2016 Rotation

[filosofy29]

filo, why are you so high on Dexter Fowler? The dude's numbers have been produced playing half his games either at Colorado, Houston or Chicago. Prepare for a big drop in production if he makes San Francisco his home. For his career, his home/road splits are rather dramatic. He has hit .292/.389/.413 at home and .245/.339/.366 on the road. Additionally, in 112 at-bats at AT&T, he has a slash line of .179/.292/.232. I would much rather pass on him, thank you.

I think the Giants need a relatively cheap OF that can play good defense, run a little AND hit a little. If you don't like Fowler, that's fine by me. I just want somebody like a Fowler or a Parra. I haven't scoured the market, so Fowler may not be the best or even top 3 options available.

 

[calsnowskier]

I think the Giants need a relatively cheap OF that can play good defense, run a little AND hit a little. If you don't like Fowler, that's fine by me. I just want somebody like a Fowler or a Parra. I haven't scoured the market, so Fowler may not be the best or even top 3 options available.

*cough*Tomlinson*cough*

 

[filosofy29]

*cough*Tomlinson*cough*

filo "likes" this.

 

[SFGRTB]

I think the Giants need a relatively cheap OF that can play good defense, run a little AND hit a little. If you don't like Fowler, that's fine by me. I just want somebody like a Fowler or a Parra. I haven't scoured the market, so Fowler may not be the best or even top 3 options available.

The Giants might be smart to go after Austin Jackson instead. His value is lower, but he has the speed/defense combo and he doesn't need to be starting everyday. Plus he's right-handed to compliment Blanco. He might just want to go to a more hitter-friendly park to re-establish value though.

Or just Kelby

 

[LHG]

I've not been a huge fan of free agency being the default answer to the issues on a team. Yeah, I get it, sometimes the farm doesn't have the answer, but what Panik, Tomlinson and Heston should teach us is that maybe sometimes it does have the answer and we, as fans, get so focused on signing the sexy free agent. If Tomlinson were to slightly decline next year, his numbers would still be better than what Fowler does on the road (and at AT&T). I know that Tomlinson could fall flat on his face in 2016 (pitchers adjust and he doesn't) but so could a big name free agent who costs millions more. Look at the market, look at the farm, look at the guys already on the roster. What's the cost to production ratio? If the slight increase worth the multi millions more in salary? Will there even be an increase in production? If there is a free agent who's going to vastly improve a position, and his numbers would translate well to AT&T, then I'm all for that guy being signed. However, a veteran with mediocre numbers is just a minor league vet who got a chance and made a name simply by being on a big league roster. Okay, my rant is done (for now).

 

[calsnowskier]

The Giants magic number for the West is 37. They only have 27 to play.

While mathematically still alive, the season is dead.

Play Tomlinson in center, and don't worry about any games he costs, unless it gets REAL bad. We don't want to mess with his confidence.

Play Noonan or EA at 2B and let Panik ease himself back in. DO NOT PUSH PANIK!! Panik needs his back to be as close to 100% as possible. He is too important to this team. As pretty as that play the other day was, I think we all peed ourselves just a little seeing him wrench his back like that.

Add Trevor Brown to the 40 and get him some reps behind the dish. If Posey will be limited to 90 games at catcher, the team will need another backup, and Hacktor ain't cutting it. I am not saying Brown is ready, or even that he is a legit prospect. But we need to know if a BU catcher is a priority for '16. Susac also needs to be shut down so he can heal (looks like this may have actually been done).

 

[filosofy29]

I've not been a huge fan of free agency being the default answer to the issues on a team. Yeah, I get it, sometimes the farm doesn't have the answer, but what Panik, Tomlinson and Heston should teach us is that maybe sometimes it does have the answer and we, as fans, get so focused on signing the sexy free agent. If Tomlinson were to slightly decline next year, his numbers would still be better than what Fowler does on the road (and at AT&T). I know that Tomlinson could fall flat on his face in 2016 (pitchers adjust and he doesn't) but so could a big name free agent who costs millions more. Look at the market, look at the farm, look at the guys already on the roster. What's the cost to production ratio? If the slight increase worth the multi millions more in salary? Will there even be an increase in production? If there is a free agent who's going to vastly improve a position, and his numbers would translate well to AT&T, then I'm all for that guy being signed. However, a veteran with mediocre numbers is just a minor league vet who got a chance and made a name simply by being on a big league roster. Okay, my rant is done (for now).

There's no doubt about it, you are LHG!

I'm good with Tomlinson as an OF'er. It would be awesome if he could be a Zobrist-lite.

