POLL Who is going to win the NFC West?

[HaroldSeattle]

If the OL can get some things together yes they have enough pieces to really compete for the Super Bowl. I just don't expect them to make a big enough leap to become that type of team. Coaching staffs always say great things about their team in the offseason so I don't take that to mean much. I would have to see it in the first few weeks to actually believe it.

Well I'll have to see it also. However I do think the plan was to revamp the OL last year and take their lumps, with the expectation that in year two they would start reaping the benefits. Guess we will find out soon enough.

 

[chf]

Ok maybe that was the wrong choice of words. Better way of putting it is the because of the OL and his style of play he takes a few more hits. Now I know that he does a good job of minimizing how big of a hit but he still takes quite a few. Size honestly doesn't matter at that point as we see guys like Andrew Luck and Big Ben both breaking down because of trying to run around and buy some more time for a big play. Luck is young and Big Ben has only played in 16 games 3 times during his career. The guys that last long-term are the pure pocket passers that get the ball out so quickly they just don't take the wear and tear throughout the season. Heck Cam Newton maybe the biggest/strongest QB in the league and how many surgeries has he had already in his career?

The last half of 15 was him getting the ball out earlier. If not for Suh stepping on Wilson in game #1, I think that was the plan for 16 as well.

But even if the line was good/great, I don't want him to abandon running entirely. I got to watch Flutie in his prime up here, and Wilson can do that same stuff. Simply demoralize a defence. D plays PERFECT on a particular play, and Wilson breaks it down anyway on 3rd and long.

Do I want him doing that out of necessity? Nope. But I don't want him to not take a 12 yard scramble out of bounds on some off chance he might get hurt. He can get Theismanned playing in the pocket too.

 

[cdumler7]

The last half of 15 was him getting the ball out earlier. If not for Suh stepping on Wilson in game #1, I think that was the plan for 16 as well.

But even if the line was good/great, I don't want him to abandon running entirely. I got to watch Flutie in his prime up here, and Wilson can do that same stuff. Simply demoralize a defence. D plays PERFECT on a particular play, and Wilson breaks it down anyway on 3rd and long.

Do I want him doing that out of necessity? Nope. But I don't want him to not take a 12 yard scramble out of bounds on some off chance he might get hurt. He can get Theismanned playing in the pocket too.

I get all that. And I wouldn't want him to abandon the run either. Heck the Broncos might be starting a guy that is more athlete than QB right now in Paxton Lynch this year and I want him to use his feet when he deems it necessary. All I'm saying is QB's like that will take a few more hits than the guys that consistently get the ball out quickly like a Manning or Brady. There is a reason they can last 20 years in the league. Even they have suffered season ending injuries though but just not as consistent as you see Cam needing surgery or Big Ben having to sit out a quarter of the season or now with Andrew Luck where I'm hearing he still can't even throw a football yet.

 

[chf]

I get all that. And I wouldn't want him to abandon the run either. Heck the Broncos might be starting a guy that is more athlete than QB right now in Paxton Lynch this year and I want him to use his feet when he deems it necessary. All I'm saying is QB's like that will take a few more hits than the guys that consistently get the ball out quickly like a Manning or Brady. There is a reason they can last 20 years in the league. Even they have suffered season ending injuries though but just not as consistent as you see Cam needing surgery or Big Ben having to sit out a quarter of the season or now with Andrew Luck where I'm hearing he still can't even throw a football yet.

I suspect we're somewhat talking past each other.

Him 'getting the ball out early' like a Brady was what he did in the last half of 15, (and that line wasn't good by any stretch).

So I'm saying that I don't think it's a given that he can't have a LONG productive career. His 'style' of play doesn't mean he has to take big hits.

Now in any sport where a collision in the hole can = falling out of 2nd story window, ANYTHING is possible on the injury front.

 

[chf]

To add a thought, Rodgers is really good at running in key spots, AND at extending plays with his legs and then heaving the ball. A perfect example is the completion to beat the Cowboys.

And yet nobody thinks Rodgers is bound to get hurt making those kinds of plays.

 

[SJ76]

Used to be the best division in football for a long long while.

Now it's really up for grabs. Young team could come out of nowhere, but thinking the Rams could actually win the division makes me laugh. Plus all the doubt in here makes it obvious


Rams it is!!

 

[cowboys5xsbs]

Seattle still has the best team IMO. Arizona will keep it competitive and the Rams will steal a game but Seattle is still the class of the west.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Citing no Jeff Fisher as the Rams' reason for not winning the division is a microcosm of @NWPATSFAN's posts about the NFCW. You do understand July 9th, 7/9, is known as Jeff Fisher Day, right?

Was he successful 7-9 times on trick plays run against Seattle?

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

Was he successful 7-9 times on trick plays run against Seattle?

Only 6 from what I can remember Probably 9.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

I suspect we're somewhat talking past each other.

Him 'getting the ball out early' like a Brady was what he did in the last half of 15, (and that line wasn't good by any stretch).

So I'm saying that I don't think it's a given that he can't have a LONG productive career. His 'style' of play doesn't mean he has to take big hits.

Now in any sport where a collision in the hole can = falling out of 2nd story window, ANYTHING is possible on the injury front.

Can't believe I'm agreeing with you but I am a good portion of Wilson's success can be contributed to his ability to scramble and avoid taking a big hit. He does it better than anyone. I think to limit his ability/desire to run hamstrings him and the team. Assuming he has two good wheels. They don't need to be new, just have a lot of thread on them.

