Series Thread: 5) Indiana Pacers vs. 4) Cleveland Cavaliers

[Black Adam]

good to know that you're STILL a dickhead though, WiggityWack...

don't change for anybody...

 

[Heatles84]

So all is well with Cleveland? A blow out loss at home and a close win at home where Lebron scores 46 on 75% shooting is really NBD?

Last night was not exactly the bounce back performance I think most Cavs fans were expecting.

This is where I'm starting to get shaky on my Cleveland prediction for this series.

Lebron had another career game in the playoffs where Oladipo got in early foul trouble and dug Indiana in a deep hole to start the 1st. But again, Indiana made it a close game and lost by 6 (I know they lost by 3, but that Oladipo 3 was a non-decider at the buzzer).

With all that said, role players typically don't play well on the road and the next two games are in Indiana.

Although Cleveland won last night, I don't know how anyone could look at this team realistically and say "all is well". If Lebron has even an average game, they lose. You're asking for Lebron to be great every night from the start. This isn't like the previous years where he just had to have a decent game because Lebron could let Kyrie take over the scoring load - there's no one else on this roster that can do this.

 

[trojanfan12]

way to go out on a limb with some hard hitting analysis. lol

He said basically the same thing you did. It just took him far fewer words.

 

[Black Adam]

He said basically the same thing you did. It just took him far fewer words.

like "hard hitting analysis" was needed there, right...?

 

[WiggyRuss]

The problem with role players is that they are role players for a reason.

IMO, the biggest problem with the Cavs is that their starting 5 consists of All Universe Lebron a very good Kevin Love and then a bunch of very pedestrian players with glaring holes in their game.

Kyle Korver is not a playoff starter caliber player. He's a 3 point specialist with glaring weaknesses of defense. George Hill has been, IMO, a disappointment since coming to Cleveland. JR Smith seems like a shell of his former self. Jeff Green is a terribly playoff player.

So now the Cavs are hoping that one of Nance or Clarkson or Hood will step up and be a big time producer which they have never been. Hood could become that player someday, maybe, but he's still better suited as a 6th man at best.

If JR Smith can turn back the clock or Hill can discover his offense again, the Cavs will be fine. But if they continue to play the way they are right now, it will be very difficult for the Cavs to reach the finals and get blown out.

I actually think Korver played pretty well defensively - esp. against Oladipo at times yesterday. His athleticism isnt that great but he tries and gets in good position- which is really what you need for the most part. Hill as well.

I think that if the Cavs had another month or two in the regular season that they would be a lot better off- but they literally had like what? 12 games with Love and the new guys and during that time Hill and Hood both missed games?

the problem is that the Cavs are basically a new team and trying to figure it out in the playoffs- not talent- if you ask me.

But we shall see. I have a feeling the Cavs will be having the last laugh here and we will be seeing a lot of back tracking in the next 3-4 weeks.

 

[flyerhawk]

But we shall see. I have a feeling the Cavs will be having the last laugh here and we will be seeing a lot of back tracking in the next 3-4 weeks.

The Cavs still have Lebron and he can will the Cavs through a series against a team like the Pacers. But it takes a toll and they aren't going to roll through the Raptors.

 

[Black Adam]

I actually think Korver played pretty well defensively - esp. against Oladipo at times yesterday. His athleticism isnt that great but he tries and gets in good position- which is really what you need for the most part. Hill as well.

I think that if the Cavs had another month or two in the regular season that they would be a lot better off- but they literally had like what? 12 games with Love and the new guys and during that time Hill and Hood both missed games?

the problem is that the Cavs are basically a new team and trying to figure it out in the playoffs- not talent- if you ask me.

But we shall see. I have a feeling the Cavs will be having the last laugh here and we will be seeing a lot of back tracking in the next 3-4 weeks.

"having a feeling" like a wish and a prayer lol...

guess we'll know soon enough...

 

[WiggyRuss]

The Cavs still have Lebron and he can will the Cavs through a series against a team like the Pacers. But it takes a toll and they aren't going to roll through the Raptors.

its just funny the same shit- different year---- no one having the balls to say the Cavs will lose--- but everyone trying their best to hedge to have an "i told you so" moment. Every year its the same.

 

[Black Adam]

its just funny the same shit- different year---- no one having the balls to say the Cavs will lose--- but everyone trying their best to hedge to have an "i told you so" moment. Every year its the same.

