Road trip Part II

[JohnU]

Off to Miami, Philly and Muttland ... would like to get 6 or 7 W's this time through.

Analysis: Pitching is about average, hitting very unpredictable, but this team is opportunistic, it appears, against bad defense.

I still don't like some of the strategy. Could have won two from Atlanta.

 

[chico ruiz]

just curious. what does it mean, when you say, 'muttland?'

 

[JohnU]

It's where the Mutts play.

 

[Redsfan1507]

I'll take .500 on the road, although Miami is terrible, the Phillies aren't great, and neither are the Mets...they all have some pitchers that could befuddle the Reds.

 

[JohnU]

Homer, Leake and Cingrani, then they were talking maybe Cueto for a start in Philly. Depends on his next rehab, the announcers said. That would shove Latos back a day. With the off day tomorrow, could be interesting to see if Dusty flops anyone.

 

[Ryanballa]

Our Reds are starting to find there groove and things are starting to turn up. Our offense is finally come around, Cueto is probably gonna be back this weekend. There is no reason why we cant sweep Miami, Take at least the series from Philly and Mets. We are a better team then any of these clubs we just gotta play like it on the field, Like the way we did this weekend. GO REDS!

 

[WvuDieHard]

I hope you are correct RyanBella. If there is anything to take from this season's team, it is inconsistency. Yes, we finally scored some runs in the Brewers series, 22 to be exact, but we just saw a pathetic pitching staff. The good news that I see is the Cards are due to hit a wall. Wainwright just got shelved with a swollen elbow so I can't see them continuing to get the kind of pitching they have been getting. This is a very important road trip becuase I think we can get back on top of the division with 7 or 8 wins. Against the Marlins, Phils, & Mets, we have a shot at doing just that. I guess it depends on how many left handers we see.

 

[BigBlueNation111]

Our Reds are starting to find there groove and things are starting to turn up. Our offense is finally come around, Cueto is probably gonna be back this weekend. There is no reason why we cant sweep Miami, Take at least the series from Philly and Mets. We are a better team then any of these clubs we just gotta play like it on the field, Like the way we did this weekend. GO REDS!

 

[Redsfan1507]

I always get a bad vibe when people talk about anticipating a team above you in the standings " hitting a wall". I understand the concept, but I think it puts a bad spin on hat really needs to happen- doing what it takes to win yourself. I've always taken the approach that you don't worry about what you can't control, and take control of your own destiny.

In that regard, I was impressed with Latos' attitude sbout his lackluster performance in the win over the Brewers. He was happy to get a win, but was pizzed about his own performance. As long as it doesn't cause a meltdown, it shows he accepts responsibility and realizes there was a problem. A lot if players think everything is ok in a win, especially dangerous when beating an inferior team. This team still has a lot to prove against better teams, and realizing failures even in wins is a requirement for improvement.

 

[JohnU]

One would assume that no team can play .700 ball like the Birds have done but even with losing Westbrook, they bring in an arm that can get them 2 decent outings before the league catches up ... by then, Westy will be back and they will have matured a young pitcher.

St. Louis doesn't seem to have that many truly weak spots in the batting order. It's hard to exploit them because they have so much veteran talent. They are getting long starts from their rotation and keeping their otherwise inept bullpen out of the discussion.

I agree with 1507. If the Reds want to catch the Birds, they have to play winning ball and not wait for St. Louis to collapse. At this point, I still see the Reds at no better than 86 wins unless the offense begins to get more consistent.

Be ready for this, though: The crowds in Miami will border on few to almost nothing.

It's a bit different in Philly, which is NOT as bad as the scribes claim.

 

[Redsfan1507]

St.Louis isn't Superman. Freese isnt hitting, they lose a SS almost every year, and Beltran is injury prone. Craig has underperformed. They always have pitchers on the DL...They just seem to go on to a logical Plan B when someone goes down, and they play on.

They have one if the top farms in MLB, and a team that understands the key components to winning- pitch, play D, score early and often, and don't shoot yourself in the foot on the bases. They also seen to understand what I wish was better learned in Dustyland-the bullpen doesn't have to be great if the rotation and lineup leave them a 2 run lead.

