2019 NBA Playoffs thread

[tlance]

If that is your view I don't think it's out of line at all (favoring the players over owners). But also not crazy to think owners should have as much right to get out of a bad deal as there is to have no recourse.

Except that the owner signed the contract. Agreeing to the deal.

If owners don't have to live up to their end, then players should also be able to void their contract and become a FA whenever they want if they are payed under market value.

But they can't do that.

I don't have a problem with owners making money. I do have a problem with how badly the deck is stacked against players in terms of contracts in the NFL.

 

[msgkings322]

Except that the owner signed the contract. Agreeing to the deal.

If owners don't have to live up to their end, then players should also be able to void their contract and become a FA whenever they want if they are payed under market value.

But they can't do that.

I don't have a problem with owners making money. I do have a problem with how badly the deck is stacked against players in terms of contracts in the NFL.

Not to keep this an NFL thread, but that league is the very last one to feel sorry for the owners, for the reasons you describe. It's SO stacked against the players for many reasons. I don't understand dtgold's position at all.

 

[dtgold88]

Except that the owner signed the contract. Agreeing to the deal.

If owners don't have to live up to their end, then players should also be able to void their contract and become a FA whenever they want if they are payed under market value.

But they can't do that.

I don't have a problem with owners making money. I do have a problem with how badly the deck is stacked against players in terms of contracts in the NFL.

The players agreed to the CBA. They have a choice....do what most of us do and don't play in the NFL.

The deck is only stacked so poorly against them compared to owners in other leagues who maybe caved too easily and/or offered players too much. NFL players are treated like most employees.....don't do your job (or don't live up to your value) and you can be let go (and not paid).

I'd like to see all 3 have something in the middle of where NFL is and NBA/MLB.

 

[dtgold88]

Not to keep this an NFL thread, but that league is the very last one to feel sorry for the owners, for the reasons you describe. It's SO stacked against the players for many reasons. I don't understand dtgold's position at all.

Probably because you don't understand my position if you think I feel sorry for NFL owners?

 

[msgkings322]

Probably because you don't understand my position if you think I feel sorry for NFL owners?

No that's not it

 

[dtgold88]

No that's not it

So what don't you understand? That I am able to see both sides and not just how it looks for the players?

Just like the NBA, don't the players in the NFL get a certain % of the revenue? If they do cut a guy and don't pay him, another player will be paid.

Assuming this is true (and I believe it is but don't feel like looking) and NFL players are paid much less on average than an NBA player and that bothers you, then I could agree as it is more dangerous for the player. However, I'd rather other leagues NOT have guaranteed deals as opposed to NFL players' contracts be guaranteed. Or find something in the middle.

And tlance's point is fair if they pay him too much that's on the owners, but tough to not pay them as someone will. If they don't they can be sued for collusion.

 

[msgkings322]

So what don't you understand? That I am able to see both sides and not just how it looks for the players?

Just like the NBA, don't the players in the NFL get a certain % of the revenue? If they do cut a guy and don't pay him, another player will be paid.

Assuming this is true (and I believe it is but don't feel like looking) and NFL players are paid much less on average than an NBA player and that bothers you, then I could agree as it is more dangerous for the player. However, I'd rather other leagues NOT have guaranteed deals as opposed to NFL players' contracts be guaranteed. Or find something in the middle.

And tlance's point is fair if they pay him too much that's on the owners, but tough to not pay them as someone will. If they don't they can be sued for collusion.

I don't understand why you care at all about the owners. Even in the leagues with the unfair structures as you measure it, the owners are super rich and make tons of money. In football the players are chewed up and spit out and most end up broke and broken
Just don't understand your take

 

[GNG]

Look no further than the Seahawks cutting Chancellor and Baldwin this week. The NFLPA really needs to fight for guaranteed contracts.

Baldwin and Chancellor made plenty of money in their prime.

 

[dtgold88]

I don't understand why you care at all about the owners. Even in the leagues with the unfair structures as you measure it, the owners are super rich and make tons of money. In football the players are chewed up and spit out and most end up broke and broken
Just don't understand your take

The players can choose to play in the NFL or not play in the NFL. Am I wrong about what I said? Players have to be paid a certain % of the revenue (which is the cap). If one guy is released and not paid, good chance another player gets the money. Is that untrue?

Not sure I'd get so upset at the NFL owners because owners of the other leagues have a pretty bad deal for themselves.

