1990 MLB Draft Chat

[Nosferatu]

Other than Ripken and Finley I don't think I have any roiders.

Im not going to discount regular human numbers. But otherworldly stuff isn't going to factor into my voting. Bonds is the best position player in this Mock without his crazy homer season, IMO.

I agree with all of that, whats crazy is Bonds was probably my favorite player of the late 80's early 90's and he would have still been the best player of his generation without roids.

 

[UK Cowboy]

QUOTE=wlk3;6013835]My team has never used steroids. Period![/QUOTE]

 

[broncosmitty]

I agree with all of that, whats crazy is Bonds was probably my favorite player of the late 80's early 90's and he would have still been the best player of his generation without roids.

I wish he wouldn't have hit so many that one year. If he'd hit 67-68 or something, it still would have been ridiculous, but the shit storm wouldn't have surrounded him.

He was vilified for making a mockery of the game, by being too good. He went too far. Cuz he was better than everybody to begin with. One of the most complete players to ever step on the diamond. His defense, base running ability and eye at the plate get overlooked on account of his power and giant dome.

Hated when he got black balled. No doubt in my mind he would have been one of the best DHs in the game for another year or two. (Possibly for Leyland and my Tigers)

Not gonna lie though, I respected how he and his buddy Anderson just didn't talk. Two people who honestly value true friendship. Regardless of what it was they refused to talk about.

 

[Nosferatu]

My team has never used steroids. Period!

Wish I could say that but of just my 14 position players I believe at least 7 or 8 used... I'm being kind with that number.

 

[Nosferatu]

I wish he wouldn't have hit so many that one year. If he'd hit 67-68 or something, it still would have been ridiculous, but the shit storm wouldn't have surrounded him.

He was vilified for making a mockery of the game, by being too good. He went too far. Cuz he was better than everybody to begin with. One of the most complete players to ever step on the diamond. His defense, base running ability and eye at the plate get overlooked on account of his power and giant dome.

Hated when he got black balled. No doubt in my mind he would have been one of the best DHs in the game for another year or two. (Possibly for Leyland and my Tigers)

Not gonna lie though, I respected how he and his buddy Anderson just didn't talk. Two people who honestly value true friendship. Regardless of what it was they refused to talk about.

Exactly, it just always bothered me because he didn't need them, but him seeing what Sosa and McGwire did got him all crazy and he had to again try to show people he was indeed the best player in the game. I understand it I just hate it because honestly IMO even without the roids he was probably gonna end up one of the top 3 players in the history of the game.

 

[broncosmitty]

In general, roids don't bother me. They're adults making a living. If something can get you from AAA to MLB, who am I to tell someone they shouldn't. I actually think there needs to be a change to allow guys coming off injury to use whatever helps them EARN their paycheck.

But the sideshow numbers made it a serious issue.

 

[UK Cowboy]

I've been involved with college and pro athletes my whole life. Not trying to say it all, cause I surely don't. But I'm telling you, the % of NFL guys juicing is at least 75-80%. MLB has done a good job. But guys are still using. Just think of all the guys that have been busted......most never tested positive! Lance Armstrong was tested hundreds of times.....zip. when you're told months in advance when the tests can occur, you have to really be dumb as a brick to get caught. And here in Texas, it's really bad at the HS level. TX doesn't steroid test in High School anymore..... to expensive. It's rampant

 

[wlk3]

My team has never used steroids. Period!

QUOTE=wlk3;6013835]My team has never used steroids. Period!

[/QUOTE]

I was paraphrasing Nos's 1st baseman... I think Sammy might be the only guy on my team though... You guys would know better than me...

 

[UK Cowboy]

I was paraphrasing Nos's 1st baseman... I think Sammy might be the only guy on my team though... You guys would know better than me...[/QUOTE]

You're roster is pretty clean, but I see 6-7 anyway

 

[steveringo]

I put mine last in my own picks, without even looking at it....

And now looking at - and since were using career stats instead of peak - I think it probably should be last....

Who said that?

I think it was you... We were comparing Palmeiro and McGwire and you said Palmeiro has 500 HR and 3000 hits. Those are career stats. If we are using players peaks to vote, then those numbers shouldn't be used... right?

Obviously comparing careers, everyone would pick Palmeiro, but using peak seasons, no one would...

And, most of the teams listed career accomplishments. If we're not using career numbers, should everyone repost their teams with peak stats?

How should we vote?

 

[broncosmitty]

I was paraphrasing Nos's 1st baseman... I think Sammy might be the only guy on my team though... You guys would know better than me...[/QUOTE]

The finger wag was a nice touch.

 

[Nosferatu]

I think it was you... We were comparing Palmeiro and McGwire and you said Palmeiro has 500 HR and 3000 hits. Those are career stats. If we are using players peaks to vote, then those numbers shouldn't be used... right?