 

[Redsfan1507]

Philly is aging. They are also are almost a parody of our Reds gone wrong in a few years...whiffaholic, HR dependant offense, aging and more shaky D, and a pitching staff that looks better on paper than performs in the W-L column...trying to win with pitching in a hitters park, with a dim bulb manager that is going to decide more games with fumble than fundamentals. I think the Braves are head and shoulders better, and Washington will insure no playoffs for Philly before its over.

 

[chico ruiz]

this post is food for thought and meant to spark some -hopefully- interesting dialogues. 12 -15 years ago, and even recently, the AL east was considered by most pundits to be the best division in baseball. set aside the money, PED's, and media aspect for a moment and consider some trends that got started. by the way, their are a lot of fans that would say the yankees won despite torre. one of the most employed tactics was to take a ton of pitches. the goal, of course, was to get the opposing starting pitcher to 90+ pitches by the 5th inning. he'd be replaced by a reliever who they would pound all over the park. having hitters that could handle being down in the count didn't hurt either. long slow plodding at-bats that i would imagine -like counting sheep- to put me asleep at night. you wouldn't believe how long even low scoring games were. part of the reason i would stay was because the subway would be much less crowded after the game was over. plus rivera always amazes me, and witnessing the greatest to ever do something, for an old baseball fan like me, is priceless. regardless, the game was swayed mostly toward the cat & mouse between hitter and pitcher. then, along came joe maddon. the rays were running, shifting (and playing superior defense), throwing strikes, and generally speeding up the game with great effect. the sox and yanks looked like deer caught in the headlights. especially the dugout. francona looked particularly befuddled. for me, baseball was back in 2008. it was more fun to go to the park again. the rays were beating the yanks. going to tropicana field was a treat. what was joe going to do next? how was the ray organization doing this? don't get me wrong. i appreciate the yankees, because i know it's more than money that has made them successful. you don't go to the playoffs every year but one, since 1995, based on money alone. i found that a lot of my preconceived notions about them were incorrect. they play hard and execute. forgive me for this digression, but there's a larger point i'll eventually make as it relates to the reds. in 2005 i was at a game that kevin brown started. matsui made an error on a seemingly routine fly ball. brown through a hissy fit on the mound. jeter went to the mound, after time was called, and it got kind of heated between him and brown. found out later he was telling brown that he would never show-up a player like that again. i know a lot of fans think jeter is over-rated, but it's that kind of understated leadership that few know about.

2 overarching points. i like that style of baseball (it's my perfect baseball world too 1507), and ironically the reds have decent team speed. but, putting the gaffes aside, and considering just team construct. dusty cannot be on the field. some fans think madden is kooky, but he knows he's the manager, and puts his team in the best possible position to win. dusty cannot be the team leader, and manage simultaneously. to me that is a unsustainable dichotomy that will ultimately fail. these reds are a good group of players, and people, who give good effort. there is no doubt about that. however, they lack one important ingredient: a team leader. i know it sounds weird, to some, that you would need it at the professional level. nevertheless, the reds do not have that personality on their club. this next comment is going to sting a little, so brace yourself. consider who the cards have had as team leaders recently, and how they have been a part of their overall success. bochy, girardi, maddon, larussa, are a few that have shown the ability to adapt and adjust. year to year, and game to game. still, the reds will win 90+ games because of their pitching and defense. votto will continue to get better, cueto will be back (which will give them 6 starters), the bullpen will win games in august, ludwick may very well provide help later, etc. all in all, the reds have come through an early flurry of injuries very well.

 

[JohnU]

If I can identify a team leader, if such is necessary, it would appear to be Hanigan. The team has been better since he came back.

A year ago, arguably, such a person was Scott Rolen. Can't expect Frazier to be that guy but you'd want that person on the infield. Votto is probably not the personality for it. Phillips ought to step up, maybe he has.

But I don't see dissension on the Reds. I see inconsistency. That comes from good coaching.

