2014 Winter Olympics Game Thread.

[nuraman00]

Opening Ceremonies Broadcast Tonight.

7:30 PM PST (all time zones I think, NBC is tape delayed for every time zone)

NBC.

 

[nuraman00]

Seven Must-Watch Winter Olympics Events, Recommended by Grantland?s Panel of Winter Sports ?Experts? «

 

[nuraman00]

Good ceremony so far.

Too bad about the snowflake glitch. One of them didn't transform into the Olympic Rings, so there were only 4 snowflakes that turned into rings.

 

[nuraman00]

The colors, the performance, the history, the dancing. The Opening Ceremonies were good.

I think the last one I saw was the Beijing one. Both were good, but I slightly prefer this one.

The Opening Ceremonies are a bit long though. They have one part of the show, then the Parade Of Nations, then another part. Could be more condensed if they combined both parts into about 1 hr 30 mins, and after the Parade Of Nations.

As for the actual lighting of the torch, my favorite is still the 1992 Barcelona won, where they shot arrows that lit it.

Go to 4:40:

 

[MHSL82]

I won't really care about the ceremonies until a host has the guts to put up a Taiwan flag or call the Taiwan team, who can compete against China BTW, the Taiwan team instead of Chinese Taipei.

 

[nuraman00]

I won't really care about the ceremonies until a host has the guts to put up a Taiwan flag or call the Taiwan team, who can compete against China BTW, the Taiwan team instead of Chinese Taipei.

Thanks.

What about the games? Will you watch?

 

[nuraman00]

When the Olympics were in Salt Lake City or Vancouver, did they call them Chinese Taipei too?

 

[nuraman00]

I won't really care about the ceremonies until a host has the guts to put up a Taiwan flag or call the Taiwan team, who can compete against China BTW, the Taiwan team instead of Chinese Taipei.

When the Olympics were in Salt Lake City or Vancouver, did they call them Chinese Taipei too?

2002: Chinese Taipei.

WTF kind of flag is this this? Disgusting.

Chinese Taipei at the 2002 Winter Olympics - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[MHSL82]

When the Olympics were in Salt Lake City or Vancouver, did they call them Chinese Taipei too?

I didn't know much about Taiwan when the Olympics were in Salt Lake. That was 12 years ago.

 

[MHSL82]

2002: Chinese Taipei.

WTF kind of flag is this this? Disgusting.

Chinese Taipei at the 2002 Winter Olympics - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

That's what you get when the host is too chickenshit to allow the correct flag. That's a politically correct flag. The ironic thing is that politically, it's incorrect. And don't talk to me about the UN recognizing anything as a country, when any one of the five superpowers can veto the rest of the 170+ countries, of course you're not going to get it. China's one of those 5. Taiwan has its own military, education system, taxation, currency, language, voting system, President, passport, is a democracy, The US who originally backed it first, US stopped China from taking over Taiwan but not what is now China (not including Taiwan), etc.

 

[nuraman00]

That's what you get when the host is too chickenshit to allow the correct flag. That's a politically correct flag. The ironic thing is that politically, it's incorrect. And don't talk to me about the UN recognizing anything as a country, when any one of the five superpowers can veto the rest of the 170+ countries, of course you're not going to get it. China's one of those 5. Taiwan has its own military, education system, taxation, currency, language, voting system, President, passport, is a democracy, The US who originally backed it first, US stopped China from taking over Taiwan but not what is now China (not including Taiwan), etc.

What do the bolded portions mean, can you reexplain?

Do you mean the US originally backed Taiwan?

And for the 2nd bolded portion, what does that mean? The US was originally opposed to China expanding, but it eventually let China, territorially speaking, become what it is now, excluding Taiwan (since the US still supports/recognizes Taiwan)?

 

[MHSL82]

What do the bolded portions mean, can you reexplain?

Do you mean the US originally backed Taiwan?

And for the 2nd bolded portion, what does that mean? The US was originally opposed to China expanding, but it eventually let China, territorially speaking, become what it is now, excluding Taiwan (since the US still supports/recognizes Taiwan)?

The government of Taiwan used to rule all of China and Taiwan after they got Taiwan back from Japan. Taiwan used to be part of China before Japan as well. So they definitely have a common history.

When the communists took over, they started in what people now call mainland China (including or not including Hong Kong and Tibet) and the non-Communist China government went to Taiwan and defended the island. By the time that the Communists tried to get to Taiwan, the US stopped them. Unfortunately, for them, this was right after Pearl Harbor. When US entered the war, they tried to stop all the powers from taking over land. Communists were one of them.

Until the 70s, the US only recognized the Taiwan government officially as the legitimate government of China and Taiwan. The US had unofficial relations with Communist China and China was weak. US had a treaty with Taiwan to defend Taiwan if the Communists tried to take over. Then, when Nixon took over, either Congress or Nixon, in order to get China to help against Russia, they recognized Communist China. They have had unofficial relations with Taiwan ever since.