Also, I'm pretty much in agreement with you regarding the farm vs free agency (except for me wanting Leake). My point for having someone like Parra or Fowler was to have depth and that it would be a relatively cheap and short term solution. I'm don't want any long term big time FA's.....except for Leake.....I want him signed.

Mike Leake. Signed. By the Giants. Long term.



Mike Leake.

 

[calsnowskier]

There's no doubt about it, you are LHG!

I'm good with Tomlinson as an OF'er. It would be awesome if he could be a Zobrist-lite.

Also, I'm pretty much in agreement with you regarding the farm vs free agency (except for me wanting Leake). My point for having someone like Parra or Fowler was to have depth and that it would be a relatively cheap and short term solution. I'm don't want any long term big time FA's.....except for Leake.....I want him signed.

Mike Leake. Signed. By the Giants. Long term.



Mike Leake.

So what are your thoughts on Leake? Enough pussyfooting. Take a stand!

 

[filosofy29]

So what are your thoughts on Leake? Enough pussyfooting. Take a stand!

I'm stuck on this tall fence-like structure.

 

[LHG]

There's no doubt about it, you are LHG!

I'm good with Tomlinson as an OF'er. It would be awesome if he could be a Zobrist-lite.

Also, I'm pretty much in agreement with you regarding the farm vs free agency (except for me wanting Leake). My point for having someone like Parra or Fowler was to have depth and that it would be a relatively cheap and short term solution. I'm don't want any long term big time FA's.....except for Leake.....I want him signed.

Mike Leake. Signed. By the Giants. Long term.



Mike Leake.

Was there ever a question?

Regarding Leake, I am in favor or re-signing him. He's been consistent, he's young and its possible (not sure how possible, but possible) that he even signs as a discount. He's been pretty good for us in the time he's been here. I like the idea.

 

[filosofy29]

Was there ever a question?

Regarding Leake, I am in favor or re-signing him. He's been consistent, he's young and its possible (not sure how possible, but possible) that he even signs as a discount. He's been pretty good for us in the time he's been here. I like the idea.

No. Just giving you a hard time.

 

[SFGRTB]

I've not been a huge fan of free agency being the default answer to the issues on a team. Yeah, I get it, sometimes the farm doesn't have the answer, but what Panik, Tomlinson and Heston should teach us is that maybe sometimes it does have the answer and we, as fans, get so focused on signing the sexy free agent. If Tomlinson were to slightly decline next year, his numbers would still be better than what Fowler does on the road (and at AT&T). I know that Tomlinson could fall flat on his face in 2016 (pitchers adjust and he doesn't) but so could a big name free agent who costs millions more. Look at the market, look at the farm, look at the guys already on the roster. What's the cost to production ratio? If the slight increase worth the multi millions more in salary? Will there even be an increase in production? If there is a free agent who's going to vastly improve a position, and his numbers would translate well to AT&T, then I'm all for that guy being signed. However, a veteran with mediocre numbers is just a minor league vet who got a chance and made a name simply by being on a big league roster. Okay, my rant is done (for now).

Tomlinson has a .410 BABIP so he will regress, but he still deserves a spot on the team going forward. We also have Blanco, Pagan and Pence locked in, and it seems like a good possibility Byrd will come back and Aoki has an option. If Byrd does return, the Giants would probably look at a versatile defender, probably a left-handed hitter. Looking at the minor leagues, the Giants don't really have that. Jarrett Parker's defense is just brutal, he takes bad routes and he doesn't have a good feel out there. Fred-Lewis like. Williamson is a guy they would like to play everyday if he's here, so he's not a 5th OF option. Is Hunter Cole ready? Carbonell looks far off. Juan Perez can't hit.

The point is, at least for the outfield, I don't think there is someone we can turn to except for Kelby. And that would be perfectly fine. We probably won't find out if he will make a transition to the outfield for awhile, because the Giants just don't talk about moves like that until the season is officially over.

There's also some sense of a known commodity with veteran free agents. They have numbers that show they can hit in the league. Minor leaguers don't have that. Juan Perez hits very well in the minor leagues, falls on his face at the ML level. Kelby Tomlinson hits well in the minor leagues, hits well in the majors. It's risky going into a season and relying on the unknown. It backfired in 2013 when no one from the minor leagues could step up. With all the injuries to Pagan, and were not even sure if Kelby will be moved to CF, it might be smart to sign someone.

 

[LHG]

No. Just giving you a hard time.

