2019-2020 Official Regular Season Thread

[dtgold88]

off topic, but just got word daughter's college will be remote for most students until reassessing on 9/27. Not terribly upset about that but feel awful for her.

 

[tlance]

So, you expect a not-healthy Mahomes to rank above the league MVP dual threat QB? Based on what logic?

Are we talking about who is the best player?

That is what I thought we were talking about.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Because he is like 68 years old.

Mahomes isn’t even in his prime yet. Lamar could very well improve next season also. But his skill set tend to last as long.

I am willing to bet, if you polled NFL GMs which QB they want to run their franchise, 31/32 would say Mahomes.

Yeah Lamar top 3 QB bc of last season and dual threat? Fine with me but there is no way he is better than Mahomes or has more potential. Mahomes is like a more mobile and talented version of 80's Marino...and with more weapons. Clayton and Duper were alright though lol.

 

[dtgold88]

Lastly, this is yet another case and point that the average player is NOT a good talent evaluator.

We have had many people on here using current and former players’ opinions as “proof”. Their lists often aren’t that reliable.

And let’s not forget that Carson Wentz was #3 a couple years ago.

That's fair as they may have biases.....so might fans though, and I certainly would not dismiss players' opinions.

Possible players are also thinking Mahomes has a more talented roster and better offensive coach?

 

[DJ Fieri]

Lebron really playing solid switching defense on both Kawhi and Playoff P in that possession.

He could benefit the most from the break.....he has had to carry a heavy load in his career.....minutes wise.

 

[tlance]

OK, but aren't you among those who believes it's absurd to hold number of rings against Lebron in the MJ/Lebron debates? Football is even more teammate dependent.

I'd still take Mahomes, but his winning the SB did not help make my decision.....though I do agree stopping LJ now in both his playoff games hurts him.

Rings are part of the equation. I have always said that. But they need to be viewed in proper context.

You can’t just say 6 > 3 so MJ is better. There is more to it.

And a player with 0 rings can never be in the GOAT debate, for example.

Just like a QB with 0 playoff wins can’t be the best player in the league. Because QB is ultimately the 1 position in team sports where W/L record is placed on them. Fair or not.

 

[dtgold88]

Yeah Lamar top 3 QB bc of last season and dual threat? Fine with me but there is no way he is better than Mahomes or has more potential. Mahomes is like a more mobile and talented version of 80's Marino...and with more weapons. Clayton and Duper were alright though lol.

agree....though having more weapons might work against him in the players' vote.

 

[dtgold88]

Rings are part of the equation. I have always said that. But they need to be viewed in proper context.

You can’t just say 6 > 3 so MJ is better. There is more to it.

And a player with 0 rings can never be in the GOAT debate, for example.

Just like a QB with 0 playoff wins can’t be the best player in the league. Because QB is ultimately the 1 position in team sports where W/L record is placed on them. Fair or not.

Mostly agree, but if we are just talking Mahomes and LJ in this debate because they have both been in the league for such a short time and Mahomes "only" has 1 more ring I don't think this means as much as if we were comparing, say, Manning and Brady.

 

[Shanemansj13]

agree....though having more weapons might work against him in the players' vote.

Yeah but I just mean his ceiling is that much higher. Not even counting weapons I would still take Mahomes easily. It's not like Lamar doesn't have weapons. He has the perfect offensive scheme around him as well. Better OL and running game that helps his passing ability. KC has a worse OL and not much in their running game so that puts more pressure on Mahomes to perform imo.

 

[dtgold88]

and one more football comment I'll make......please let there be a season (still think there might but will come down to discipline of players off field).

 

[dtgold88]

Yeah but I just mean his ceiling is that much higher. Not even counting weapons I would still take Mahomes easily. It's not like Lamar doesn't have weapons. He has the perfect offensive scheme around him as well. Better OL and running game that helps his passing ability. KC has a worse OL and not much in their running game so that puts more pressure on Mahomes to perform imo.

