USA Today predicts us 5-11

[SoCalWizFan]

I don't like the running game right now for the Skins. Yes you got Perine in the draft but I'm guessing R.Kelley will be the starter? If so, he had a solid game but that's about it. I think the lack of GM will play a factor. Not a huge one, but when the Panthers fired their GM 1-2 weeks ago, they immediately hired a interim. The Redskins don't have one. Is that on purpose or is Snyder holding both GM and Owner roles? I really don't like Tomsula as D-line coach. He did a shit show of a job as head coach in San Fran. Manusky doesn't have a good track record as DC if I'm not mistaken. I also don't think that the Cowboys and Giants regress that much this season to lessen the gap between them and Washington.

Sorry - but your reply indicates a true lack of knowledge about the Redskins. I don't like the guy but Bruce Allen basically is their GM rt now. They also used the ex-GM's scouting service for their picks this year so I don't think that really hurt them (& their veteran FA picks appear to be good ones). The GM won't have to do a whole lot in-season.

As for the running game - again - why will this hurt the Redskins yet have absolutely no effect on the Giants who have a pretty bad running game? The Redskins don't need a monster running game in this era to be effective. They really just need to be more effective in the red zone & the additions of Perine, Doctson & Pryor should help in that area. BTW - what the hell does Tomsula being a bad HC have to do with him doing well as a defensive coach? He has a good reputation as a position coach, and there have been tons of good/great position coaches who turned out to be lousy head coaches - that observation just doesn't make sense.

No offense but your takes appear to be more emotionally driven & indicate a lack of knowledge in certain areas. Again - I am not stating that the Skins will make the playoffs or even have a winning record (that remains to be seen) - just stating that you are selling them short while overvaluing just about everything for the Giants.

 

[gkekoa]

I don't like the running game right now for the Skins. Yes you got Perine in the draft but I'm guessing R.Kelley will be the starter? If so, he had a solid game but that's about it. I think the lack of GM will play a factor. Not a huge one, but when the Panthers fired their GM 1-2 weeks ago, they immediately hired a interim. The Redskins don't have one. Is that on purpose or is Snyder holding both GM and Owner roles? I really don't like Tomsula as D-line coach. He did a shit show of a job as head coach in San Fran. Manusky doesn't have a good track record as DC if I'm not mistaken. I also don't think that the Cowboys and Giants regress that much this season to lessen the gap between them and Washington.

The running game wasn't terrible last season. We averaged 4.5 YPC and it is a passing league. I fully expect the running game to improve this season.

The GM isn't an issue. They have nothing to do with the field. Bruce Allen would be the de facto GM btw...it has nothing to do with Snyder.

Tomsula and Manusky concern is fine. Didn't they help the awesome DL in SF a few years back though? No matter what, I see them as an improvement over our former DC.

What did the Cowboys do to improve? They lost their starting RT and Leary.

What did NY do to improve? They didn't improve their putrid OL at all? Instead they went out and got another shiny WR.

It is the NFL, and anything can happen.

 

[Yo Tee]

Sorry - but your reply indicates a true lack of knowledge about the Redskins. I don't like the guy but Bruce Allen basically is their GM rt now. They also used the ex-GM's scouting service for their picks this year so I don't think that really hurt them (& their veteran FA picks appear to be good ones). The GM won't have to do a whole lot in-season.

As for the running game - again - why will this hurt the Redskins yet have absolutely no effect on the Giants who have a pretty bad running game? The Redskins don't need a monster running game in this era to be effective. They really just need to be more effective in the red zone & the additions of Perine, Doctson & Pryor should help in that area. BTW - what the hell does Tomsula being a bad HC have to do with him doing well as a defensive coach? He has a good reputation as a position coach, and there have been tons of good/great position coaches who turned out to be lousy head coaches - that observation just doesn't make sense.

No offense but your takes appear to be more emotionally driven & indicate a lack of knowledge in certain areas. Again - I am not stating that the Skins will make the playoffs or even have a winning record (that remains to be seen) - just stating that you are selling them short while overvaluing just about everything for the Giants.

You and I are just gonna have to agree to disagree because everything I say is wrong to you. The running game is an issue with the Giants but they have a better defense and a better offense in my opinion. Marshall and OBJ are a monster duo. Probably one of the best TEs in the draft. The Giants defense was the best in the NFC last year, they resigned JPP, they didn't really lose a lot on the defensive side.

 

[Yo Tee]

The running game wasn't terrible last season. We averaged 4.5 YPC and it is a passing league. I fully expect the running game to improve this season.

The GM isn't an issue. They have nothing to do with the field. Bruce Allen would be the de facto GM btw...it has nothing to do with Snyder.

Tomsula and Manusky concern is fine. Didn't they help the awesome DL in SF a few years back though? No matter what, I see them as an improvement over our former DC.

What did the Cowboys do to improve? They lost their starting RT and Leary.

What did NY do to improve? They didn't improve their putrid OL at all? Instead they went out and got another shiny WR.

It is the NFL, and anything can happen.