OK, the Cavs aren't winning the title, so I GUESS that's saying "the Cavs will lose..."

lol @the "every year" thing, though considering they got one title by the skin of their teeth...

 

[flyerhawk]

its just funny the same shit- different year---- no one having the balls to say the Cavs will lose--- but everyone trying their best to hedge to have an "i told you so" moment. Every year its the same.

Perhaps you should pay attention more.

I already said that if Philly gets to the ECF and faces the Cavs, they will beat them. I actually think, as of right now, the Raptors will beat the Cavs. Heck I give the Cavs about a 60% chance of beating the Pacers.

You seem to confuse people acknowledging the greatness of Lebron with people hedging. They aren't hedging. He's still the best player on the court and when playing good, but not great, teams like the Pacers that is enough to win.

To be clear, I'm not anti-Cavs in any way. But if you think this year is no different than year's past, then you have some serious memory issues or you weren't paying attention.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Perhaps you should pay attention more.

I already said that if Philly gets to the ECF and faces the Cavs, they will beat them. I actually think, as of right now, the Raptors will beat the Cavs. Heck I give the Cavs about a 60% chance of beating the Pacers.

You seem to confuse people acknowledging the greatness of Lebron with people hedging. They aren't hedging. He's still the best player on the court and when playing good, but not great, teams like the Pacers that is enough to win.

To be clear, I'm not anti-Cavs in any way. But if you think this year is no different than year's past, then you have some serious memory issues or you weren't paying attention.

wow....cool

So, if and when the Cavs advance-- if its the Raptors would you like to make an avatar bet on the series?

 

[flyerhawk]

wow....cool

So, if and when the Cavs advance-- if its the Raptors would you like to make an avatar bet on the series?

I already told you the only scenario where I would make an AVI bet. I very rarely make such bets.

 

[WiggyRuss]

people also have to realize like either @gordontrue or @Shanemansj13 already siad--- LeBron scoring a lot of those points was a function of taking what the defense gave him as well.

If you watched the game you noticed that Indiana stuck to the 3 pt shooters and left the lane wide open

Cleveland Cavaliers starting Kyle Korver helps unlock LeBron James, offense in Game 2

"With Korver on the floor along with JR Smith for Rodney Hood, the Pacers were completely spread out on the defensive end. It's LeBron and four shooters, a lineup that forces the opposing defense into a no-win proposition.

Early in the first quarter, Indiana chose to stay connected on the perimeter, respecting Cleveland's bevy of marksmen and not wanting to get beat with the 3-ball. That created extra space for James to attack the rim relentlessly -- a way in which he couldn't on Sunday, when the Pacers often sent help (center Myles Turner) off inconsistent Jeff Green."


If Indiana is going to stay at home on the Cavaliers 3 pt shooters and dare LeBron to beat them at the rim---- LeBron is going to do what he did--- beat them at the rim and 1 on 1.

What i think the Cavs could and should do is use Nance Jr. and or TT more to set picks for LeBron and then have that guy roll to the basket.

Have a lineup with LeBron--- one roller that is either Nance Jr. or TT, and 3 shooters.

 

[gordontrue]

So all is well with Cleveland? A blow out loss at home and a close win at home where Lebron scores 46 on 75% shooting is really NBD?

Last night was not exactly the bounce back performance I think most Cavs fans were expecting.

Yeah, I didn't say any of that.

Still, "LeBron scored 46 and it was still a close game" is surface-level, lazy analysis.

Go look at how many shots the rest of the Cavs players took. The Pacers are one of the few teams that can slow the pace against the Cavs and benefit from it. (Heat & Celtics are the others) They aren't sending help on LeBron, even after his 1st quarter outburst.

LeBron is the absolute master of grind-it-out half-court offense, but the rest of the Cavs players are much more dangerous in high-tempo offense. (with the Exception of Love's post game).

Cavs can help themselves by getting the pace going, which I suspect will be a big goal for game 3, but they have to be careful. Their defense could suffer if they focus too much on pace, and it could lead to turnovers if they're not careful, which the Pacers would absolutely feast on.

It was the same thing last year, where every win against the Pacers was a close game.

 

[gordontrue]

no one having the balls to say the Cavs will lose--- but everyone trying their best to hedge to have an "i told you so" moment.

Exactly

 

[WiggyRuss]

Yeah, I didn't say any of that.

Still, "LeBron scored 46 and it was still a close game" is surface-level, lazy analysis.

