Star Wars Episode 8: The Last Jedi (2017)

[broncosmitty]

I agree. I keep hearing people knock the film for not explaining who Snoke is, but that criticism doesn't hold much water for me since the original trilogy never explained who the Emperor was, where he came from or how he got there and those films still worked.

You can't knit pick or ask too many questions. Just got enjoy the ten minute ass lickings those Red Knights took.


That was awesome!

 

[Niner Outlaw]

But they built him up slowly and he was the central figure in the climax.

They built him up slowly in the originals precisely b/c he was going to central to the climax. B/c Snoke is not going to be central to the new trilogy's climax, his character wasn't brought along as slowly. Besides, my point still stands that we didn't know any more about Snoke than we knew about the Emperor--instead, we learned the same small amount over 2 movies instead of 3.

In ANH, he was only referenced to, outside of a quick scene through the holo-communicator. But he clearly has pull over the Baddest bad that ever badded, Darth Vader.

In ESB, he is further established as the true puppet master. Vader has been promoted to the overall #2 (at least militarily), but he still completely betas to Palpatine.

In Ep7, we got passing references to Snoke and a brief holo of his face. He is established as the clear #1 almost from the beginning. We know no more about Snoke through Ep7 than we do about the Emperor through Ep4-5.

Then, in ROTJ, he manipulated the other two most powerful known force-users in the galaxy into a daddy/son battle, and even demonstrates a power that no other force-user has ever demonstrated. He was the Emporor if a galaxy-wide Empire, AND he was a SHOWN force-wielded.

You and I must have seen different movies. Because Snoke is not central to the climax, we get to see him in Ep8. We see that he manipulated Kylo and Rey, the two powerful force users, throughout the movie. We see that he visually/mentally connected them using a force technique that no one else has ever demonstrated. He tries to manipulate Kyle into killing Rey (Luke into killing Vader, only in reverse), which goes wrong ending up in his death.

The crawl at the beginning of the movie establishes that Snoke is the major power in the galaxy, the emperor of a galaxy-wide empire, as there is almost no one left to resist him--"The FIRST ORDER reigns. Having decimated the peaceful Republic, Supreme Leader Snoke now deploys his merciless legions to seize military control of the galaxy."

And as for Snokes DEMONSTRATED force abuilites? He pushes Rey back into a Matrix pose. That’s it. He CLAIMS to have controlled the Skype-sessions between Kylo and Rey, but there is no evidence of that. He was completely fooled by Kylo’s true intentions with the lightsaber.

That's it? That's incorrect. We also saw lightning from Snoke, and unlike the Emperor, Snoke did it very casually with just a flick of his hand. The fact that he claimed to have connected Kyle and Rey IS evidence that he was behind it. Notice that it didn't happen in Ep7 and it only happened after Snoke learned of Rey's existence in Ep7 and Kylo returned to Snoke prior to Ep8. It's not proof, but to say that there is no evidence is just wrong. It's similar to Palpatine telling Luke that "it was I who allowed the alliance to know the location of the shied generator." He's explaining how he set them up for this moment.

 

[Superbelt]

I liked it. I see what they were going for.

The first movie reestablished the whole mythos, as almost a step by step reproduction of ANH.

Then the 2nd movie goes and deconstructs the entire thing, kinda shits over the prequels a bit (very deservedly). And then reassembles it all into a story that stands on it's own.

I'm very much enjoying the new films. Rogue 1 has been the best of them all, so far.

 

[calsnowskier]

All that said, there is potential to salvage the situation...

Johnson has stated that Snoke was Plagius, but that they just didn’t use his name in the movie.

If this is true, than Snoke can still be a major player in IX. He reportedly conquered death, according to Palpatine in ROTS. And his appearances in TFA and TLJ prove this to be so. We also know that Maul survived a very similar “death blow” approximately 60 years prior.

The problem with this theory is that it would likely require that the true solution to killing Snoke would need to come from previous characters rather than the current Mary Sue. We know that Qui Gon figured out the secret and was teaching it to Yoda. We also know that Obiwan was studying it during his exile on Tatooine. Both demonstrated their accomplishment when they joined the Force rather dying (Anakin, by contrast, left his body behind when he died). Now it appears that Luke has acquired the knowledge as well.

Therefore, since Luke, Obiwan, Yoda and Qui Gon (and Maul??) understand the power, they would be the ones to be able to defeat Plagius/Snoke.

I doubt any of this comes to pass, though. I think Snoke is done.

 

[SDGuy73]

I will be seeing this Tuesday. Do I need to stay through the credits?

 

[calsnowskier]

I will be seeing this Tuesday. Do I need to stay through the credits?

