Rookies being a starter

[Kevin12773]

Nope, he just does his promoting acts during press confrences, on twitter and other social media. As far as Rak not being a leader, how do you know this?? Because he hasnt gone into a press confrence and proclaimed he is the leader of this team?? Or because he hasnt had the audacity to proclaim that HE gives this team the best chance to win?? Im just curious, what makes you think he isnt a leader??

Shark don't bother... Waste of time

 

[TCB]

Nope, he just does his promoting acts during press confrences, on twitter and other social media. As far as Rak not being a leader, how do you know this?? Because he hasnt gone into a press confrence and proclaimed he is the leader of this team?? Or because he hasnt had the audacity to proclaim that HE gives this team the best chance to win?? Im just curious, what makes you think he isnt a leader??

The leader can't be forced(Santonio Holmes is a wonderful example). Rak not being a leader, does not make him a bad guy. He may need to focus all of his attention on his own craft. However, if If you or anyone else wants to go with Rak leading by example, then he has to do a better job at playing a full 60 minutes. Otherwise, he is underachieving. Great potential gets you nothing if you don't use it right. He did really good for 10 plays this past season. And give up the selfish sack celebration. Until you make on 3rd down and we have the lead maybe? Maybe?

Don't sleep on Trent Murphy. Everything we have seen shows he is already more of a well rounded player than Rak. Plays the run better, has 18 more moves than Rak, and has a better hands. He will tip balls, and grab a few.

I can't reply until tomorrow more than likely, so peace until then.

 

[Sharkinva]

Shark don't bother... Waste of time

Kev... you know me. I hold every player to the same standards. I freely admit I think we made a mistake in the deal for RG3, but I am not actively or passively hoping for his failure.

 

[TCB]

Shark don't bother... Waste of time

Who the fvck are you?
Don't worry Jesus loves you.

 

[Sportster 72]

... and the debate rages on.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

How in the world did a thread about which rookies might start for the Redskins turn into a heated argument about Orakpo? Too funny. I suppose that it started because of Murphy, but after a few posts Murphy is not even mentioned.

HTTR

 

[TCB]

How in the world did a thread about which rookies might start for the Redskins turn into a heated argument about Orakpo? Too funny. I suppose that it started because of Murphy, but after a few posts Murphy is not even mentioned.

HTTR

If we don't have a few people with alternative views here, this place will look like the Stanford board.
Also, I have brought Murphy into the equation several times, but people here are so scared him might replace Rak they want to stick to the Rak is god argument.

 

[TCB]

saying i wont challenge the banner is lame and a position taken by someone losing the debate . i have criticized skins players , the FO over then decade and 1/2 i have been posting

Rak isnt self promoting anything . the vast majority of his career he has been a solid citizen and certainly hasnt bragged about himself

i dont write off a 2nd year qb and i dont dismiss a 3x PB player

No offense, but you are one of the biggest homers here. I know you don't like Haslett, but hearing you say you criticize players may be a little stretch. If you have done so, it doesn't seem like you over sold it enough.
On the banner deal. You know that won't change until after this season so do pretend to be all high and mighty about it. I was just having fun with that, and you know it.

Here are a few more Facts about Rak's probowls.
2010 Reserve
Replacement starter; selected as reserve
2011 Alternate
Replacement selection due to injury or vacancy
Replacement starter; selected as reserve
2013
Ahmad Brooks dropped out after the championship loss to Seattle.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

If we don't have a few people with alternative views here, this place will look like the Stanford board.
Also, I have brought Murphy into the equation several times, but people here are so scared him might replace Rak they want to stick to the Rak is god argument.

Just curious tcbidness as to what your parameters for "elite" and "good" are? And where you place Rak, since you've said you think he's good, just not elite.

In your eyes how do you define it?

Is "elite" top 5? Top 10?

Is "good" top 10? Top 25?

 

[j_y19]

Just curious tcbidness as to what your parameters for "elite" and "good" are? And where you place Rak, since you've said you think he's good, just not elite.

In your eyes how do you define it?

Is "elite" top 5? Top 10?

Is "good" top 10? Top 25?

I'll give you my opinion....elite is top 5 and perennial PB starter. Very good is 6-12 (which is where I place RAK and Kerrigan, although they excel at different things). Good is 13-20.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

I'll give you my opinion....elite is top 5 and perennial PB starter. Very good is 6-12 (which is where I place RAK and Kerrigan, although they excel at different things). Good is 13-20.

