Traitor Mode

[Podunkparte]

You can assault people and cause domestic violence ? You might want to confirm that with Ezekial Elliott. You can do drugs? Might want to confirm that one with Leveon Bell.

"...and not lose fans."

My point is people like you are screaming from the top of your mountain about the travesty of sitting during the National Anthem yet I don't see the 2 threads you created when Ray Rice knocked out his girlfriend. Where are your Aldon Smith threads? Drunk Driving kills thousands. Sitting during a song kills zero.

This hill you choose to die on is absolutely silly compared to the actual injustices that are happening every day around you. The kinds of injustices people like Kaep, Lynch, and Bennett are trying to bring to the public eye by doing something peaceful yet noticeable.

 

[chf]

I hope they do! I've already told my kids I'll sit when he's introduced.

Maybe he feels exactly the same way?

 

[JMR]

Maybe he feels exactly the same way?

Right. And I think he's wrong here. Ends/ways/means fail.

 

[chf]

Right. And I think he's wrong here. Ends/ways/means fail.

Well he (they) are certainly getting pushback. Threads here speak to that. What the long term view will be is uncertain. Cassius Clay took a lot of heat back in the day too.

 

[JMR]

Well he (they) are certainly getting pushback. Threads here speak to that. What the long term view will be is uncertain. Cassius Clay took a lot of heat back in the day too.

He did. I am not sure I would put that on this level. I am 100% ok with MB's message (the reason he says he sat), but I just think his method is misguided.

 

[PolarVortex]

"...and not lose fans."

My point is people like you are screaming from the top of your mountain about the travesty of sitting during the National Anthem yet I don't see the 2 threads you created when Ray Rice knocked out his girlfriend. Where are your Aldon Smith threads? Drunk Driving kills thousands. Sitting during a song kills zero.

This hill you choose to die on is absolutely silly compared to the actual injustices that are happening every day around you. The kinds of injustices people like Kaep, Lynch, and Bennett are trying to bring to the public eye by doing something peaceful yet noticeable.

The top of the Mountain? Mt Rainier? That's the closest mountain to me. I haven't summited Rainier since 2009. It's takes a bit of planning and several days off from work. So, no, sorry, I didn't scream off of Columbia Crest. Maybe next time.

Oh, and, you didn't see two thread I started about Ray Rice? I don't know how you would know that unless you researched my posting history two years back? You, the same guy calls this 'silly nonsense'? You've wasted all this time doing all this research on my posting history because of what you call 'silly nonsense'? Sounds like you are really into and obsessed with silly nonsense. Maybe you should find more productive things to do with your time? Maybe volunteer to help out a woman's shelter or feed hungry kids at a soup kitchen?

BTW, if you really wanted to make a point about NFL players getting DUIs, you should have mentioned Leonard Little, who got a second DUI after killing a woman in a previous DUI-related car crash in which he was at fault and drunk. Just trying to help.

 

[chf]

He did. I am not sure I would put that on this level. I am 100% ok with MB's message (the reason he says he sat), but I just think his method is misguided.

Sure, and as usual, I don't disagree with you much at all. Because even though we may disagree, you're saying what you want to say with respect. Not using the ridiculous emotional language I read in this and other threads. 'Traitor.' Meh.

'Hey there's a better way to make your point' is a useful discussion to have.

'You're a traitor!' Not so much.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Well he (they) are certainly getting pushback. Threads here speak to that. What the long term view will be is uncertain. Cassius Clay took a lot of heat back in the day too.

Yes he did, not sure it did anything constructive though and cost him dearly.

 

[chf]

Yes he did, not sure it did anything constructive though and cost him dearly.

May have to wait years to judge it. Again, Clay/Ali was a fucking pariah in America for a LONG time. I personally find it refreshing that these guys have something at stake, and speak up anyway.

<edit>

I just re-read, and not sure if your second sentence was referring to Clay or to Lynch/Bennet?

 

[JMR]

Sure, and as usual, I don't disagree with you much at all. Because even though we may disagree, you're saying what you want to say with respect. Not using the ridiculous emotional language I read in this and other threads. 'Traitor.' Meh.

'Hey there's a better way to make your point' is a useful discussion to have.

'You're a traitor!' Not so much.

Yeah, "Traitor" is a bit overboard. I try to disagree on here without being disagreeable or disrespectful (even if not reciprocated) but certainly not perfect.

 

[PolarVortex]

He did. I am not sure I would put that on this level. I am 100% ok with MB's message (the reason he says he sat), but I just think his method is misguided.