 

[msgkings322]

The players can choose to play in the NFL or not play in the NFL. Am I wrong about what I said? Players have to be paid a certain % of the revenue (which is the cap). If one guy is released and not paid, good chance another player gets the money. Is that untrue?

Not sure I'd get so upset at the NFL owners because owners of the other leagues have a pretty bad deal for themselves.

And the owners can choose to not own a team if they don't like the rules. Lord grant me that pretty bad deal the NBA and MLB owners have.

Most NFL players end up broken and broke after they play 3-4 years. Is that untrue?

This one isn't even close IMO

 

[Montalban]

This certainly was a big day for the NBA. Two killer game 7s.

 

[bksballer89]

To say the 2nd round lived up to the hype is an understatement

 

[dtgold88]

And the owners can choose to not own a team if they don't like the rules. Lord grant me that pretty bad deal the NBA and MLB owners have.

Most NFL players end up broken and broke after they play 3-4 years. Is that untrue?

This one isn't even close IMO

That stat is a little misguided as it's skewed by so many playing a year or less and not cutting it. Should the NFL owners pay guys who can barely hang on in the league as well?

A little different bringing 90 guys to camp every year as opposed to 20 in NBA and guessing 50 in MLB.....and MLB has minor leagues.

Any idea what minor league players get paid? Would you be OK if NFL could send guys they don't want into that situation?

 

[shopson67]

Baldwin and Chancellor made plenty of money in their prime.

So if you had an on the job injury and were under contract for several more years, you would be fine with it if the company cut you loose, owing you nothing? With no opportunity to apply for worker's compensation? The team agreed to that contract, and in every other major sport, they cannot wriggle out of those payments. The NFLPA is weak, even though they have probably the BEST argument for guaranteed contracts, as teams are not losing money. Every team in 2017 (the most recent data I found quickly) made at least $335M (Raiders) and as much as $864M (Cowboys). Estimate is each team turns an average profit of 101M annually.

 

[GNG]

So if you had an on the job injury and were under contract for several more years, you would be fine with it if the company cut you loose, owing you nothing? With no opportunity to apply for worker's compensation? The team agreed to that contract, and in every other major sport, they cannot wriggle out of those payments. The NFLPA is weak, even though they have probably the BEST argument for guaranteed contracts, as teams are not losing money. Every team in 2017 (the most recent data I found quickly) made at least $335M (Raiders) and as much as $864M (Cowboys). Estimate is each team turns an average profit of 101M annually.

Maybe players would be better served to get rid of their union. I have no empathy for millionaires playing a kid's game.

 

[shopson67]

Maybe players would be better served to get rid of their union. I have no empathy for millionaires playing a kid's game.

The NFL is a billion dollar business. Call it what you want, but it isn't that without those millionaires.

 

[msgkings322]

That stat is a little misguided as it's skewed by so many playing a year or less and not cutting it. Should the NFL owners pay guys who can barely hang on in the league as well?

A little different bringing 90 guys to camp every year as opposed to 20 in NBA and guessing 50 in MLB.....and MLB has minor leagues.

Any idea what minor league players get paid? Would you be OK if NFL could send guys they don't want into that situation?

No because the NFL is orders of magnitude more dangerous. Just don't see how you feel bad for owners in any of the sports

 

[msgkings322]

Maybe players would be better served to get rid of their union. I have no empathy for millionaires playing a kid's game.

Most NFL players never become millionaires, after taxes. The average playing career is around 4 years

 

[dtgold88]

So if you had an on the job injury and were under contract for several more years, you would be fine with it if the company cut you loose, owing you nothing? With no opportunity to apply for worker's compensation? The team agreed to that contract, and in every other major sport, they cannot wriggle out of those payments. The NFLPA is weak, even though they have probably the BEST argument for guaranteed contracts, as teams are not losing money. Every team in 2017 (the most recent data I found quickly) made at least $335M (Raiders) and as much as $864M (Cowboys). Estimate is each team turns an average profit of 101M annually.

If I were the player being released, no I would not like it...but I'd be OK if I was the guy taking his place.

 

[dtgold88]

No because the NFL is orders of magnitude more dangerous. Just don't see how you feel bad for owners in any of the sports

You keep saying this but please find where I said I feel bad for the NFL owners. Being reasonable and able to see their side does not mean I feel bad for them.