Game Thread: Wild Card: Packers @ Redskins

[SoCalWizFan]

The other difference was that in those other four games, D-Jax scores a TD and we score another one to go up 21-0. While that's not an insurmountable deficit, against a reeling Pack team, it may be have been a knockout blow in this particular game. Instead, we let a perennial SB contender hang around with a relatively threadbare lead. I don't know why we didn't throw more screens so that playmakers like D-Jax could get the ball in his hands more often to make plays. And, of course, I've detailed the problems with Joe Barry. God bless the guy.

Cmon. It sounds like you refuse to just believe that GB had better players on this particular day. IMO the Redskins didn't have players who could 1. sustain a rushing attack & 2. stop the run. I have no doubt that this will be addressed in the offseason & make this team even stronger.

Honestly - what were you expecting in the playoffs? Even if somehow the Redskins beat the Packers they were most likely going to get blown out in the next round. Just give this whole thing a little more time.

 

[redskinsfan]

Perhaps this is partially true. However - again - players make plays not coaches. Also - as pointed out previously - the top QBs will figure out a way to beat you if given the opportunity. Do you really think that it is a coincidence that most of the 8 remaining playoff teams basically have the best remaining QBs? You can call that coaching if you like - I believe that is mainly a factor of the QBs & other players.

This could very likely work in the Redskins favor in the next several years. Cousins will learn from this & other experiences as will the defensive players. Combine this with an influx of talent & this team could start to make deep playoff runs in the near future.

I completely agree that players win games. But the rub in this game was the fact that, with a surging Redskins team brimming with confidence and a reeling Pack team limping into the playoffs, both teams were, in terms of production, about the same. That showed up early when we took an 11-0 lead (and should've had a larger one than that). But, as the game went on, McCarthy adjusted. That added element was the difference.

The fact that Rodgers played small ball is borne out by the fact that McCarthy outsmarted Barry.

 

[redskinsfan]

Cmon. It sounds like you refuse to just believe that GB had better players on this particular day. IMO the Redskins didn't have players who could 1. sustain a rushing attack & 2. stop the run. I have no doubt that this will be addressed in the offseason & make this team even stronger.

Honestly - what were you expecting in the playoffs? Even if somehow the Redskins beat the Packers they were most likely going to get blown out in the next round. Just give this whole thing a little more time.

See my next post on this. GB did have better players. But that misses the big point on where both teams were trending: despite the fact that GB did have more talent, the reason why most people picked us was because both teams were on separate season arcs. For that reason, we were the "better" team coming in yesterday.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

I completely agree that players win games. But the rub in this game was the fact that, with a surging Redskins team brimming with confidence and a reeling Pack team limping into the playoffs, both teams were, in terms of production, about the same. That showed up early when we took an 11-0 lead (and should've had a larger one than that). But, as the game went on, McCarthy adjusted. That added element was the difference.

The fact that Rodgers played small ball is borne out by the fact that McCarthy outsmarted Barry.

And the fact that at this time - especially in a playoff game - Rodgers is better than Cousins. Now this could very well change in the future or at least to the pt where Cousins gets closer.

 

[ehb5]

Huh?! My point was straightforward. All you had to do is watch the game and look at how Rodgers played very small ball against us.

As in I was talking to shark about the talent of the defense and you responded to me in disagreement about the TALENT of the defense. I didn't say anything about the scheme so don't correct me on scheme. (Or talent since you were wrong)

 

[redskinsfan]

And the fact that at this time - especially in a playoff game - Rodgers is better than Cousins. Now this could very well change in the future or at least to the pt where Cousins gets closer.

I'm not debating that Rodgers is better than Cousins. The point here is a nuanced one: Cousins' production coming into yesterday's game was better than Rodgers'.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

See my next post on this. GB did have better players. But that misses the big point on where both teams were trending: despite the fact that GB did have more talent, the reason why most people picked us was because both teams were on separate season arcs. For that reason, we were the "better" team coming in yesterday.

Kind of smoke & mirrors to a pt. If you are honest you would admit that the Redskins have not really played a good team in a while. Meanwhile - the Packers have been drubbed several times this season but mainly by very good teams.