My grandfather's cousin is a diplomat. He was talking about how the US treats Taiwan as a separate country. Diplomatically, they said that they recognize that there were people on both sides of the Taiwan Strait who claim China, that there's only one China, and the US did not have anything to argue with that. It was kind of clever, because Communist China can take that as saying that they own Taiwan and Taiwan can take that as them owning China. The US wants to stay out of it.

A diplomat who visited USC, was asked what the highest chance of World War III was. He said it was not the Middle East, it was the Taiwan/China relationship. I figure that Taiwan does not need to declare independence because they had their rule already and they never surrendered their land. But if Taiwan were to officially declare independence, China would attack, as Communist China has in their Constitution. China has been shooting missiles over the land of Taiwan and claiming military practice. Since China claims Taiwan, they say it's not an international violation. They're shooting over their own land as they claim. If we were to try to stop them, it would be taking affirmative action and US is not interested in that. If Bush were president and China attacked Taiwan, the US government would intervene. With Obama as President, I'm not as confident.

When I visited Shanghai, I read a book while I was waiting at the airport. The book was talking about the "pesky" Taiwan independence movement. They said that if Taiwan gave up their "silly" independence claim, they could be given some autonomy over their region. But my analogy for this is like: I own a golden retriever who I can pet, feed, keep away from strangers, etc. If someone said, "I want that dog. But don't worry, while I take your golden retriever, you can still come pet it or feed it and I will allow you to still call it by the name you gave it. Deal?" Why would I take the deal when I can already do all those things and have ownership of the dog? It's a deal that you won't be mad?

I've heard all the arguments of Taiwan being part of China. Some people say that China is bigger and has a bigger military. We're bigger than Cuba, a country close to us, but we don't own Cuba. They'll talk about common history, but we have common history of England and we don't belong to them. They talk about no Declaration of Independence, but when Taiwan already owned Taiwan, why do they need a Declaration of Independence when they never gave up their rule? They talk about to the victors go the spoils, but first of all, Taiwan never gave up what is now China. Also, we didn't get England or get England-owned Canada when we declared independence. If it were to the victors go the spoils, why would the communist government keep fighting after they took over the capital of former China? They would just take over the major part and say "hey, we got it all."

As I talked about earlier, another claim is that they are not recognized by the United Nation as a separate country. However, I don't believe in that because the five superpowers can veto any petition they want. 170 countries could say that Taiwan was a country and China would say no and that's that. Very few countries would risk their commercial ties to China just to vote on something that China can veto afterwards. The US benefits from the veto power, so I can't say it's totally bad, however I won't take everything based upon whatever the UN says.

I'll never really call China as mainland China because that suggests that there's an offland China. We talk about Continental US to suggest not Hawaii or Alaska. When someone says mainland China someone could be suggesting the China government of China but not the China government of Taiwan. They can also distinguish between Hong Kong, but I don't like when things can suggest something I don't agree with. So everyone else's fine to call it mainland China, I'll call it Communist China.

 

[nuraman00]

Until the 70s, the US only recognized the Taiwan government officially as the legitimate government of China and Taiwan. The US had unofficial relations with Communist China and China was weak. US had a treaty with Taiwan to defend Taiwan if the Communists tried to take over. Then, when Nixon took over, either Congress or Nixon, in order to get China to help against Russia, they recognized Communist China. They have had unofficial relations with Taiwan ever since.

Oh.

 

[nuraman00]

My grandfather's cousin is a diplomat. He was talking about how the US treats Taiwan as a separate country. Diplomatically, they said that they recognize that there were people on both sides of the Taiwan Strait who claim China, that there's only one China, and the US did not have anything to argue with that. It was kind of clever, because Communist China can take that as saying that they own Taiwan and Taiwan can take that as them owning China. The US wants to stay out of it.

For the US or for Taiwan?

 

[nuraman00]

So the US only unofficially recognizes Taiwan now, not officially.

What other nations or entities officially or unofficially recognize Taiwan?

 

[MHSL82]

For the US or for Taiwan?

They make him change every three years because they don't want you to get too local. He knows about 8 languages now.

 

[MHSL82]

So the US only unofficially recognizes Taiwan now, not officially.

What other nations or entities officially or unofficially recognize Taiwan?

Nearly all countries unofficially recognize Taiwan except China. About 18 or more recognize officially. The reason why the official one is not higher is because China says they will not deal with other countries that do not acknowledge the One China policy.

 

[nuraman00]

They make him change every three years because they don't want you to get too local. He knows about 8 languages now.

Really, or are you joking?

You can change which country you're a diplomat for, just like that?

 

[nuraman00]

Nearly all countries unofficially recognize Taiwan except China. About 18 or more recognize officially. The reason why the official one is not higher is because China says they will not deal with other countries that do not acknowledge the One China policy.

Which are some of those countries which recognize Taiwan officially?

And are they really hurt much by not dealing China, or would it not have mattered to them either way?

 

[MHSL82]

Really, or are you joking?

You can change which country you're a diplomat for, just like that?

I'm not sure if you can choose your country or not. That might go against the spirit of the rule. But yes, he had to change. At the very least, it would be subject to availability and your skills and record.