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

Can't believe I'm agreeing with you but I am a good portion of Wilson's success can be contributed to his ability to scramble and avoid taking a big hit. He does it better than anyone. I think to limit his ability/desire to run hamstrings him and the team. Assuming he has two good wheels. They don't need to be new, just have a lot of thread on them.

Agreed. Don't change unless change is needed. Moving RW around and using his quickness is what has made Seattle successful on offense. When the time comes and his speed and quickness slows down a bit, then redesign the offense to fit him.

 

[Podunkparte]

Was he successful 7-9 times on trick plays run against Seattle?

Fake punts inside your own 20 yard line is truly the sign of a genius unemployed head coach.

 

[dkmightyhammer]

The last half of 15 was him getting the ball out earlier. If not for Suh stepping on Wilson in game #1, I think that was the plan for 16 as well.

But even if the line was good/great, I don't want him to abandon running entirely. I got to watch Flutie in his prime up here, and Wilson can do that same stuff. Simply demoralize a defence. D plays PERFECT on a particular play, and Wilson breaks it down anyway on 3rd and long.

Do I want him doing that out of necessity? Nope. But I don't want him to not take a 12 yard scramble out of bounds on some off chance he might get hurt. He can get Theismanned playing in the pocket too.

I was in the Fox and Firkin on 17th ave in Calgary with some buddies in the mid 90's and a bunch of the Stampeders came in with the Grey Cup. Stu Laird was pouring beer into fans mouths with the cup. I even got a drink out of it. So I look to my right and Doug Flutie is standing right beside me, we are arm to arm. I know they listed him at 5'10" but I couldn't get over how short he was in person. I'm about 6'0 and I seemed to tower over him. Cool guy though. And I'm not even a Stamps fan.

 

[JMR]

If the OL can get some things together yes they have enough pieces to really compete for the Super Bowl. I just don't expect them to make a big enough leap to become that type of team. Coaching staffs always say great things about their team in the offseason so I don't take that to mean much. I would have to see it in the first few weeks to actually believe it.

I think that's a fair take -- the skepticism on the OL is reasonable. Last year it had new starters at every position except RT, and no one had more than 2 years of experience going in. The LT wasn't even really a football player before becoming a starting lineman in the NFL. The team has taken similar (but maybe not quite as extreme) risks with the line in the past, but RW and Lynch were able to mask it with their playmaking ability. When Wilson had the bad ankle sprain in week 1 and then the MCL injury a couple games later -- either of which is normally a 4-6 week recovery -- it helped expose the inexperienced line and the offense was derailed for pretty much the entire season, yet they still made it to the divisional round for the 5th straight year. 4 of the 5 starters from last year are coming back (2 of them are changing positions, but it's back to what they played in college), and you at least start the season with a healthy QB and more talent at RB than what you saw last year with the add of Lacy. Lots of reasons to think there's a good probability the line is going to be better.

 

[chf]

I was in the Fox and Firkin on 17th ave in Calgary with some buddies in the mid 90's and a bunch of the Stampeders came in with the Grey Cup. Stu Laird was pouring beer into fans mouths with the cup. I even got a drink out of it. So I look to my right and Doug Flutie is standing right beside me, we are arm to arm. I know they listed him at 5'10" but I couldn't get over how short he was in person. I'm about 6'0 and I seemed to tower over him. Cool guy though. And I'm not even a Stamps fan.

I worked for sports @ 11 back in the day, so got to meet Stu a few times, was in the building the day Flutie and co came in with the cup. Good times.

 

[tducey]

Seattle
Arizona
San Francisco
Los Angeles

 

[Southieinnc]

Is it a foregone conclusion they won't field a better OL this year? It was really young and inexperienced last season. Looks like 4 of those 5 starters are returning with an add of Joeckel. Not saying Joeckel is all world or anything, but he's a talent upgrade for this unit. It's quite possible the line won't be much better, but I would say it's at least as likely that it may. You also have an upgraded at RB with Eddie Lacy and -- at least to start -- a healthy Russell Wilson who can help mask problems on the line with his mobility.

All valid points, assuming Fat Eddie is his old self and the O-line improves instead of regressing, and Russell stays healthy and the O-line stays injury free.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

All valid points, assuming Fat Eddie is his old self and the O-line improves instead of regressing, and Russell stays healthy and the O-line stays injury free.

Or Sherman doesn't beat up a coach on the sidelines.

 

[Uhsplit]

Last year it was something like 17 different RB's played for us during the regular season due to injuries. For the 1st time, RW got hurt to a point where it affected his play.
I am confident in seeing much better results this year.
If they report to camp, the OL should be better than last year.
things are looking good IMO.

 

[JMR]

All valid points, assuming Fat Eddie is his old self and the O-line improves instead of regressing, and Russell stays healthy and the O-line stays injury free.

Most of that stuff isn't exactly asking for a lot. RW never really had any sort of significant injury at all until last season, his 5th. I have no expectation that the line will be completely injury free because hardly any line in the league will do that. Lacy being good will definitely help, but Rawls and Prosise are both very capable and bring different skills to the table. Now if they ALL (the RBs) get injured like last year, then the team could be in trouble. If the OL can just be decent or even slightly below average, this offense is going to be pretty good again.