McCarron possible trade

[Sportster 72]

A common theme here is that the Redskins have treated Cousins poorly because they have not signed him to a long term deal. I understand that opinion but there is another school of thought. They will have paid him $44 million dollars for last year and the coming year. That is not chump change and ranks near the top for any QB in that span. By tagging him they have paid him very handsomely and I think he and his agent realize that.

Like you I would love to see him locked up for the next 5 years but just maybe this can work out in the long run.

 

[Stymietee]

I am fine with your Plan B Sty, my argument about it was you suggested he had more upside than Cousins. There is nothing anywhere to suggest that. I was teasing about the article and suggested that I was teasing because the writer hinted that McCarron may be nothing more than a backup. Last I knew guys ribbed each other a little. Guy stuff you know.

As far as Cousins goes you are on both sides of the fence, you want to resign him while minimalizing much of what he has done. If those paltry winning records are so easy to have why haven't we done that in the past 20 years with a myriad of QBs?

You are welcome to your Peterman assessment and I am welcome to mine. We will have to agree to disagree there.

You really should quit the "why is everybody picking on me bit." This is a forum, unless you want to get in the Jimmy Jones Kool-Aid line and we should all agree with each other. I have always told you that you have the right to be wrong. If you take that last line too seriously one or both of us needs help.

I am fine with your Plan B Sty, my argument about it was you suggested he had more upside than Cousins. There is nothing anywhere to suggest that. I was teasing about the article and suggested that I was teasing because the writer hinted that McCarron may be nothing more than a backup. Last I knew guys ribbed each other a little. Guy stuff you know.

Fair enough, and that argument could only be a subjective one, agreed? If so then taking the time that I did to study this guy I found that beyond a youthful advantage, he brings a pedigree to the position that Kirk is just discovering. Big game experience at two levels, total command and respect in the locker room, no mechanical flaws, although I will admit that Kirk does have a slightly stronger arm albeit less accurate on the deep ball. There's more but beyond all of that, McCarron has something that I don't believe Kirk will ever have (Keep in mind it's all subjective at this point) and that the "IT" factor, hard to describe but you know it in the moment when it's time to step up. He's a winner at his core.

As far as Cousins goes you are on both sides of the fence, you want to resign him while minimalizing much of what he has done. If those paltry winning records are so easy to have why haven't we done that in the past 20 years with a myriad of QBs?

You're totally wrong about this, I have always maintained that Kirk is a pretty good QB. From my perspective you and others are over-valuing what he does mainly IMO because you all WANT him to be something that he's not or intend to make him out better than what he is. The last part you'll have to admit has nothing to do with anyone currently in the game and speaks to the utter ineptness displayed by everyone involved in the past twenty years.

You are welcome to your Peterman assessment and I am welcome to mine. We will have to agree to disagree there.

Agreed, certainly wish that same consensus could be had with respect to Kirk and suggestions about his possible replacement if it comes to that.

You really should quit the "why is everybody picking on me bit." This is a forum, unless you want to get in the Jimmy Jones Kool-Aid line and we should all agree with each other. I have always told you that you have the right to be wrong. If you take that last line too seriously one or both of us needs help.

???????.......(picking on me bit)

everything else........... (Help us all)

 

[Stymietee]

I wasn't aware that questioning the description of the unproven McCarron "as a possible upgrade to Cousins." was now considered "noise". Good to know.

Nice, now you're pretending that you can't read. You can question all you like and I support and defend your right to do so. Right now as we speak Kirk is unsigned. There is still the growing possibility that he leaves here, until we are sure it's smart to consider what happens if Bruce and Co can't figure out a way to keep him. I did exactly that!! The noise comes in when you question and offer NOTHING better in threads where the clear question is NOT resigning Kirk, but what happens if we don't.

 

[Stymietee]

Right - but I think McCaron is going to cost more in draft picks than I would pay for him. If we trade Cuz, I'd rather go with Colt (pray for his health) for a year and draft someone in the 3rd/4th round and revisit the QB question next offseason.

