Rangers vs Bombers game 2.

[1502tuley]

Numbers also don't matter if you don't know how to divide

Um, he has 9 save attempts and blew 2 of them.

2/9 = 22.2% smart ass.

 

[romeo212000]

Um, he has 9 save attempts and blew 2 of them.

. He's only blown one save attempt in 6 attempts.

 

[jta4437]

Um, he has 9 save attempts and blew 2 of them.

He's appeared in 9 games only 6 save chances

The ChiSox game was tied when he gave up the HR, NOT a save chance

How can you argue the effectiveness of a closer if you don't even know how a save works?!

 

[romeo212000]

He's appeared in 9 games only 6 save chances

The ChiSox game was tied when he gave up the HR, NOT a save chance

How can you argue the effectiveness of a closer if you don't even know how a save works?!

I wish I could rep you again.

 

[jta4437]

 

[1502tuley]

He's appeared in 9 games only 6 save chances

The ChiSox game was tied when he gave up the HR, NOT a save chance

How can you argue the effectiveness of a closer if you don't even know how a save works?!

Sorry if we were leading by too many runs in two of the games for it to be considered a save. The reality is that makes it even worse. And sorry that I counted the Sox as a blown save, but the reality is we were tied when he was given the ball and behind afterward. He gave up the winning run.

Please explain to me how a closer has been nails if they have given up 9 hits and 5 runs in 9 innings of play? That's a very simple question

 

[jta4437]

He has a 1.15 WHIP, thats not bad at all, actually quite good, but could be better for a closer, he's given up 3 of his 5 runs in ONE GAME, and the other one was the HR, on a GOOD pitch, just better hitting, it happens, get over it

I've admitted the Seattle blown save was a terrible game, and its a HUGE reason for the way his numbers look now

 

[romeo212000]

did you really just throw a save % at me 18 games into the season. Rivera's numbers don't look great right now either. Take the two losses he fully deserves out of your incredibly small sample size and you'll see what I'm saying. Since getting tagged in that ugly outing against Seattle he hasn't allowed a run in five outings and is 3/3 in save opportunities.

I didn't say he's been nails this year (18 games). I said he's been very solid lately and he'll be fine as closer.

Sorry if we were leading by too many runs in two of the games for it to be considered a save. The reality is that makes it even worse. And sorry that I counted the Sox as a blown save, but the reality is we were tied when he was given the ball and behind afterward. He gave up the winning run.

Please explain to me how a closer has been nails if they have given up 9 hits and 5 runs in 9 innings of play? That's a very simple question

Please read the post I quoted here and respond to it. These are the numbers I'm talking about.

I'll say it again. No runs allowed in last 5 outings and 3/3 in save opportunities. Take the Seattle game out and his numbers look pretty damn good right now.

 

[jta4437]

Minus the Seattle game

7.2 Innings pitch, 1.17 ERA (1ER) .78 WHIP (5 hits & 1BB), 7 Ks, 5 for 5 in saves

 

[romeo212000]

Minus the Seattle game

7.2 Innings pitch, 1.17 ERA (1ER) .78 WHIP (5 hits & 1BB), 7 Ks

Thank you. There's your numbers minus one ugly outing Tuley. Pretty tough to argue with that don't ya think.

 

[1502tuley]

Let's just leave it with me saying that he still scares me when he comes into a game. Maybe my fears regarding him are not justified. I do realize that I am cutting him zero slack. What I will say is that i feel better about him this week than I did last week. Maybe I'm still pissed at him for blowing our chance of going 13 - 0. I should not expect perfection, however close the rest of the team appeared to be during those first 13 games.

 

[romeo212000]

Let's just leave it with me saying that he still scares me when he comes into a game. Maybe my fears regarding him are not justified. I do realize that I am cutting him zero slack. What I will say is that i feel better about him this week than I did last week. Maybe I'm still pissed at him for blowing our chance to go 13 - 0. I should not expect perfection, however close the rest of the team appeared to be during those first 13 games.

