2018 Roster Expectations

[tzill]

MLBTR estimated Watson would sign a 2/12. Giants got him at 3/7.

Wow...

From the Athletic:

The league office uses the average annual value of a player’s multiyear contract to determine his salary component in a club’s overall CBT payroll number. In order to hold down some of those components, the Giants have employed a few subtle tricks without circumventing the rules.

Watson’s contract bears similarities to outfielder Austin Jackson’s deal, with easily reached incentives based on playing time that will escalate salaries in future years. (Incentives paid out in the current year count against that year’s CBT. Incentives that escalate future salaries do not.) More creativity: Watson’s third-year player option counts as a guaranteed year for CBT purposes, meaning his $9 million in guaranteed money is averaged over three years instead of two.

So Watson’s CBT component for 2018 will be just $3 million. And yet when it’s all said and done, he can expect to be paid somewhat in line with those other relievers who signed more conventional multiyear deals.

 

[calsnowskier]

I don't think Watson will be used like JLo was...he's a full inning pitcher. I think they will have 5-6 guys who can give Boch a late game inning.

You are probably right. I think true LOOGYs are a very rare breed (as are true ROOGYs) and we’re lucky af to have both Lopez and Romo on the team at the same time. It made that bully all-time dominant.

 

[tzill]

on another note, Corey Dickerson just DFA'd by the Rays. They basically are paying him $6M to not play baseball for them next year. Evans has to be on the phone to Excel Sports as I type.

This is just weird.

 

[tzill]

I welcome Marco jumping in here, but I guess the DFA process works like this:

1. The Rays place Dickerson on waivers
2. They can trade him in the next 10 days
3. Otherwise, he'll be claimed -- we are second in line.

I think if he's claimed, the claiming team pays his $6M salary.

There are other rules if he were to clear waivers, but he won't, so that's my take.

 

[calsnowskier]

I welcome Marco jumping in here, but I guess the DFA process works like this:

1. The Rays place Dickerson on waivers
2. They can trade him in the next 10 days
3. Otherwise, he'll be claimed -- we are second in line.

I think if he's claimed, the claiming team pays his $6M salary.

There are other rules if he were to clear waivers, but he won't, so that's my take.

Actually, I think we would be 16th in line to claim him. All AL teams would have dibs first.

But unless there is something wrong with him, he will be claimed or traded. Dude had an .800 OPS last year with 27 bombs. In the AL East.

He will be a steal, but the Giants are not in a position to take advantage.

 

[LHG]

Actually, I think we would be 16th in line to claim him. All AL teams would have dibs first.

But unless there is something wrong with him, he will be claimed or traded. Dude had an .800 OPS last year with 27 bombs. In the AL East.

He will be a steal, but the Giants are not in a position to take advantage.

That's too bad because I'd rather have him than Pence in left field.

 

[SFGRTB]

on another note, Corey Dickerson just DFA'd by the Rays. They basically are paying him $6M to not play baseball for them next year. Evans has to be on the phone to Excel Sports as I type.

This is just weird.

Did the Rays hit the wrong button? WTF????

 

[SFGRTB]

I don't think Watson will be used like JLo was...he's a full inning pitcher. I think they will have 5-6 guys who can give Boch a late game inning.

In April/May when Smith is getting back to full-strength I agree, but once Smith is back healthy I hope Watson is used more as a LOOGY.

He's excellent versus lefties, only okay versus righties (okay might be selling short I guess, but I'd rather have a righty face a fellow righty).

If we're going with a typical Bochy constructed Pen, I envision Melancon - 9th, Dyson/Smith - 8th, Strickland/Watson 7th, Law - 6th.

Strickland typically has strong RH splits, while Watson has strong LH splits. Pairing them in to neutralize any mismatch would be ideal, sort of like the aforementioned Javy/Romo combo.

 

[SFGRTB]

Another OT, but the Padres just signed Eric Hosmer just signed to an 8-year $144m deal.

I've never been a huge Homer fan, but I guess it adds a little more star power to the NL West, which has done a lot of that lately.

 

[LHG]

Another OT, but the Padres just signed Eric Hosmer just signed to an 8-year $144m deal.

I've never been a huge Homer fan, but I guess it adds a little more star power to the NL West, which has done a lot of that lately.

But it is a head scratcher of a move on the Padres' part. They aren't a contending team and already had a 1st baseman signed to a long term deal. Now they've committed to a guy who's been up and down. I cannot envision this ending well for the Padres.

 

[calsnowskier]

But it is a head scratcher of a move on the Padres' part. They aren't a contending team and already had a 1st baseman signed to a long term deal. Now they've committed to a guy who's been up and down. I cannot envision this ending well for the Padres.

Agreed. This move makes absolutely zero sense to me.

I don’t listen to local radio or watch local news, so maybe the local guys like it for some reason, but most Padre fans I know have feared this signing for last couple months. They don’t see the point of it either.

 

[SFGRTB]

But it is a head scratcher of a move on the Padres' part. They aren't a contending team and already had a 1st baseman signed to a long term deal. Now they've committed to a guy who's been up and down. I cannot envision this ending well for the Padres.

I guess they anticipate Hosmer will be the clubhouse leader and face of the next generation of Padres. Maybe they think their window is pretty soon. They certainly have a number of real exciting prospects.

IDK

 

[tzill]

The Rays have seven days to trade or release Dickerson. By making the move now, they're obligated to pay about $1 million of his $5.95 million salary for 2018.