They are divas, first and foremost. Their contribution to their 'cause' is secondary. Ask them to choose between their NFL paycheck and their convictions, everyone of them will choose their paycheck. They can make a good living outside of football, based on image alone. They don't need the NFL paycheck to keep a roof over their heads and food on the table. But they would still choose that NFL paycheck over their own personal convictions. Their 'protest' is for the wrong reasons. The attention they crave is their primary reason. Their convictions are secondary.

And comparing them to Mohammed Ali is an insult to Ali's legacy. Ali went to jail for what he believed. He lost millions of dollars in endorsements and fights he could have had. These football players, so far, have sacrificed absolutely nothing. And if Kaepernick could do it all over again, knowing what he knows now, he would have stood for the anthem last year. Anyone who does not believe that is naïve.

 

[JMR]

They are divas, first and foremost. Their contribution to their 'cause' is secondary. Ask them to choose between their NFL paycheck and their convictions, everyone of them will choose their paycheck. They can make a good living outside of football, based on image alone. They don't need the NFL paycheck to keep a roof over their heads and food on the table. But they would still choose that NFL paycheck over their own personal convictions. Their 'protest' is for the wrong reasons. The attention they crave is their primary reason. Their convictions are secondary.

And comparing them to Mohammed Ali is an insult to Ali's legacy. Ali went to jail for what he believed. He lost millions of dollars in endorsements and fights he could have had. These football players, so far, have sacrificed absolutely nothing. And if Kaepernick could do it all over again, knowing what he knows now, he would have stood for the anthem last year. Anyone who does not believe that is naïve.

I definitely agree with you on the Kaepernick do-over part. The one thing I do like about what MB has done is that I think it will shoot down the "Kaepernick is being blackballed by the racist NFL" argument. If not shoot it down, definitely blow a big hole in it.

 

[chf]

They are divas, first and foremost. Their contribution to their 'cause' is secondary. Ask them to choose between their NFL paycheck and their convictions, everyone of them will choose their paycheck. They can make a good living outside of football, based on image alone. They don't need the NFL paycheck to keep a roof over their heads and food on the table. But they would still choose that NFL paycheck over their own personal convictions. Their 'protest' is for the wrong reasons. The attention they crave is their primary reason. Their convictions are secondary.

And comparing them to Mohammed Ali is an insult to Ali's legacy. Ali went to jail for what he believed. He lost millions of dollars in endorsements and fights he could have had. These football players, so far, have sacrificed absolutely nothing. And if Kaepernick could do it all over again, knowing what he knows now, he would have stood for the anthem last year. Anyone who does not believe that is naïve.

Heh. Well I didn't know you were Nostradamus.

Cool. Can I ask you about lotto numbers?

--

And given that Kaep has not gotten a contract, how hasn't he lost millions of dollars?

I mean don't bs a bs'er Polar.

 

[chf]

Yeah, "Traitor" is a bit overboard. I try to disagree on here without being disagreeable or disrespectful (even if not reciprocated) but certainly not perfect.

Yeah, I figured you'd take my comment in the spirit it was intended.

 

[PolarVortex]

Heh. Well I didn't know you were Nostradamus.

Cool. Can I ask you about lotto numbers?

--

And given that Kaep has not gotten a contract, how hasn't he lost millions of dollars?

I mean don't bs a bs'er Polar.

Heh. Well I didn't know you were Nostradamus.

Cool. Can I ask you about lotto numbers?

--

And given that Kaep has not gotten a contract, how hasn't he lost millions of dollars?

I mean don't bs a bs'er Polar.

Nodstradumbass was French. I don't like the French. I liken myself more to John Phillip.

 

[chf]

Freedom Fries!

 

[HaroldSeattle]

May have to wait years to judge it. Again, Clay/Ali was a fucking pariah in America for a LONG time. I personally find it refreshing that these guys have something at stake, and speak up anyway.

<edit>

I just re-read, and not sure if your second sentence was referring to Clay or to Lynch/Bennet?

Clay.

 

[chf]

Nostradum

Clay.

Can't agree with that then. His social activism is a BIG part of his legacy.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Nostradum


Can't agree with that then. His social activism is a BIG part of his legacy.

Sure, but what did it change, beside making him famous?

 

[chf]

Sure, but what did it change, beside making him famous?

How'd he go from being a pariah to being a treasured American hero, unless he helped change opinions?

Now I'm certainly NOT saying that Ali was the only factor in that change, but he certainly moved the needle.