 

[ehb5]

He certainly wasn't playing like the best QB until . . . Joe Barry. You just proved my point.

No. I didn't. He's been the best qb for years. If you think that means he won't have ups and downs or can't go off at any moment than I don't think this is a conversation worth having.

 

[redskinsfan]

As in I was talking to shark about the talent of the defense and you responded to me in disagreement about the TALENT of the defense. I didn't say anything about the scheme so don't correct me on scheme. (Or talent since you were wrong)

You simply don't get how to comprehend a nuanced point: as I just explained, I don't doubt that the Packers were a more talented team, and that Rodgers is a much better QB than Cousins. My point, again, is that, coming into this game, Cousins' production was (far) better than Rodgers'. In the beginning of the game, Rodgers continued his poor production. McCarthy then changed up his gamplan. Barry couldn't respond. Can't imagine what's so hard to comprehend here.

 

[redskinsfan]

Kind of smoke & mirrors to a pt. If you are honest you would admit that the Redskins have not really played a good team in a while. Meanwhile - the Packers have been drubbed several times this season but mainly by very good teams.

It certainly isn't. Again, why did most people pick us to win? And the Packers got beat by the likes of the Bears and should've gotten swept by the Lions.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

It certainly isn't. Again, why did most people pick us to win? And the Packers got beat by the likes of the Bears and should've gotten swept by the Lions.

Several factors at play here. Again - the poor quality of the Redskins recent opponents worked against them. In previous games they could flip a switch & play good enough on both sides of the ball. The doesn't work with a team like the Packers who have 1. Rodgers 2. playoff experience & 3. a defense that can disrupt things at the rt time.

Who cares who people picked to win the game. I think that they just need to look at this as valuable experience. Many NFL teams stumble in their initial playoff experience & rebound in subsequent years & do well. I think that the Redskins could very well follow this lead & coaching changes are not a prerequisite to any of this.

 

[redskinsfan]

Several factors at play here. Again - the poor quality of the Redskins recent opponents worked against them. In previous games they could flip a switch & play good enough on both sides of the ball. The doesn't work with a team like the Packers who have 1. Rodgers 2. playoff experience & 3. a defense that can disrupt things at the rt time.

Who cares who people picked to win the game. I think that they just need to look at this as valuable experience. Many NFL teams stumble in their initial playoff experience & rebound in subsequent years & do well. I think that the Redskins could very well follow this lead & coaches changes are not a prerequisite to any of this.

I couldn't disagree more. First, listen to what those picking us to win said. And they aren't just talking heads who pick things willy nilly. More importantly, the trends I've been talking about held serve in the first quarter. Like other games we won during our win streak, we jumped out to an early ;ead. In turn, our defense stifled the opposition during that quarter. We had the Pack -- and Rodgers -- on its toes, and we let them go. Barry simply continued to run the same defense he had planned out in the beginning of the game. He didn't want to blitz (like he normally doesn't), sit on routes, or change anything to meet the adjustment made by McCarthy. And that cost us.

 

[Sportster 72]

You simply don't get how to comprehend a nuanced point: as I just explained, I don't doubt that the Packers were a more talented team, and that Rodgers is a much better QB than Cousins. My point, again, is that, coming into this game, Cousins' production was (far) better than Rodgers'. In the beginning of the game, Rodgers continued his poor production. McCarthy then changed up his gamplan. Barry couldn't respond. Can't imagine what's so hard to comprehend here.

What I comprehend is you are someone with a lot of theories not routed in football reality. Whether we played man or zone we were still outgunned. What McCarthy did was to speed up the game and we could not match that with situational substitutions. Barry did but Rogers being the smart guy he is caught us with too many men on the field. It didn't have one thing to do with how far the ball travelled in the air. As I mentioned and you failed to pay any attention too, Rogers missed at least three long passes (at least two of which would have been TDs) so long, short or medium did not matter.

