Gordon

[Xponentialchaos]

Wish they would hurry up with the ruling. Big draft coming up and I'd like to know a little more about what I'm investing in.

 

[TKOSpikes]

Don't hold your breath xpo. I imagine they'll take the full allotted time.

 

[Xponentialchaos]

Yea most likely. I'm gonna roll with assuming an 8-week suspension.

 

[TREFF]

Yea most likely. I'm gonna roll with assuming an 8-week suspension.

I woud roll assuming a year. . Let someone else fill up a roster spot for the entire regular season with a guy who isn't playing, and at best "might" be back in 8-10 weeks (also consider that's 8-10 weeks being AWAY from the team. . No meetings, no practices, no walk throughs.. nothing think he'll be a stud his first week active? First 2 weeks? Plus a QB who by that time will probably be the rookie Manziel who he'll have no timing with ) and see how far that gets 'em

 

[Xponentialchaos]

It's all speculation, but I'm hearing a lot of talk about him NOT being suspended for the full year. But if he is...

Seasonal: If he gets suspended for the year, then you drop him. You're not stuck with him.
Dynasty: If he gets suspended for the year, you hang onto him because IF he gets his act cleaned up, he's a monster the following year.

Look what he did last year with Campbell/Weeden/Hoyer in 14 games. He lead the league in receiving yards. If I can get him for the later half of the season, including fantasy playoffs where they would presumably be more in sync, I'm happy with it.

Lots of risk, just can't reach too much for him in seasonal leagues. But I'm taking the gamble in dynasty.

 

[TREFF]

It's all speculation, but I'm hearing a lot of talk about him NOT being suspended for the full year. But if he is...

Seasonal: If he gets suspended for the year, then you drop him. You're not stuck with him.
Dynasty: If he gets suspended for the year, you hang onto him because IF he gets his act cleaned up, he's a monster the following year.

Look what he did last year with Campbell/Weeden/Hoyer in 14 games. He lead the league in receiving yards. If I can get him for the later half of the season, including fantasy playoffs where they would presumably be more in sync, I'm happy with it.

Lots of risk, just can't reach too much for him in seasonal leagues. But I'm taking the gamble in dynasty.

That, I can get behind. . Surely this will get his head screwed on at least halfway right. . Right?

 

[Xponentialchaos]

If I were to put a percentage on him getting his head screwed on...I'd say 50%. What about you?

I'm not afraid of Manziel screwing up his value significantly given what he has done with his previous QB's. So that's a 50% chance that he's a fantasy monster in my book, in a dynasty league.

 

[TREFF]

Ha.. I'm not sure I want to speculate much on Johnny Football.. but unless he's just an absolute bust, no I don't think he'll hurt Gordon much. . If Hoyer Weeden and whoever can give him production, so can Manziel. Apparently he and Megaton are the rare exceptions where they can be elite even with crap at QB.

As for his head. . He is the only thing standing in his own way. . I'd give him 50/50 also. Dude has to change his life, friends, everything

 

[TREFF]

Josh Gordon | CLE
(August 7, 2014 1:09 PM EDT)
Profootballtalk reports the sides have yet to discuss a settlement in the Josh Gordon suspension appeal.
It means the case is still an all-or-nothing proposition for Gordon, who is staring at a year-long suspension or no ban at all if a settlement isn't reached. There's still time for the sides to come to the bargaining table, but it's not a great sign for Gordon that talks have yet to take place. It's possible the league isn't interested in a deal.


As I mentioned earlier. . Given the language of the CBA.. I'm not sure how this could be anything but an all or nothing deal. Either it's a violation of the drug policy, or it isn't. And if it is, the punishment is clearly defined, there is no discretion for Goodell to use.

 

[wilwhite]

Dude's 23 now - was 22 when this came up. A kid, essentially. He's careless and he likes to weed it up - two things that can easily change in people as they get a little older. 50/50 is about right for us, but people closer to him probably have a better prediction.

 

[Xponentialchaos]

All or nothing? That doesn't sound right. Then why is there talk from the media about the possibility of an 8-game suspension?

I'm looking at NFL drug policy and I'm not seeing where all or nothing is coming from. Still looking.

 

[wilwhite]

I think the appeal is all or nothing. Either the original penalty is accepted or it's wiped out.