No

 

[PatsFan2003]

I was thinking the same about the different directors/writers before even seeing this movie. Different directors is pretty much fine but different writers is a bad idea. It's unclear to me how much they collaborate with one another. I wanted to think that there had to be a few plot points that Abrams had to stick to and set up for the next 2 movies and they aren't just making it all up as they go along, but after seeing 8 I'm not so sure. I guess it's a good thing that Abrams is coming back for Episode 9 so he can finish off some of the stuff he set up in Episode 7. We still don't know for sure if Kylo was telling the truth when he told Rey her parents were just a couple of alcoholic nobodies. Even if Johnson intended for that to be the truth, Abrams can change that if he wants to. Not saying that necessarily needs to be "fixed" but he can if he wants to.

Agreed.

As for the other students, I think we'll see these guys in Ep. 9. We saw some guys standing behind Kylo in part of Rey's Force vision in Ep. 7 and I'd say it's a safe bet that is who they are. Maybe for some reason he couldn't have them around while under Snoke, but now that he's in charge I think we'll see them in the next movie.

I also liked Snokes getting killed. Shows Rey has real power and strength as "The Last Jedi"

 

[PatsFan2003]

BTW, was it just me, or did Luke's explanation of the Force to Rey pretty much give the finger (thankfully so) to the whole "mitichloriants" thing?

That died a wonderful death after the Phantom Menace.

 

[lilchi721]

I don't understand the psychic link between Rey and Kilo Ren it seemed like nobody had a good explanation for this in the movie.

 

[Duffman]

All that said, there is potential to salvage the situation...

Johnson has stated that Snoke was Plagius, but that they just didn’t use his name in the movie.

If this is true, than Snoke can still be a major player in IX. He reportedly conquered death, according to Palpatine in ROTS. And his appearances in TFA and TLJ prove this to be so. We also know that Maul survived a very similar “death blow” approximately 60 years prior.

The problem with this theory is that it would likely require that the true solution to killing Snoke would need to come from previous characters rather than the current Mary Sue. We know that Qui Gon figured out the secret and was teaching it to Yoda. We also know that Obiwan was studying it during his exile on Tatooine. Both demonstrated their accomplishment when they joined the Force rather dying (Anakin, by contrast, left his body behind when he died). Now it appears that Luke has acquired the knowledge as well.

Therefore, since Luke, Obiwan, Yoda and Qui Gon (and Maul??) understand the power, they would be the ones to be able to defeat Plagius/Snoke.

I doubt any of this comes to pass, though. I think Snoke is done.

All of what you said must be in the extended universe which I don’t think they’re going to be using so it doesn’t really matter.

 

[calsnowskier]

All of what you said must be in the extended universe which I don’t think they’re going to be using so it doesn’t really matter.

The only thing I mentioned that is not official canon is that Snoke = Plageus. The rest of the stuff was mentioned either in the prequels or the animated series’.

 

[Ewa PGH Fan]

I don't understand the psychic link between Rey and Kilo Ren it seemed like nobody had a good explanation for this in the movie.

Twins???

 

[calsnowskier]

Twins???

While I wish they stayed with the Jayson/Jayna storyline, that ship has sailed.

 

[lilchi721]

Twins???

They are not related

 

[Ewa PGH Fan]

While I wish they stayed with the Jayson/Jayna storyline, that ship has sailed.

They are not related

Faith you have not.

 

[calsnowskier]

Faith you have not.

Darth Jar Jar would have been cool as well, but they did too good a job at making him the fool, so they had to abandon that whole story.

 

[Ewa PGH Fan]

Darth Jar Jar would have been cool as well, but they did too good a job at making him the fool, so they had to abandon that whole story.

Thank-god!!!

 

[Duffman]

The only thing I mentioned that is not official canon is that Snoke = Plageus. The rest of the stuff was mentioned either in the prequels or the animated series’.

Do you have a link to Johnson saying Snoke was Plagus.

 

[calsnowskier]

Do you have a link to Johnson saying Snoke was Plagus.

I have seen it mentioned a few times in YouTube vids, but looking now for print, this is the best I can find...

'The Last Jedi' spoiler talk: Rian Johnson on Supreme Leader Snoke's startling moments

 

[wildturkey]

I don't understand the psychic link between Rey and Kilo Ren it seemed like nobody had a good explanation for this in the movie.

Snoke mentioned he initiated the bond between them thru The Force. It's a new technique introduced in the movie but the jist is two people strong in the Force can basically be right next to each other using The Force, not just talking but seeing each other and experiencing the same environments (Kylo got rained on while Rey was on Ach To despite being light years away on his ship). It's has to do with all that mumbo jumbo about The Force being the thing that connects everything in the universe.

There's also some symbolic stuff going on with Kylo being the strongest "dark" user and Rey being the strongest "light" user. Sorta like a yin yang, the two are intrinsically linked.