You may very well be right about his cost to acquire, and Colt may prove very capable in an absence of Kirk when healthy. I'll just point out that my confidence in Colt is different than yours.....hey on a site like this it happens. BTW: We also disagree about where to draft QB's, I believe you're only getting very long term projects below the 3rd round at QB and I'm stretching a bit with 3rd rounders.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Nice, now you're pretending that you can't read. You can question all you like and I support and defend your right to do so. Right now as we speak Kirk is unsigned. There is still the growing possibility that he leaves here, until we are sure it's smart to consider what happens if Bruce and Co can't figure out a way to keep him. I did exactly that!! The noise comes in when you question and offer NOTHING better in threads where the clear question is NOT resigning Kirk, but what happens if we don't.

Sty all I have done was comment on the post that said the McCarron is an "upgrade" over Kirk Cousins That stood out and I commented on it, that's all there is to it. There was no need for me to meet your requirements above, I should be allowed to post the opinion that I do not consider a totally unproven player an upgrade over the 6th rated passer in the league. In other words going this direction would be a mistake IMO.

 

[Sharkinva]

Nice, now you're pretending that you can't read. You can question all you like and I support and defend your right to do so. Right now as we speak Kirk is unsigned. There is still the growing possibility that he leaves here, until we are sure it's smart to consider what happens if Bruce and Co can't figure out a way to keep him. I did exactly that!! The noise comes in when you question and offer NOTHING better in threads where the clear question is NOT resigning Kirk, but what happens if we don't.

 

[Sharkinva]

I will say this... .sure we CAN replace Kirk. And if we move on we likely WILL replace Kirk. But the idea that we can easily replace him, or that McCarron is some how a given as an upgrade is more of a what some hope, more so than a given. Add in the concept that if he is seen as beter than Cousins, to think we would get him for anything less than a 1st is a pipe dream.

Franchise QB's are more often than not found by luck, really shitty performances the year before allowing a team to draft them without giving up an arm and a leg. Or by teams giving up an arm and a leg.

If McCarron is simply just as good as Cousins, 3-5 teams would be beating down the Bengals doors right now.

So yes its nice to speculate based off his limited performances that he could be as good or better.

But reality is, if we are in the need of replacing Kirk, the train is already off the tracks and we are just hoping the 5000 gallons of diesel we are hauling dont spark off and take the rest of the load with it.

 

[Ruzious]

You may very well be right about his cost to acquire, and Colt may prove very capable in an absence of Kirk when healthy. I'll just point out that my confidence in Colt is different than yours.....hey on a site like this it happens. BTW: We also disagree about where to draft QB's, I believe you're only getting very long term projects below the 3rd round at QB and I'm stretching a bit with 3rd rounders.

Dak/Romo and Cuz say hola. Granted, it takes luck/skill. At any position, you're more likely to hit the higher you pick em.

 

[mall3013]

If you trade for McCarron you would be getting this in a deal.

 

[Sharkinva]

Dak/Romo and Cuz say hola. Granted, it takes luck/skill. At any position, you're more likely to hit the higher you pick em.

Dak/Romo Cuz and Brady for that matter fall firmly under the title of LUCK.

Because lets be real clear here... If any of the NFL teams thought any of these guys were capable of what they have done, NONE of them would have made it past the second round. And I would throw Wilson in there as well.

Of the five, if teams really thought these gys would turn out as well as they have... Brady would have been a #1 over all pick, Romo and Wilson would have been top ten picks, and Dak and Cuz fall no further than pick 40.

 

[Sharkinva]

If you trade for McCarron you would be getting this in a deal.

CAn she read a defense and hit a 5'10 WR on a quick slant??

 

[mall3013]

CAn she read a defense and hit a 5'10 WR on a quick slant??

I'm sure she could. I wish I was the WR getting hit.