I am not a fan of zone defense. I do believe in blitzing. We played a lot of zone and blitzed very little this year. But considering what we started with on D and then how decimated we became in the defensive secondary it is my belief that Barry had little choice, he had to make teams drive the ball in long drives hoping for a penalty, turnover or something to help stop the drive. I believe Perry Fewell did a GREAT job with what he was given. I believe Barry did what he had to do. He told you before week 1 what he was doing and how he would do it. You don't change your defense to something you don't have the personnel for.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

I couldn't disagree more. First, listen to what those picking us to win said. And they aren't just talking heads who pick things willy nilly. More importantly, the trends I've been talking about held serve in the first quarter. Like other games we won during our win streak, we jumped out to an early ;ead. In turn, our defense stifled the opposition during that quarter. We had the Pack -- and Rodgers -- on its toes, and we let them go. Barry simply continued to run the same defense he had planned out in the beginning of the game. He didn't want to blitz (like he normally doesn't), sit on routes, or change anything to meet the adjustment made by McCarthy. And that cost us.

Really? So please tell me about all of those tackles that Barry missed. How about how Barry had a major impact on the lack of a ground game for the Redskins. You also seem to conveniently neglect the fact that the Redskins secondary is beat up in a major way at this time. This should be improved next season with the return of certain players as well as adding key players.

I also am amazed at how you just ignore the fact that a pro bowl QB like Rodgers can make on field adjustments throughout the games & also his elusiveness is a huge factor that cannot usually be countered by coaching.

BTW - many of those so called experts who picked the Redskins to win yesterday were the same ones who picked them to be last in the NFC-E earlier in the year so I don't really care what they say.

 

[redskinsfan]

What I comprehend is you are someone with a lot of theories not routed in football reality. Whether we played man or zone we were still outgunned. What McCarthy did was to speed up the game and we could not match that with situational substitutions. Barry did but Rogers being the smart guy he is caught us with too many men on the field. It didn't have one thing to do with how far the ball travelled in the air. As I mentioned and you failed to pay any attention too, Rogers missed at least three long passes (at least two of which would have been TDs) so long, short or medium did not matter.

I am not a fan of zone defense. I do believe in blitzing. We played a lot of zone and blitzed very little this year. But considering what we started with on D and then how decimated we became in the defensive secondary it is my belief that Barry had little choice, he had to make teams drive the ball in long drives hoping for a penalty, turnover or something to help stop the drive. I believe Perry Fewell did a GREAT job with what he was given. I believe Barry did what he had to do. He told you before week 1 what he was doing and how he would do it. You don't change your defense to something you don't have the personnel for.

Not quite. My point is not simply based on football reality, but realities in general. If we were outgunned, how come we weren't outgunned in the first quarter? And why did our defense start to fall apart beginning in the second quarter when the Pack resorted to small ball? We could've played press coverage with their receivers, all of whom have had pretty bad years. And we did that very same thing against OBJ and Reuben Randle. When we did that, we shut them down. The Giants only came back against us in the second game when we started to play zone. Remember that 4th and 16. Yep. A zone defense where one of our DBs went blank on covering Randle. If we played press coverage, we would've far better off.

 

[redskinsfan]

Really? So please tell me about all of those tackles that Barry missed. How about how Barry had a major impact on the lack of a ground game for the Redskins. You also seem to conveniently neglect the fact that the Redskins secondary is beat up in a major way at this time. This should be improved next season with the return of certain players as well as adding key players.

I also am amazed at how you just ignore the fact that a pro bowl QB like Rodgers can make on field adjustments throughout the games & also his elusiveness is a huge factor that cannot usually be countered by coaching.

BTW - many of those so called experts who picked the Redskins to win yesterday were the same ones who picked them to be last in the NFC-E earlier in the year so I don't really care what they say.

The secondary has been beat up for the entire year! Yet that secondary, playing press coverage against far better passing attacks this year than the Pack (e.g., the Giants), were able to shut them down. Why didn't Barry try that? He basically played a bend-but-don't-break defense against Rodgers. And you simply can't do that.

As for those picking the game, there's a big, big difference in picking a game than what happens during the course of a season.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

The secondary has been beat up for the entire year! Yet that secondary, playing press coverage against far better passing attacks this year than the Pack (e.g., the Giants), were able to shut them down. Why didn't Barry try that? He basically played a bend-but-don't-break defense against Rodgers. And you simply can't do that.

