The SPURS were better than any team MJ or Kobe beat

[gordontrue]

I won't speak for the OP, but IMO there is a relevant point to comparing this years Spurs to past years Finals losers.

It comes in assessing the failure of the Heat to win the championship and in comparing them to teams from the past who didn't fail. Like I said in an earlier post... If you put Jordan on this Heat team instead of LeBron... I think the Spurs still win. I would the same for the 07 title, but not the '11 title (I think Jordan could've made a difference in that series).

When a team like the Heat fails to a win a championship, much is made of how they failed where great teams in the past didn't. And that's fair.... but its also fair to consider the quality of the competition they failed against.

 

[Malibu]

Who did the Heat have to go through to get to the NBA Finals the last 4 years? Nothing compaired to what the Bulls and Lakers had to do. Just saying. The Lakers teams with Kobe and Shaq in there prime the Spurs would have had no shot. Noone on the Spurs would have handled Shaq.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Who did the Heat have to go through to get to the NBA Finals the last 4 years? Nothing compaired to what the Bulls and Lakers had to do. Just saying. The Lakers teams with Kobe and Shaq in there prime the Spurs would have had no shot. Noone on the Spurs would have handled Shaq.

Maybe they attack and get Shaq in foul trouble?
Maybe they hack Shaq and he misses a ton of FTs?
Point is you just don't know.

 

[trojanfan12]

I won't speak for the OP, but IMO there is a relevant point to comparing this years Spurs to past years Finals losers.

It comes in assessing the failure of the Heat to win the championship and in comparing them to teams from the past who didn't fail. Like I said in an earlier post... If you put Jordan on this Heat team instead of LeBron... I think the Spurs still win. I would the same for the 07 title, but not the '11 title (I think Jordan could've made a difference in that series).

When a team like the Heat fails to a win a championship, much is made of how they failed where great teams in the past didn't. And that's fair.... but its also fair to consider the quality of the competition they failed against.

I disagree. The Spurs won, they are supposed to stack up well vs. teams that lost. To determine how tough the Spurs road was, you compare the Heat to other teams that lost the finals (i.e. "how do they stack up vs. the '91 Lakers?").

If one feels that the current Heat team would have beaten all or most of the teams that those Bulls and Lakers teams went through, then the Spurs had a tougher road. If not, then they didn't have a tougher road.

 

[RobToxin]

I think what Horns is trying to say is ....

in those other situations, nobody ever said those teams lost, but that the Lakers and Bulls won.'

As opposed to the number of people who will focus more on the Heat losing than the Spurs winning this year.

Unfortunately, the majority of people outside San Antonio who are happy that the Spurs won are really happy that the Heat lost. And so that will be their focus.

 

[trojanfan12]

I think what Horns is trying to say is ....

in those other situations, nobody ever said those teams lost, but that the Lakers and Bulls won.'

As opposed to the number of people who will focus more on the Heat losing than the Spurs winning this year.

Unfortunately, the majority of people outside San Antonio who are happy that the Spurs won are really happy that the Heat lost. And so that will be their focus.

As has been pointed out though, that's the way it works when a "Superteam" loses. Detroit beat a Lakers team that had 4 HOF'ers in the starting lineup and no one talked about how the Piston's won, it was about how the Lakers lost.

Same thing happened when the Mavs beat Miami in 2011. It's just how it works.

 

[lakersrule]

Maybe they attack and get Shaq in foul trouble?
Maybe they hack Shaq and he misses a ton of FTs?
Point is you just don't know.

And you just don't know if this year's champion can beat previous season's losers right? You previously mentioned the historic moments the Spurs had, but how do you know they have them against those other teams? It's just a dumb thread. The Heat lost to the better team. No reason to marginalize the past to defend Lebron.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

I won't speak for the OP, but IMO there is a relevant point to comparing this years Spurs to past years Finals losers.

It comes in assessing the failure of the Heat to win the championship and in comparing them to teams from the past who didn't fail. Like I said in an earlier post... If you put Jordan on this Heat team instead of LeBron... I think the Spurs still win. I would the same for the 07 title, but not the '11 title (I think Jordan could've made a difference in that series).

When a team like the Heat fails to a win a championship, much is made of how they failed where great teams in the past didn't. And that's fair.... but its also fair to consider the quality of the competition they failed against.

Maybe there is some something revelant there, but most of the time when you start using words like, "if", and "I think"...it becomes a hypothetical debate more than anything...you can't prove it, so what's the point?

 

[Hornsstampede2.0]

This thread is designed to show how idiotic it is to judge LEBRONS career by his Finals W-L.


The W-L needs to look at the opponents as well.


If Lebron played the 00 Pacer, 01 Sixers, and 02 Nets, he goes 3-0 and is lauded as a great one.
If Lebron plays the 04 Pistons, 08 Celtics, and 14 Spurs he goes 0-3 and is crucified.