Go look at how many shots the rest of the Cavs players took. The Pacers are one of the few teams that can slow the pace against the Cavs and benefit from it. (Heat & Celtics are the others) They aren't sending help on LeBron, even after his 1st quarter outburst.

LeBron is the absolute master of grind-it-out half-court offense, but the rest of the Cavs players are much more dangerous in high-tempo offense. (with the Exception of Love's post game).

Cavs can help themselves by getting the pace going, which I suspect will be a big goal for game 3, but they have to be careful. Their defense could suffer if they focus too much on pace, and it could lead to turnovers if they're not careful, which the Pacers would absolutely feast on.

It was the same thing last year, where every win against the Pacers was a close game.

if the Pacers are going to leave LeBron singled and stay at home on the 3 pt shooters--- LeBron is going to have to be aggressive like he was last night.

I give Indiana a ton of credit too- this is a very deep, mentally tough team that is playing extremely hard. All they have done all year is surpass people's expectations and it shouldn't surprise us too much that they are doing the same now.

 

[Mecca]

I actually think Korver played pretty well defensively - esp. against Oladipo at times yesterday. His athleticism isnt that great but he tries and gets in good position- which is really what you need for the most part. Hill as well.

I think that if the Cavs had another month or two in the regular season that they would be a lot better off- but they literally had like what? 12 games with Love and the new guys and during that time Hill and Hood both missed games?

the problem is that the Cavs are basically a new team and trying to figure it out in the playoffs- not talent- if you ask me.

But we shall see. I have a feeling the Cavs will be having the last laugh here and we will be seeing a lot of back tracking in the next 3-4 weeks.

I still have you getting out of the East

But, it will take a Herculean type effort from LeBron, which is problematic.

A gassed LeBron gets you swept in the Finals.

 

[gordontrue]

if the Pacers are going to leave LeBron singled and stay at home on the 3 pt shooters--- LeBron is going to have to be aggressive like he was last night.

I give Indiana a ton of credit too- this is a very deep, mentally tough team that is playing extremely hard. All they have done all year is surpass people's expectations and it shouldn't surprise us too much that they are doing the same now.

And he's more than capable of doing it again. This isn't JJ Redick or Jrue Holiday exploding for 40 points.

This wasn't an anomoly because LeBron scored efficiently at will. He does that every game. It was an anomaly because he took more shots and created for others less, which is what this particular game required.

This was just the 4th time in the last 15 games that LeBron took that many shots. The other times? 40 points, 41 points, and 44 points. So lets not act like LeBron won't do this again, if the Pacers keep extending the invitation.

 

[Mecca]

Exactly

There are people who have emphatically stated the Cavs are getting out of the East, even though they don't want them to.

There are also 2 or 3 who have gone on record to say they won't.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Yeah, I didn't say any of that.

Still, "LeBron scored 46 and it was still a close game" is surface-level, lazy analysis.

Go look at how many shots the rest of the Cavs players took. The Pacers are one of the few teams that can slow the pace against the Cavs and benefit from it. (Heat & Celtics are the others) They aren't sending help on LeBron, even after his 1st quarter outburst.

LeBron is the absolute master of grind-it-out half-court offense, but the rest of the Cavs players are much more dangerous in high-tempo offense. (with the Exception of Love's post game).

Cavs can help themselves by getting the pace going, which I suspect will be a big goal for game 3, but they have to be careful. Their defense could suffer if they focus too much on pace, and it could lead to turnovers if they're not careful, which the Pacers would absolutely feast on.

It was the same thing last year, where every win against the Pacers was a close game.

the Pacers do have some solid individual defenders as well- esp. on the perimeter.

Collison and Jospeh- neither are stars--- but Jospeh is prob the best backup PG in basketball. Joseph has great size and is a solid perimeter defender. Oladipo is a great perimeter defender. Stephenson is a very solid perimeter defender.

The big men on Indiana are the ones taht are more of the defensive liabilities--- Bogdon, Young, Turner, etc.


It looks like Indiana is going with basically an 8 man rotation--- maybe a LIL bit 9 with Booker getting some minutes.......

But i think the Cavs have to do a better job of beating up Indiana with Love in the post--- and rolling to the basket with Nance Jr. and or TT. That should open up the perimeter a little more--- because right now the Pacer's have some good perimeter defenders that are pretty much just staying at home and its a good strategy against the Cavs.