 

[Stymietee]

[QUOTE="Darrell Green Fan, post: 9809132, member: 8691 In other words going this direction would be a mistake IMO.[/QUOTE]

Again, no problem with your assessment of McCarron, but assuming no Kirk, what would be the correct direction in your opinion.

 

[David_son]

AJ looked good with Hue as his OC so there is a relationship between the two, The Bengals are going to lose him to FA next year and if they can get a high second why not. Browns should do it because they need the best players avail you get a good QB and can pick two defensive stars within the top 10 it seems like a win win really.

 

[Sharkinva]

[QUOTE="Darrell Green Fan, post: 9809132, member: 8691 In other words going this direction would be a mistake IMO.

Again, no problem with your assessment of McCarron, but assuming no Kirk, what would be the correct direction in your opinion.[/QUOTE]



If I were a man of faith.... Prayer??

On a serious note, starting over. Meaning sure McCarron or Grap ARE likely our best options, but they aint going to come cheap. Failing that Darnold in next years draft unless they really think Suds is ready to do the damn thing. Last option if we have decide now..... Trubisky, Kizer, My Homey or Watson in that order.

 

[Sharkinva]

AJ looked good with Hue as his OC so there is a relationship between the two, The Bengals are going to lose him to FA next year and if they can get a high second why not. Browns should do it because they need the best players avail you get a good QB and can pick two defensive stars within the top 10 it seems like a win win really.

Thing is, they can get a first for him and they know it. Niners, Jets and the Browns all need a QB, throw in the Skins if we decide to roll on from Kirk..... 4 teams and only three QBs if you assume one of them actually gets Kirk...... Musical chairs. If you dont pay up, you are QB short. To me that equals a first round pick if I think he is capable of being a franchise QB

 

[David_son]

Thing is, they can get a first for him and they know it. Niners, Jets and the Browns all need a QB, throw in the Skins if we decide to roll on from Kirk..... 4 teams and only three QBs if you assume one of them actually gets Kirk...... Musical chairs. If you dont pay up, you are QB short. To me that equals a first round pick if I think he is capable of being a franchise QB

Thats true but which teams do you think believe him to be a Franchise guy. you also run into the problem the Pats might have with Jimmy G what are you going to give up for a still kinda unproven QB that will be a FA when any of these teams can take Watson Kiser or the guy from NC. who will be under contract for 4 years. If im say the 49ers and I like McCarron and the Bengals ask for #2 over all i would laugh at them. I could trade down to a team like the Jets or Bills and still get a QB plus an extra pick.

 

[Sharkinva]

Thats true but which teams do you think believe him to be a Franchise guy. you also run into the problem the Pats might have with Jimmy G what are you going to give up for a still kinda unproven QB that will be a FA when any of these teams can take Watson Kiser or the guy from NC. who will be under contract for 4 years. If im say the 49ers and I like McCarron and the Bengals ask for #2 over all i would laugh at them. I could trade down to a team like the Jets or Bills and still get a QB plus an extra pick.

If the Niners give up the #2, it will be for Kirk. I could see the Bengals getting the #17 from us for him and a 3rd rounder. Or the #12 from the Brown for McCarron and again a 3rd. I dont think you will get a 1st straight up for him. But a first for him and a 3rd will make it look right on paper.

 

[David_son]

If the Niners give up the #2, it will be for Kirk. I could see the Bengals getting the #17 from us for him and a 3rd rounder. Or the #12 from the Brown for McCarron and again a 3rd. I dont think you will get a 1st straight up for him. But a first for him and a 3rd will make it look right on paper.

I agree I think Redskins should offer Kirk and their first for 9ers first and second. That seems fair to me. Back to McCarron it is possible especially if the Redskins do trade Kirk because your team is in a position where they have some talent to win and that would drive up the price. Also they might keep him and if a guy like Taylor or Palmer gets injured then they will have a hot item for a trade then.

 

[David_son]

If you trade for McCarron you would be getting this in a deal.

Makes me wish I got into football at a young age.... or joined a band.