Sometimes great ones get to play EASY opponents in the finals....sometimes they play juggernauts.


You simply cannot compare two players on Finals records, without comparing their opponent.

 

[Inimical]

This thread is designed to show how idiotic it is to judge LEBRONS career by his Finals W-L.


The W-L needs to look at the opponents as well.


If Lebron played the 00 Pacer, 01 Sixers, and 02 Nets, he goes 3-0 and is lauded as a great one.
If Lebron plays the 04 Pistons, 08 Celtics, and 14 Spurs he goes 0-3 and is crucified.


Sometimes great ones get to play EASY opponents in the finals....sometimes they play juggernauts.


You simply cannot compare two players on Finals records, without comparing their opponent.

Are trying to insult our intelligence now?

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

And you just don't know if this year's champion can beat previous season's losers right? You previously mentioned the historic moments the Spurs had, but how do you know they have them against those other teams? It's just a dumb thread. The Heat lost to the better team. No reason to marginalize the past to defend Lebron.

I mentioned no such moments.
You are confusing me with someone else.

There is no way to know who would have beaten whom......unless they actually played.
That was my point.
Also, what happens in 1 series is no real indicator of what may happen if they play again.

Thats why they play the games.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

This thread is designed to show how idiotic it is to judge LEBRONS career by his Finals W-L.


The W-L needs to look at the opponents as well.


If Lebron played the 00 Pacer, 01 Sixers, and 02 Nets, he goes 3-0 and is lauded as a great one.
If Lebron plays the 04 Pistons, 08 Celtics, and 14 Spurs he goes 0-3 and is crucified.


Sometimes great ones get to play EASY opponents in the finals....sometimes they play juggernauts.


You simply cannot compare two players on Finals records, without comparing their opponent.

"If" is a fantastic word, isn't it?

"If" I had a 12 inch penis i'd be in a movie with Jenna Jameson by now.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

I just read Spurs were the most efficient offensive team in an NBA Finals since at least 1978.
How about instead of everybody discrediting them, try giving them their due.

Regardless of how much you dislike the Heat, chances are better than not that they would have won a best of 7 series vs any of the other 28 teams in the league.

The Spurs made them look average.

Don't be so sure that if they performed like that against any teams that you are mentioning, that they couldn't have won, or at least made it one hell of a series.

 

[lakersrule]

I mentioned no such moments.
You are confusing me with someone else.

There is no way to know who would have beaten whom......unless they actually played.
That was my point.
Also, what happens in 1 series is no real indicator of what may happen if they play again.

Thats why they play the games.

Clearly you misunderstood. Just as you were saying 'point is you just don't know' regarding the 00-02 Lakers playing the Spurs, the same can be said about this year's champ the Spurs beating teams that lost to the Kobe Lakers and Jordan Bulls. Point is you just don't know right?

The Spurs played statistically historic at times this series, but you KNOW you would have destroyed them?

That was your response to my somewhat sarcastic dig at Horns and the 00-02 Lakers destroying this year's champs. So, you did mention such moments. Do they have such historic moments against the 00-02 Lakers? Point is you don't know right?

The Heat lost to the better team. No reason to marginalize the past to defend Lebron which is what Horns was attempting.

 

[Inimical]

I just read Spurs were the most efficient offensive team in an NBA Finals since at least 1978.
How about instead of everybody discrediting them, try giving them their due.

Regardless of how much you dislike the Heat, chances are better than not that they would have won a best of 7 series vs any of the other 28 teams in the league.

The Spurs made them look average.

Don't be so sure that if they performed like that against any teams that you are mentioning, that they couldn't have won, or at least made it one hell of a series.

You fall right into the nonsensical trap lol, no surprise though. I guess i have to dismantle this now, ughhh really wish i could spend my energy on the off-season moves instead of wasting my time on such a nothingness of a thread but so many....hook line and sinker...

 

[purguy12]

LOL great thread. Funny stuff. Don't get me wrong this Spurs team was great but come on. Stop it LBJ and the Miami Heat choked.

 

[purguy12]

Heat would of been the 3rd to 4th best team in the West.

 

[LeBronMonsterDunk]

Are trying to insult our intelligence now?

I wonder if this kid knows how ironic his posts are?

 

[Steelboy84]

97, 98 Jazz, 2010 Celtics

 

[Kold]

Please tell me when and where most of the media has overly criticized Lebron. I know everybody was ready for the media to do that, and was ready for the counter argument...but the I'd say that a good 96% of the media has focused on how good the Spurs were/what Miami needs to do to give Lebron help. As for the criticism of Lebron on these boards....go back and look at the threads that were comparing and most outright saying that Lebron was the best and/or already better than Jordan. Every action has a reaction....when you start those threads/discussions, you gotta expect to see the Lebron blasphemy when they don't get it done