As for those picking the game, there's a big, big difference in picking a game than what happens during the course of a season.

Far better passing attacks? Really? The only QBs this season that remotely approach Rodgers are for the Pats and Panthers & both torched the Redskins secondary (you could make a case for Brees but the Saints are a non factor at this time).

I am baffled as to why you don't see the difference in some NFC-E regular season game and a playoff game against one of the better QBs in NFL history. Don't be fooled by some of Rodgers recent issues - he is still one of the better QBs in game. You really need to view this more objectively & cut the Redskins coaches and players a little slack. This season far surpassed the expectations of just about everyone.

 

[j_y19]

The secondary has been beat up for the entire year! Yet that secondary, playing press coverage against far better passing attacks this year than the Pack (e.g., the Giants), were able to shut them down. Why didn't Barry try that? He basically played a bend-but-don't-break defense against Rodgers. And you simply can't do that.

As for those picking the game, there's a big, big difference in picking a game than what happens during the course of a season.

Dude, you really need to let this go. You are starting to sound like your a ranting lunatic. Everyone understands your point, they just disagree with you. Your point, in a nut shell, is if what you are doing isn't working, you need to try something different. Am I correct? If so, we all hear you. But you don't appear to hear our point. We couldn't employ the scheme you espouse because we didn't have the talent. We do what you want and we will end up giving up big play after big play. So Barry decided that he would rather make them try and kill us at 8 yards a play as opposed to 40 yards a play. Death by 1000 cuts or by 1 cut. Pick your poison. We also understand that you don't agree with us. That's ok. Doesn't make us right and you wrong, or vice versa.

What i, and others, have tried to do is have you step back and look at the bigger picture. Yesterday's game wasn't over but 2 hours before you are calling for a coaches head. Most are trying to get you to reconsider the knee jerk reaction and look at the bigger picture. This season was a success for this team. The defense needs work, no doubt. But just getting back the 6 starters that are on IR should go a long way. And yes, Barry my turn out to be a bum. But let him fail under his own merits, not because he had to try and field a defense held together with gum and string against the best QB in the league.

Just take a breath and let the emotion pass before we make and drastic changes...that's basically what we are all saying.

 

[Sportster 72]

. Doesn't make us right and you wrong, or vice versa.

.

Now hold on j_y .... I was RIGHT!!!! A little humor can be good.

 

[redskinsfan]

Far better passing attacks? Really? The only QBs this season that remotely approach Rodgers are for the Pats and Panthers & both torched the Redskins secondary (you could make a case for Brees but the Saints are a non factor at this time).

I am baffled as to why you don't see the difference in some NFC-E regular season game and a playoff game against one of the better QBs in NFL history. Don't be fooled by some of Rodgers recent issues - he is still one of the better QBs in game. You really need to view this more objectively & cut the Redskins coaches and players a little slack. This season far surpassed the expectations of just about everyone.

You're still not getting the point. I've already noted that Rodgers is not just one of the better QBs in the game, he's probably, at this point, the best. However, for you to categorically dismiss his "recent issues" as a relevant, if not, a prevailing determinant in the game is folly, especially where his production arc hit near rock bottom and his body language had approached that point as well. The fact that he played poorly in the first quarter and that his overall stats were pedestrian strongly impugn your attempt to engraft his play in general and in the past to his production yesterday. Indeed, your reference to Drew Brees strongly reinforces this point. Brees, like Rodgers, is still a great QB. But, as you also noted, he was having issues with the passing game. In that game, and I'll credit Barry on this, we were able to cobble together a gameplan to meet the firepower presented to us by a first-ballot Hall of Famer, principally by taking advantage of circumstances that prevailed in that game.

Unfortunately, Barry couldn't adjust to two quarters of rather simple, small ball. During that time, Rodgers was able to right his balky ship and get the Pack back into the game. And that's one big reason why we lost the game. Again, you want to conflate how Rodgers has played in the past with the specific trends and arcs applicable to the game yesterday. Those played very well in our favor, especially where we could've played press coverage. Barry didn't adjust and Rodgers took advantage in the second and third quarter. With our defense gassed in the fourth quarter, the Pack's running game took over.