Maybe I should have used a more light hearted smily on that one. I kinda' figured that much. Me ranting over free agents and not giving farm hands their due is kinda my signature rant.

 

[LHG]

Tomlinson has a .410 BABIP so he will regress, but he still deserves a spot on the team going forward. We also have Blanco, Pagan and Pence locked in, and it seems like a good possibility Byrd will come back and Aoki has an option. If Byrd does return, the Giants would probably look at a versatile defender, probably a left-handed hitter. Looking at the minor leagues, the Giants don't really have that. Jarrett Parker's defense is just brutal, he takes bad routes and he doesn't have a good feel out there. Fred-Lewis like. Williamson is a guy they would like to play everyday if he's here, so he's not a 5th OF option. Is Hunter Cole ready? Carbonell looks far off. Juan Perez can't hit.

The point is, at least for the outfield, I don't think there is someone we can turn to except for Kelby. And that would be perfectly fine. We probably won't find out if he will make a transition to the outfield for awhile, because the Giants just don't talk about moves like that until the season is officially over.

There's also some sense of a known commodity with veteran free agents. They have numbers that show they can hit in the league. Minor leaguers don't have that. Juan Perez hits very well in the minor leagues, falls on his face at the ML level. Kelby Tomlinson hits well in the minor leagues, hits well in the majors. It's risky going into a season and relying on the unknown. It backfired in 2013 when no one from the minor leagues could step up. With all the injuries to Pagan, and were not even sure if Kelby will be moved to CF, it might be smart to sign someone.

I do want to say that I'm not in favor of re-signing Marlon Byrd. Considering his age, and the numbers he's posted the past couple of years, I don't think he would be a good year long investment (or two years especially).
But if, under your scenario, the team does bring back Byrd, we, as you mentioned, would need to find someone to slot into the 5th outfielder spot. Any of the top two tiered free agent outfielders are not going to be willing to sign on as a 5th outfielder. Who would that leave? Drew Stubbs, Ryan Raburn, Johnny Gomes, Sean Rodriguez, Skip Schumaker? How many of these guys would provide substantially better offense than Perez that would make up the loss of defense?
I understand your though process in theory, but I do wonder how many guys, that would even fit that description, would be willing to fill that kind of role?

 

[LHG]

Is it okay to point out that we (myself included) seem to have a hard time keeping offseason talk to one thread? In the past two months, 3 threads have been started for this very topic. Take a look:
2016 Rosterbation | SportsHoopla Sports Forums
2015 Offseason moves | SportsHoopla Sports Forums
FA SP Targets | SportsHoopla Sports Forums

 

[filosofy29]

Is it okay to point out that we (myself included) seem to have a hard time keeping offseason talk to one thread? In the past two months, 3 threads have been started for this very topic. Take a look:
2016 Rosterbation | SportsHoopla Sports Forums
2015 Offseason moves | SportsHoopla Sports Forums
FA SP Targets | SportsHoopla Sports Forums

Mike Leake!!!

 

[LHG]

Mike Leake!!!

You need to go to each thread and make your case for how ambivalent you are toward the Giants signing Mike Leake.

 

[SFGRTB]

I do want to say that I'm not in favor of re-signing Marlon Byrd. Considering his age, and the numbers he's posted the past couple of years, I don't think he would be a good year long investment (or two years especially).
But if, under your scenario, the team does bring back Byrd, we, as you mentioned, would need to find someone to slot into the 5th outfielder spot. Any of the top two tiered free agent outfielders are not going to be willing to sign on as a 5th outfielder. Who would that leave? Drew Stubbs, Ryan Raburn, Johnny Gomes, Sean Rodriguez, Skip Schumaker? How many of these guys would provide substantially better offense than Perez that would make up the loss of defense?
I understand your though process in theory, but I do wonder how many guys, that would even fit that description, would be willing to fill that kind of role?

Fair enough. Marlon probably fits the mold better for a 5th outfielder anyway, but he may not want to accept that role. Kelby might be perfect for this, but we probably won't truly know if he's actually an option until after the season is (officially) over.

The front burner question is the ROTATION.

 

[msgkings322]

Fair enough. Marlon probably fits the mold better for a 5th outfielder anyway, but he may not want to accept that role. Kelby might be perfect for this, but we probably won't truly know if he's actually an option until after the season is (officially) over.

The front burner question is the ROTATION.

Precisely. Hence this thread.

 

[LHG]

Found this article today and found it humorous that the idea of Hudson retiring is adding to the starting rotation woes - Tim Hudson's exit adds to SF's pitching woes