Now it's starting to make a little more sense.

 

[calsnowskier]

The Rays have seven days to trade or release Dickerson. By making the move now, they're obligated to pay about $1 million of his $5.95 million salary for 2018.

Now it's starting to make a little more sense.

They could get out of paying him? How does that work?

Why don’t the Giants DFA Pence?

 

[msgkings322]

They could get out of paying him? How does that work?

Why don’t the Giants DFA Pence?

Come on, you know this. Not the Giants way, nor should it be.

 

[MarcoPolo]

I welcome Marco jumping in here, but I guess the DFA process works like this:

1. The Rays place Dickerson on waivers
2. They can trade him in the next 10 days
3. Otherwise, he'll be claimed -- we are second in line.

I think if he's claimed, the claiming team pays his $6M salary.

There are other rules if he were to clear waivers, but he won't, so that's my take.

Yes on 1, 2 and 3. The order on waivers (at this point) is reverse order of last season's W-L record, independant of league. (In Aug/Sep, revocable waivers first clear every team in the same league, then go to the other league - but not now.) And yes, if claimed or traded the new team pays his salary. Dickerson has more than 3 years service time, so he can refuse being outrighted to the minors (as if he is going to clear waivers). Since he has a signed contract - it is in force, and he will be paid whatever his contract says - even when playing in the minors. He also has LESS than 5 years service time, so if he refuses his assignment, he walks away from his contract.

The Rays have seven days to trade or release Dickerson. By making the move now, they're obligated to pay about $1 million of his $5.95 million salary for 2018.

Now it's starting to make a little more sense.

They could get out of paying him? How does that work?

Why don’t the Giants DFA Pence?

Normally, contracts are guaranteed. HOWEVER, there's a weird case: if a player has a one year contract, and he is released before a certain date of spring training, he only gets a portion of his contract, and become a free agent (2 dates actually - he is paid more if released later; "16 days or more before start of season": 30 days pay, "between 16 and 1 days before start of season": 45 days pay).

Concerning Pence :
- he isn't on a 1 year contract, so the entirety of his remaining contract is guaranteed even if only a year
- I remember sooooooo many people saying that Pence was worth his contract, even if he sucked the last couple of years of his contract. Time to eat crow, folks.

 

[MarcoPolo]

Oh, PS: Without Pence, I don't think we'd have won it all in 2014. So in a certain, twisted sense, the contract was "worth it", even though they only got 2 good years out of him. On the other hand, nobody who was OK with the contract back before the 2014 season started is allowed to b*tch about his salary now.

Marco's "New Rule"

The fact that it means that only myself and a very small number of posters are allowed to piss and moan about his contract is completely immaterial to my ruling ...

 

[MarcoPolo]

Only if he {Timmy} agrees to be a middle relief weapon like the 2012 playoffs. I know he's roided up now but let's get real.

I don't know which is more surprising: that I don't know this, or ... that I will admit that I don't know this

So, who *exactly* is subject to being tested for PEDs (MLB, of course)? Is a person who WAS a MLB player, but not currently under contract to any team, yet hasn't announced retirement subject to random testing? If not, well that's a hole big enough to drive a Mack truck through. For a out-of-work possible-solid-player to be able to take the drugs, get in tip-top shape then stop taking the drugs just far enough in advance to pass tests - THEN do a "showcase" for teams who might be interested in signing ... and be pretty sure to be able to pass any tests after signing (especially if he disappears "on vacation out of country" for another few weeks ...).

PS : Sandoval (for example) is "under contract" even if the Giants release him : he will still be collecting salary guaranteed in his Boston contract. I am pretty sure that means that he can be tested ... but I'm not 100% positive.

 

[calsnowskier]

Oh, PS: Without Pence, I don't think we'd have won it all in 2014. So in a certain, twisted sense, the contract was "worth it", even though they only got 2 good years out of him. On the other hand, nobody who was OK with the contract back before the 2014 season started is allowed to b*tch about his salary now.

Marco's "New Rule"

The fact that it means that only myself and a very small number of posters are allowed to piss and moan about his contract is completely immaterial to my ruling ...

According to BBREF, Pence has accumulated 6.9 WAR on the contract, with one year to go. The contract was for 95M, so, at 8.3M/WAR, he needs approx 11.5 WAR to “break even”. But, as you stated, we likely would not have won in ‘14 without him.

So, he needs a big year in ‘18 to break even on the field (4.6 WAR). But when you factor in ‘14 and his marketing skills, I think he AT WORST, ended up a wash.

 

[calsnowskier]

Yes on 1, 2 and 3. The order on waivers (at this point) is reverse order of last season's W-L record, independant of league. (In Aug/Sep, revocable waivers first clear every team in the same league, then go to the other league - but not now.) And yes, if claimed or traded the new team pays his salary. Dickerson has more than 3 years service time, so he can refuse being outrighted to the minors (as if he is going to clear waivers). Since he has a signed contract - it is in force, and he will be paid whatever his contract says - even when playing in the minors. He also has LESS than 5 years service time, so if he refuses his assignment, he walks away from his contract.

So the Giants are second in line for him. Would they put in a claim?

He bats lefty, so would the park destroy his numbers? And his D is below average (-0.9 dWAR in ‘17, always in negative territory his whole career). Would he be an improvement over a “healthy” Pence?