Fair enough. I just wanted to show you how well he's actually done when you take one bad performance out. Nobody's busting Holland's balls but he threw a gutter ball yesterday. Does that mean we lose faith in him? No. We just expect better next time.

 

[1502tuley]

Sorry if we were leading by too many runs in two of the games for it to be considered a save. The reality is that makes it even worse. And sorry that I counted the Sox as a blown save, but the reality is we were tied when he was given the ball and behind afterward. He gave up the winning run.

Please explain to me how a closer has been nails if they have given up 9 hits and 5 runs in 9 innings of play? That's a very simple question

Thank you. There's your numbers minus one ugly outing Tuley. Pretty tough to argue with that don't ya think.

Point taken.

 

[jta4437]

XX

 

[1502tuley]

Fair enough. I just wanted to show you how well he's actually done when you take one bad performance out. Nobody's busting Holland's balls but he threw a gutter ball yesterday. Does that mean we lose faith in him? No. We just expect better next time.

I agree completely. I guess my issue is that holland has history here. I know what he can bring to the table. Nathan on the other hand is coming off surgery that may or may not allow him to live up to his promise. I just hope that we aren't hitching our wagon to a gimpy horse.

 

[fordman84]

I'm in the camp that Nathan scares me. Stats aside, he hasn't gained my trust yet. Does he have good numbers? Yes. To me it seems like he needs a lot of pitches to get there and has guys on base more than I would like.

One of the sabremetric guys, what stats are there that are for closers only? Is there a stat for how often the closer is facing the winning run? Meaning up by one and allow a base runner, but would ignore when he is facing the tying run who is just up at the plate. Basically how often a closer allows the tying run on base, I guess. So if his team is up by 3 and he lets a guy get on base, it wouldn't show in this stat.

 

[romeo212000]

I'm in the camp that Nathan scares me. Stats aside, he hasn't gained my trust yet. Does he have good numbers? Yes. To me it seems like he needs a lot of pitches to get there and has guys on base more than I would like.

One of the sabremetric guys, what stats are there that are for closers only? Is there a stat for how often the closer is facing the winning run? Meaning up by one and allow a base runner, but would ignore when he is facing the tying run who is just up at the plate. Basically how often a closer allows the tying run on base, I guess. So if his team is up by 3 and he lets a guy get on base, it wouldn't show in this stat.

I honestly have no idea about the saber metrics. However, I'll say Nathan hasn't completely earned my trust either. I'm going to give him every opportunity to succeed.

 

[guitarmy21b]

This is a really good article about closers

With more pitchers breaking down, time to rethink modern bullpen - Tom Verducci - SI.com

 

[jta4437]

In 4 of his 6 save chances he's recorded a 1-2-3 inning, One was the Seattle game, and in the other he allowed 1 hit

I'd pretty much say he's doing what he's asked to as a closer

 

[fordman84]

In 4 of his 6 save chances he's recorded a 1-2-3 inning, One was the Seattle game, and in the other he allowed 1 hit

I'd pretty much say he's doing what he's asked to as a closer

I'd agree, but he has only done it for Texas and since his surgery for 18 games. If it makes you feel any better, I still don't trust Nefti in the starting role or Yu for that matter. All three have been at or above expectations of mine coming into the season, but all three have roughly a dozen combined showings.

I don't trust players just because they did well in the minors, or Japan, or signed a big contract, or used to be good. I trust them when they show that they can go out and do their job very well day in and day out RIGHT NOW. I'd give Yu a B right now, Feliz a B+, and Nathan an A- right now. Nathan has had the most opportunities and done well in a vast majority of them. Yu started shaky but has been better, and I'd like to see a few more games where he walks 3 or fewer. Feliz has been stellar, but I want to see what happens when he gets shelled in one inning and has to go back out there.

I didn't trust Nap for most of last year, until he showed that he can not only deliver, but can deliver when needed. This isn't just ani-Nathanism for me. This is just me wanting to see a player do well for this team before I jump on his bandwagon.