Series Thread: 1) Golden State Warriors vs. 8) Los Angeles Clippers

[tlance]

He got turned around like a pretzel. He wanted to get beat by a crossover? That's what you are going with? Oh my.

He didn't get turned like a pretzel though.

His job in "ICE" is literally to jump to the screener's side and force the ball handler to reject. It also wouldn't surprise me if Boogie's call was late based on his poistioning.

Klay was scrambling to force Lou to reject, which he did. Klay got beat worse than normal because he had to jump into position late instead of sliding there. Maybe it was Boogie's fault for a late call, maybe it was Klay's fault for a late recognition. But "ICE" was the call here. Klay's job in that call is to force a straight line drive away from the screen into the big help and Boogie wasn't there to help.

Honestly, you should stop commenting on this stuff when you don't comprehend coverage responsibilities.

 

[CitySushi]

Of course it's possible. But I have heard some say he is an overrated defender (and not just because of the stats. They don't say he's a bad defender, but not elite.

Player A:
Career Defensive RTG 106
Career Average Defensive W/S: 2.87

Player B:
Career Defensive RTG 108
Career Average Defensive W/S: 2.35

Player C:
Career Defensive RTG 110
Career Average Defensive W/S: 1.65

Guess who those players were/are?

 

[dtgold88]

It's a matter of opinion of course, and there are surely others that agree with you. There are just so many more that agree with us. Especially professional basketball people

Many of the "so many more" are the type of fans who will just believe whatever they hear. ESPN, if they wanted to, could get these fans to believe Carson Edwards should be a top 5 pick and they'd parrot this eventually.

 

[msgkings322]

Many of the "so many more" are the type of fans who will just believe whatever they hear. ESPN, if they wanted to, could get these fans to believe Carson Edwards should be a top 5 pick and they'd parrot this eventually.

If it makes you feel better to skip the "professional basketball people" part then go right ahead

 

[dtgold88]

He didn't get turned like a pretzel though.

His job in "ICE" is literally to jump to the screener's side and force the ball handler to reject. It also wouldn't surprise me if Boogie's call was late based on his poistioning.

Klay was scrambling to force Lou to reject, which he did. Klay got beat worse than normal because he had to jump into position late instead of sliding there. Maybe it was Boogie's fault for a late call, maybe it was Klay's fault for a late recognition. But "ICE" was the call here. Klay's job in that call is to force a straight line drive away from the screen into the big help and Boogie wasn't there to help.

Honestly, you should stop commenting on this stuff when you don't comprehend coverage responsibilities.

Klay got turned around like a pretzel. He got beat. If Klay was a guy known for bad D you'd say he was beat and wouldn't go out of your way to make excuses for him.

Simple as that.

 

[dtgold88]

If it makes you feel better to skip the "professional basketball people" part then go right ahead

The fans here are not among those people.

 

[msgkings322]

Klay got turned around like a pretzel. He got beat. If Klay was a guy known for bad D you'd say he was beat and wouldn't go out of your way to make excuses for him.

Simple as that.

He did get beat. And he's a great defender. Both are true. No excuses, just common sense

 

[msgkings322]

The fans here are not among those people.

Of course, but those people agree with us.

 

[dtgold88]

Player A:
Career Defensive RTG 106
Career Average Defensive W/S: 2.87

Player B:
Career Defensive RTG 108
Career Average Defensive W/S: 2.35

Player C:
Career Defensive RTG 110
Career Average Defensive W/S: 1.65

Guess who those players were/are?

No thanks, but tell me if you'd like.

But guessing they go from worst to best in perceived defense

 

[CitySushi]

No thanks, but tell me if you'd like.

But guessing they go from worst to best in perceived defense

Not quite.

Player A: Gary Payton
9x All NBA Defense
DPOY

Player B: Klay Thompson

Player C: Joe Dumars
5x All NBA Defense

Two guys other guys who's metrics don't show their true defensive value, in addition to Klay.

 

[dtgold88]

He did get beat. And he's a great defender. Both are true. No excuses, just common sense

And I never said otherwise. You are still supporting my point...This could not be more amusing.

Never called out his defense overall. Just said on that play he was beat....and that excuses were made for him. because they were.

 

[dtgold88]

Not quite.

Player A: Gary Payton
9x All NBA Defense
DPOY

Player B: Klay Thompson

Player C: Joe Dumars
5x All NBA Defense

Two guys other guys who's metrics don't show their true defensive value, in addition to Klay.

And who is this?

Player D - 109 and 1.84 (which would be better than the 110 and 1.65 of player C, correct?)

 

[msgkings322]

And I never said otherwise. You are still supporting my point...This could not be more amusing.

Never called out his defense overall. Just said on that play he was beat....and that excuses were made for him. because they were.

Meh not really how it went but we seem to be close to agreement here

 

[dtgold88]

Meh not really how it went but we seem to be close to agreement here

So we are close to agreement, but you called me out for it? could it be because you base your comments on poster and not post?

 

[msgkings322]

So we are close to agreement, but you called me out for it? could it be because you base your comments on poster and not post?

Nope, wrong again. You're too smart to not understand this conversation.

 

[CitySushi]

And who is this?

Player D - 109 and 1.84 (which would be better than the 110 and 1.65 of player C, correct?)

Yes metrically it would be better than Joe Dumars. No clue, feel free to let me know.

 

[Wamu]

Yes metrically it would be better than Joe Dumars. No clue, feel free to let me know.

Kevin Love > Joe Dumars

 

[tlance]

And who is this?

Player D - 109 and 1.84 (which would be better than the 110 and 1.65 of player C, correct?)

If it is Kevin Love,

Defensive rating is strongly skewed favoring big men who don't guard perimeter players because of rebounding.

Cousins, for example is a career 103, 102 this season and yet he is the guy opposing teams attack almost every possession on ball screens.

And before you start, of you are guarding the other teams most dangerous perimeter threat on a nightly basis, defensive rebounding is not your priority. Staying connected to the scorer while teammates pursue the rebound is.

 

[tlance]

Kevin Love > Joe Dumars

If this exercise has proven anything,

It is that you can't compare a guard's metrics to a big man's.

By the way, 109 is putrid for a big who rebounds as well as Love does.

 

[tlance]

Klay got turned around like a pretzel. He got beat. If Klay was a guy known for bad D you'd say he was beat and wouldn't go out of your way to make excuses for him.

Simple as that.

You don't understand player responsibility on the play in question and you have no interest in learning about what you don't know.

We can't have a real conversation about this play if you aren't willing to admit what you don't know here.