Obviously comparing careers, everyone would pick Palmeiro, but using peak seasons, no one would...

And, most of the teams listed career accomplishments. If we're not using career numbers, should everyone repost their teams with peak stats?

How should we vote?

I didn't say that, what I said was you can list any 3 stats or accomplishments you want to, if thats career numbers or season numbers thats up to you...

Telling people "HOW" to vote has not worked in the past so we pretty much leave it up to you to vote however you want.

 

[steveringo]

If we're ignoring steroid numbers, then my team is fucked....

Seriously, how will everyone be picking winners? I was planning on looking at the numbers everyone listed and used them in my team comparisons.

It sounds like some of you will do research on your own. Is that allowed?

 

[steveringo]

I didn't say that, what I said was you can list any 3 stats or accomplishments you want to, if thats career numbers or season numbers thats up to you...

Telling people "HOW" to vote has not worked in the past so we pretty much leave it up to you to vote however you want.

So, the three stats everyone listed are not related to the voting?


I apologize for all these questions.... This is only my 2nd draft...

 

[Nosferatu]

If we're ignoring steroid numbers, then my team is fucked....

Seriously, how will everyone be picking winners? I was planning on looking at the numbers everyone listed and used them in my team comparisons.

It sounds like some of you will do research on your own. Is that allowed?

I'm not ignoring steroid numbers at all, for me the fact McGwire hit 65 and 70 home runs will have no impact on what I think of his ability as a power hitter and how he fits into your team and his defense. He was still a great power hitter who had good numbers prior to 1998

Well I will vote on a few different things and yes I do some reasearch of my own to determine who I vote for. I will look at if you put players in their right positions, I will look at where you put them in your lineup, I will look at whether or not you have a balance of speed and power, I will look at defense and then some other things like for instance with your team, while I like your team every single player in your starting lineup bats right handed, that will knock your team down a little in my view.

 

[broncosmitty]

I look at players numbers, look at team strengths, look at matchups, try to envision how games would play, what weak points could be a problem, what players rise to the occasion, etc.

Raw numbers never are what I vote off. I understand were judging players in their prime, but how long someone's prime was, effects how much value I put in prime numbers. Tony Gwynn could hit in 1985, 1995 and he woulda hit in 1905. He was great. Brady Anderson stuck a needle in his butt and hit 50 homers one time. Not the same kind of prime, to me.

But Im glad were not voting off Whole Career when it comes to Dale Murphy. He hit a wall, and didn't use the cream or the clear to get over it.

Nobody in this draft is capable of 70 homers, to me. That doesn't mean I won't give Sosa, Big Mac, Rafi or any other known juicer, credit for being among the best hitters in this Mock. They are.

But I will give a guy like Frank Thomas, who I wish woulda juiced and lasted longer, the benefit of the doubt.

I woulda loved to see Dave Winfield on roids.

 

[UK Cowboy]

I'm looking at the numbers exactly how they were....reason being, MLB and ESPN knew Damn well what was up, but it was money in their own pockets, so they turned a blind eye, then acted shocked after the fact. Hypocrites. If we were gonna ignore steroid numbers, there was an easy solution....a 1932 draft

 

[UK Cowboy]

I look at players numbers, look at team strengths, look at matchups, try to envision how games would play, what weak points could be a problem, what players rise to the occasion, etc.

Raw numbers never are what I vote off. I understand were judging players in their prime, but how long someone's prime was, effects how much value I put in prime numbers. Tony Gwynn could hit in 1985, 1995 and he woulda hit in 1905. He was great. Brady Anderson stuck a needle in his butt and hit 50 homers one time. Not the same kind of prime, to me.

But Im glad were not voting off Whole Career when it comes to Dale Murphy. He hit a wall, and didn't use the cream or the clear to get over it.

Nobody in this draft is capable of 70 homers, to me. That doesn't mean I won't give Sosa, Big Mac, Rafi or any other known juicer, credit for being among the best hitters in this Mock. They are.

But I will give a guy like Frank Thomas, who I wish woulda juiced and lasted longer, the benefit of the doubt.

I woulda loved to see Dave Winfield on roids.

You don't think Frank Thomas used the sauce?

 

[Nosferatu]

I'm looking at the numbers exactly how they were....reason being, MLB and ESPN knew Damn well what was up, but it was money in their own pockets, so they turned a blind eye, then acted shocked after the fact. Hypocrites. If we were gonna ignore steroid numbers, there was an easy solution....a 1932 draft

Hey, I wanted to do 1955

 

[broncosmitty]

You don't think Frank Thomas used the sauce?

If he did, he did em early. He aged like a giant human being should. And went out kicking and screaming like a guy that felt like he wasn't playing on an even field.