By the way, from what I understand, the DUI is a completely separate penalty track, where Gordon is a first-time offender so there would be no suspension from that.

But I think that prior to the appeal decision, there can be a separate agreement - much like pleading out in the criminal system for a lower sentence.

 

[Barilko]

Lucky for me i moved out Gordon in my keeper league

Lucky me Not So Fast!!!!

I moved him for David Wilson......

 

[Xponentialchaos]

I think the appeal is all or nothing. Either the original penalty is accepted or it's wiped out.

By the way, from what I understand, the DUI is a completely separate penalty track, where Gordon is a first-time offender so there would be no suspension from that.

But I think that prior to the appeal decision, there can be a separate agreement - much like pleading out in the criminal system for a lower sentence.

Gotcha. That makes sense.

 

[TREFF]

All or nothing? That doesn't sound right. Then why is there talk from the media about the possibility of an 8-game suspension?

I'm looking at NFL drug policy and I'm not seeing where all or nothing is coming from. Still looking.

Just echo what Will said. . The drug policy is pretty clear. .1st offense, enter treatment, basically kept under wraps. . Second offense 4 game suspension, 3rd offense "banishment" for one calender year with possibility of reinstatement.
Gordon, was at stage 2 given his suspension last year. A third violation, which is what's in question, is the banishment. The appeal is to attempt to clear the third violation. If successful, no third violation exists, therefore no suspension. If the appeal is not successful, the 3rd violation stands, and he's "banished". In other words. .All or nothing.

But again, like Will said, they could be attempting to negotiate some sort of bargain where this violation of the drug policy is turned into a personal conduct violation given the circumstances of "second hand smoke", in which Goodell had a lot more room to maneuver and assess a different penalty. Why on earth the NFL would bother negotiating is beyond me, Gordon has zero leverage. It would have to be complete mercy if it's anything but all or nothing.

 

[wilwhite]

Why on earth the NFL would bother negotiating is beyond me, Gordon has zero leverage.

It's partially a question of what the NFL would like the result to be, even if it looks like they would win the appeal. Anything that keeps the weed-vs.-wifebeater discussion alive is poison to the league. My guess is that they would like to bring it down to a very small number of games, while still looking like hard-ass no-nonsense disciplinarians. Tricky position for Goodell. Eight games still feels like a lot in comparison to two for Rice - I bet with four or six games the issue would go away faster.

Remember that Gordon only missed two games for Stage 2.

Another thing in Gordon's favor is that of two samples, one was barely over the NFL limit and one was actually under.

 

[TREFF]

It's partially a question of what the NFL would like the result to be, even if it looks like they would win the appeal. Anything that keeps the weed-vs.-wifebeater discussion alive is poison to the league. My guess is that they would like to bring it down to a very small number of games, while still looking like hard-ass no-nonsense disciplinarians. Tricky position for Goodell. Eight games still feels like a lot in comparison to two for Rice - I bet with four or six games the issue would go away faster.

Remember that Gordon only missed two games for Stage 2.

Another thing in Gordon's favor is that of two samples, one was barely over the NFL limit and one was actually under.

I really don't get the whole comparison of Rice and Gordon. Seems like an really defensible argument to me:
Reporter: Mr. Goodell, how do you justify a year suspension for Gordon, when Ray Rice only received 2 games?
Goodell: We're talking about a habitual offender who in his short career has had numerous offenses and a guy who in his somewhat lengthy career has had an impeccable record to this point. Josh received a second and third chance before this instance, Ray Rice is being treated the same.
I dunno maybe it's just me, but I really don't see how a rational person can draw logical comparisons between the two.

 

[TKOSpikes]

Rules. Offenses. Strikes. It is written in stone...but I think thr comparison just comes from morale. The two games for Rice is condoning a woman abuser. I understand the first offense thing, but from a life perspective, Rice only getting two games looks really bad on the NFL. Even without real life punishment.

It kind of makes the policy look terrible. To be so against weed is narrow minded and coming from the laws (pathetic as they are) of real life. For a guy to be allowed to have a beer but not a joint is so ridiculous that it's time to change.

Yes the CBA is what it is, so there's that, but it's terrible that a weed smoker is more harshly dealt with than a woman beater.