Lamar's top weapon was who? Andrews, who was probably not as good as Kelce, the KC TE? Both probably have solid running games. Haven't checked, but figured lines are pretty equal....think you might be underestimating the Reid factor.

all that said, I'd choose Mahomes....just not crazy to pick LJ IMO.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Lamar's top weapon was who? Andrews, who was probably not as good as Kelce, the KC TE? Both probably have solid running games. Haven't checked, but figured lines are pretty equal....think you might be underestimating the Reid factor.

all that said, I'd choose Mahomes....just not crazy to pick LJ IMO.

OL has a lot to do with running game as well as scheme. There isn't a team in the NFL better at running the ball than BAL, obviously Lamar has a lot to do with it but he is set up for success bc of the scheme fit. Even w/o Lamar's rushing numbers they are close to top 5 in rushing.

I disagree about not too crazy. Lamar has had one MVP season, that's great and all but Mahomes has proved more during the season and playoffs. Part of being the best player is how you perform in the playoffs...both are limited in that fact but it's still a small factor at least. Lamar's passing numbers look a hell of a lot better bc of their scheme, great OL and his ability to run the ball, of course. Mahomes is just that good of a passer, his OL is average at best and his running game is bottom 10.

So the question is? Does Lamar really deserve the #1 spot bc of his running game or do you take the much better pure passer? I will take the much better pure passer all day, everyday.

Put it like this. I would put money that Mahomes throw 30+ TD's 10 times in his career (if he stays healthy) over Lamar duplicating what he did last season only one more time in his career. It's that big of a difference imo.

 

[tlance]

Mostly agree, but if we are just talking Mahomes and LJ in this debate because they have both been in the league for such a short time and Mahomes "only" has 1 more ring I don't think this means as much as if we were comparing, say, Manning and Brady.

Sure.

For the record, I think this is a bit different conversation if the Chiefs narrowly beat the Ravens in the AFC championship and Lamar played well.

But he has struggled in the playoffs and is now 0-2.

Where Mahomes is 4-1.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Gonna follow my own advice and rock the suns/magic

 

[Shanemansj13]

Sure.

For the record, I think this is a bit different conversation if the Chiefs narrowly beat the Ravens in the AFC championship and Lamar played well.

But he has struggled in the playoffs and is now 0-2.

Where Mahomes is 4-1.

Yeah and I'm not even leaning on that necessarily for my argument over Mahomes over Jackson but it does matter-no doubt. I think he is that much better of a passer and doesn't have to rely on his legs. It's scary he is the most talented and best at his age...taking over for Brady in the East, lets hope not though lol. My Browns need to at least contend one year with all this talent

 

[Wamu]

off topic, but just got word daughter's college will be remote for most students until reassessing on 9/27. Not terribly upset about that but feel awful for her.

Speaking of college my youngest son graduated from CU this year. But the graduation ceremony was cancelled. Did your daughter follow in your footsteps and go to Ohio State?

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Nets down 11 at the half

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

@Wamu

The Lakers are now tied with the Boston Celtics for most 50-win seasons.

 

[Wamu]

@Wamu

The Lakers are now tied with the Boston Celtics for most 50-win seasons.

That's imposible! According to my own phoney baloney Lakers history any accomplishments while in Minneapolis don't count, different state. Which means 1949-50 squad that won 51 doesn't count towards their 50-win season totals.

And those five titles between '49 and '54, take those banners down because they belong to the state of Minnesota. Oh yeah while I'm at it I should say again that the Lakers '85, '87 & '10 seasons are invalid. Which means the Purple 'n Gold only have 8 rings.

 

[Black Adam]

That wasn't last year, which is the most recent impact on these rankings. Mahomes may never do that again either. Jackson threw for 10 more than Mahomes and ran for 5 more than Mahomes last year. But I guess Mahomes was going to make up for that in the 1 less game he played compared to Jackson?

err, that'd be TWO less games...

dislocated a knee, remember...?