied at 23 for homeruns
111 to 79 with RBIs


Then for actual averages. Stephens bats .286 for his career while Nettles bats a measly .248

I mean literally every number has Stephens as the better player.

 

[broncosmitty]

LFTim Raines
DH Pete Rose
CF. Dale Murphy
RF. Strawberry
1st. Keith Hernandez
3rd. Darrell Evans
2nd Lou Whitaker
C bill Freehan
SS Tramm

 

[Omar 382]

Vern Stephens?

His 162 game numbers compared to Nettles:

175 to 134 in hits
29 to 20 in doubles
tied at 23 for homeruns
111 to 79 with RBIs


Then for actual averages. Stephens bats .286 for his career while Nettles bats a measly .248

I mean literally every number has Stephens as the better player.

Yeah, if you like 3rd grade Topps-in-your-spokes numbers

 

[jwolt92]

Yeah, if you like 3rd grade Topps-in-your-spokes numbers

really? that's your best come back? Give me a reason where Nettles is better than Stephens

 

[jwolt92]

LFTim Raines
DH Pete Rose
CF. Dale Murphy
RF. Strawberry
1st. Keith Hernandez
3rd. Darrell Evans
2nd Lou Whitaker
C bill Freehan
SS Tramm

Your team whoops the fuck out of Omar's team 9 times out of 10

 

[Omar 382]

I'd probably go with Trammell over Dahlen, especially if you think Trammell faced much better quality competition in the 70s/80s than Dahlen did in the deadball era. Not sure how reliable those defensive numbers are for Dahlen either (Rfield has him at +139). Grich/Whitaker is kind of a tossup, though I'd lean Grich. It's a joke neither of them are in the HOF, same with Trammell.

I'd be ok with that, defensive metrics from the turn of the 20th century are obviously spotty. I just went with Dahlen because of the big gap in WAR, but they did have ~identitcal JAWS, and Trammell even had a better WAR7. Both stat-padded their counting numbers at the end of their careers

 

[Omar 382]

really? that's your best come back? Give me a reason where Nettles is better than Stephens

Sigh. I'm kind of watching the Iggles. But ok

 

[broncosmitty]

Eddie Rommel, Dolph Luque, Bobby Schantz, Wilbur Wood and John Hiller can make up my bullpen.

 

[navamind]

Vern Stephens?

His 162 game numbers compared to Nettles:

175 to 134 in hits
29 to 20 in doubles
tied at 23 for homeruns
111 to 79 with RBIs


Then for actual averages. Stephens bats .286 for his career while Nettles bats a measly .248

I mean literally every number has Stephens as the better player.

You're citing 162 game averages for a guy who played in a 154 game season? And he only had 23+ home runs and 111+ RBIs in four of his seasons. He had only three seasons of 29+ doubles and two with 175+ hits.

Also, why are you comparing a 3B to a SS?