It's hard for me to assess the Phils on one series and a few sporadic games I've watched. I think they are slow up the middle now and clearly have battery issues. Their winning teams were scoring 2-3 runs early and letting a boss rotation carry them home.
Guess who else does that? Hint: They are leading the Reds in the NL-C.

If you plan to win at base-ball, you HAVE to score runs early and churn the lineup. The Reds do NOT do this consistently. You have to give the starting pitcher the option of making a mistake that doesn't put you behind. Going up and down 3 times is NOT working well enough to sustain a pennant race.

Pitching isn't overrated, but bad hitting is the norm around the league now. Teams that score early will usually win.

 

[Redsfan1507]

Ever read the Mitchell Report ? If you have, you'll see there was plenty of evidence MLB teams AND Bud Selig were fully aware of PEDs. IMO, they thought it was good for MLB, especially in large markets where the inevidible escalation of salary could be accommodated. IMO, it still goes on, HGH and harder to detect other methods being employed more... but has decreased the PED advantage substantially, turning back the clock to a more mortal baseball game. It begs for better fundamentals and pitching, speed, defense more like the 1960's game tactics... but just like every war starts with improved technology but outdated tactics for the tools ar hand, baseball's managers are slow to react.

The DH, small parks and arguably diluted pitching ( from expansion from 24 teams in 1970 or so) may offset some of the pitching advantage in a PED reduced environment, but imagine a good team employing an aggressive running game in a small park, that can hit a few HR, pitch and play D too ? Wow. A lot more interesting than standing around waiting on a 3 run bomb every 3 days.

 

[JohnU]

Let us put Derrick Robinson and Billy Hamilton in the same infield. Let's assume that could/would/might work. Phillips has fair speed but he's not a gazelle. I would want to assume that Derrick and Ham can actually HIT the baseball.

I won't evaluate it beyond that ... but just let's assume we can do that.

Discuss.

 

[WvuDieHard]

Its Westbrook on the DL not Wainwright. Hey, I agree we dont need to wait for STL to falter, we need to pick it up ourselves. This road trip gives us a chance to do just that. Mediocre competition that a good club should feast on. This may be the most important road trip of they year because it can prevent you from getting down 5-6 games in May, put yoorself within a couple of games, or even get you up on the division. If the Reds can't take 2 of 3 from these 3 teams, then it wont really matter when the playoff comes because you will wilter just like last season. Good teams play consistent baseball and this team has yet to prove that. And I am not talking about wins, I am talking about fundamentally sound baseball. We are solid on D, get more than adequat pitching, but the hitting technique ( working counts, moving runners, not swinging at bad pitches) is awful.

 

[chico ruiz]

i still have the mitchell report saved as a .pdf file and reference it occasionally. what he concludes is that there's culpability to go around. players, player's association, individual club execs & management, ownership, and mlb (commissioner's office & underlings). i would add one more: us.

 

[Redsfan1507]

Bad teams sometimes have good pitching. The Brewers are only a few games under .500, but IMO, they're worse than that. Their pitching isn't very good, and their D isn't either. It's a bad combo that the '27 Yankees offense might struggle to overcome... So although happy the Reds thumped them, but not willing to believe we've solved anything offensively that won't happen against better teams.

Here's the rub- the Cardinals bullpen can be had, the problem is if our Reds don't quit swinging into early count outs and striking out stranding leadoff runners where they started, chances of getting TO that suspect bullpen are lower. The Cardinals D isn't always great either, but they don't have to be if we strike out 12 times. The Cardinals don't run much, but have a good catcher, so we don't run either. We have a good bullpen, but struggle to give them a lead to hold against teams that act like they've played a couple games. The Reds are just too cooperative in getting themselves out. Hopefully, they'll get into a sustainable groove on the soft road trip.

 

[Redsfan1507]

I think it's the worst scam in sports that Selig still has a job. It's a no brainer- you could be a clean player, hit .280 with 18 Hr and make $11 mil a year... or you can roid up for a couple years, sign a $100 mil contract, and serve a 50 game suspension and the balance of $90 mil is still due. What do you think they're going to do ? The penalty isn't a penalty. Meanwhile payrolls are huge and 500 HR is no big deal anymore.