That's pretty much how I see it too. Using those parameters:

I think Rak is very good, bordering on elite, if he was used differently. Hopefully he will be this upcoming year, and we will see greater statistical production for him. But stats aren't everything in my book. They're simply a measuring tool. They never tell the whole story and you have to look outside of stats alone for a true measurement of Raks abilities. How does having him on the field affect other play? Is he a good leader and team player? High character guy? These are just a few additional Qs that need to be assessed.

Ya can't compare apples to oranges. Rak drops in coverage more and is used much differently than some of the " talked about, ranked" elite players in his position.

 

[TCB]

Just curious tcbidness as to what your parameters for "elite" and "good" are? And where you place Rak, since you've said you think he's good, just not elite.

In your eyes how do you define it?

Is "elite" top 5? Top 10?

Is "good" top 10? Top 25?

He is in the good-very good range for me. Give me an all pro, or a pro bowl start, and I will throw that elite word around. If he was snubbed but past my personal eye test for elite, I would sing it until even Skinsdad told me to shut up.

 

[Sharkinva]

He is in the good-very good range for me. Give me an all pro, or a pro bowl start, and I will throw that elite word around. If he was snubbed but past my personal eye test for elite, I would sing it until even Skinsdad told me to shut up.

Probowls and all pro balloting is a popularity contest that places more value on high lights reels than actually individual or team performance. Case in point, Lavar Arrington was a probowl starter and all pro on a 5-11 team.

 

[TCB]

Probowls and all pro balloting is a popularity contest that places more value on high lights reels than actually individual or team performance. Case in point, Lavar Arrington was a probowl starter and all pro on a 5-11 team.

True, which is why I also added the eye test. If we are going to give our opinions we should at least show that we have watched every play of every game. I have, you have. He doesn't make the elite grade for me, he makes it for you.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

If we don't have a few people with alternative views here, this place will look like the Stanford board.
Also, I have brought Murphy into the equation several times, but people here are so scared him might replace Rak they want to stick to the Rak is god argument.

Chill out. Nobody said anything about alternate views - I was just simply asking about how this thread moved in a totally different direction. Might as well completely rename this thread into "Does Orakpo Deserve a Long Term Contract". Oh well - I was basically joking - NP

 

[skinsdad62]

No offense, but you are one of the biggest homers here. I know you don't like Haslett, but hearing you say you criticize players may be a little stretch. If you have done so, it doesn't seem like you over sold it enough.
On the banner deal. You know that won't change until after this season so do pretend to be all high and mighty about it. I was just having fun with that, and you know it.

Here are a few more Facts about Rak's probowls.
2010 Reserve
Replacement starter; selected as reserve
2011 Alternate
Replacement selection due to injury or vacancy
Replacement starter; selected as reserve
2013
Ahmad Brooks dropped out after the championship loss to Seattle.

and that means what ? he was top 5 to be there

 

[Sharkinva]

True, which is why I also added the eye test. If we are going to give our opinions we should at least show that we have watched every play of every game. I have, you have. He doesn't make the elite grade for me, he makes it for you.

I base my eye test off of what he is asked to do as a whole in the defense, not just as a passrusher. By comparing his numbers to some one who is not asked to do as much as he is, yet has higher sack numbers Orakpo as well as Kerrigan would both fail the eye test before its even begun. If all they were asked to do was rush the passer, ignore contain and never drop into pass coverage, I think both would be well above 15 sacks per season. I base that off of them only getting home 5% of the time on the extra 150 pass rushing attempts each would have if they were to be tasked with just rushing the passer and all else be damned.

 

[TCB]

and that means what ? he was top 5 to be there

In the conference around 5-6. 10-12 if you look at the whole league for outside linebackers. That is by pro bowl ranking.

 

[skinsdad62]

In the conference around 5-6. 10-12 if you look at the whole league for outside linebackers. That is by pro bowl ranking.

sorry last season it was the entire NFL not conferences as the coaches rice and sanders selected them

when they selected them by conference you had 3 players picked and the next were alternates

 

[TCB]

I base my eye test off of what he is asked to do as a whole in the defense, not just as a passrusher. By comparing his numbers to some one who is not asked to do as much as he is, yet has higher sack numbers Orakpo as well as Kerrigan would both fail the eye test before its even begun. If all they were asked to do was rush the passer, ignore contain and never drop into pass coverage, I think both would be well above 15 sacks per season. I base that off of them only getting home 5% of the time on the extra 150 pass rushing attempts each would have if they were to be tasked with just rushing the passer and all else be damned.

Neither are Elite for me. Kerrigan had more of an impact this past season and was recognized for it. If you want Rak to be a pass rushing specialist and he gets home 15 times, we can talk. Does that mean that we will sit him on 1st and 2nd down? How will he play the run? Does he play the screen pass well. Getting to rush the passer will help his stats. I want to see how he does on every play.