No the running game wasn't terrible but they were still 7th worst in the NFC in rushing yards. 7th most fumbles in the NFC. 7th most penalized offense in the NFC. The Skins' defense allowed the most first downs in the NFL last year. They let opposing offense convert 46.6% of their third down tries, the highest percentage in the NFL. The Redskins are a good team on paper, it's the little things they need to get down and be consistent at. Sometimes issues in the front office translate to issues in practice which then translate to issues on the field on gameday. The Cowboys didn't improve that much, but they didn't really need do. Unless there is a sophomore slump in Dak and Zeke, I see some of the same form them this year, not as good, but still better than Washington and Philly at least. The Giants o-line is bad, still, with that bad o-line, they made the playoffs. The Giants didn't just add a shiny WR, they added a guy who is 59 receptions away from 1,000 receptions and everytime he changes teams, his first season is usually a monster year. Yes, he's never played in the playoffs, but that's not his fault. He played for the Bears and Jets who were complete trash (except for the 2012 Bears team), he played for the Broncos when the didn't have a QB or a stellar defense, and the Dolphins who was probably the best team he played for.

 

[deanpet21]

You and I are just gonna have to agree to disagree because everything I say is wrong to you. The running game is an issue with the Giants but they have a better defense and a better offense in my opinion. Marshall and OBJ are a monster duo. Probably one of the best TEs in the draft. The Giants defense was the best in the NFC last year, they resigned JPP, they didn't really lose a lot on the defensive side.

Giants lost Hankins.

 

[deanpet21]

No the running game wasn't terrible but they were still 7th worst in the NFC in rushing yards. 7th most fumbles in the NFC. 7th most penalized offense in the NFC. The Skins' defense allowed the most first downs in the NFL last year. They let opposing offense convert 46.6% of their third down tries, the highest percentage in the NFL. The Redskins are a good team on paper, it's the little things they need to get down and be consistent at. Sometimes issues in the front office translate to issues in practice which then translate to issues on the field on gameday. The Cowboys didn't improve that much, but they didn't really need do. Unless there is a sophomore slump in Dak and Zeke, I see some of the same form them this year, not as good, but still better than Washington and Philly at least. The Giants o-line is bad, still, with that bad o-line, they made the playoffs. The Giants didn't just add a shiny WR, they added a guy who is 59 receptions away from 1,000 receptions and everytime he changes teams, his first season is usually a monster year. Yes, he's never played in the playoffs, but that's not his fault. He played for the Bears and Jets who were complete trash (except for the 2012 Bears team), he played for the Broncos when the didn't have a QB or a stellar defense, and the Dolphins who was probably the best team he played for.

The Giants won 11 games last year. Do you think they win more this year? Sorry just not buying the hype.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Redskins fumbles 2016 - 9, Giants - 11, Cowboys - 9
Redskins penalty yds 2016 -57/gm, Giants - 53, Cowboys -55 (basically the same for all)
Redskins Rushing yds/game - 106, Giants - 88, Cowboys - 150 (DAL way above both & entire NFC)
But - Redskins had 300/yds passing/gm, Giants - 242, Cowboys - 227

If you are going to use stats from last yr to compare things you are not going to make a very good case. Now you can state that the Giants D overcame all of this - fine. The Redskins defensive additions could do the same to an extent this season.

You appear to be basing this on stats w/o looking at the actual games. The Redskins fell short in a few games due to some silly turnovers and a wilting D. This is correctable via improved play by some (e.g. Cousins), replacing certain players (e.g. Matt Jones) and improvements on D (that I have already detailed).

I respect your opinion & I am not stating that everything you say is wrong - just the fact that you appear to give the Redskins just about no credit (beyond 4/5 wins this season) & also appear to be portraying the Giants as one of the SB favorites & dismiss just about any flaw on that team. HTTR

 

[Yo Tee]

The Giants won 11 games last year. Do you think they win more this year? Sorry just not buying the hype.

Looking at their schedule, I see them at least going 9-7 and that's with going 3-3 in their division which I think they'll go 4-2, and that's also with them losing to Raiders. Their tough games are against the Cowboys, Redskins away, Eagles away, Seahawks, Chiefs and Raiders. These games SHOULD be wins: Rams, 49ers, Chargers, Eagles at home, Redskins at home and Broncos. Toss up games against the Bucs, Cardinals and Lions, I could see them going anywhere between 7-9 to 11-5. So to answer your question, no, I reasonably don't see them doing better than 11-5 this year.

 

[Yo Tee]

Redskins fumbles 2016 - 9, Giants - 11, Cowboys - 9
Redskins penalty yds 2016 -57/gm, Giants - 53, Cowboys -55 (basically the same for all)
Redskins Rushing yds/game - 106, Giants - 88, Cowboys - 150 (DAL way above both & entire NFC)
But - Redskins had 300/yds passing/gm, Giants - 242, Cowboys - 227

If you are going to use stats from last yr to compare things you are not going to make a very good case. Now you can state that the Giants D overcame all of this - fine. The Redskins defensive additions could do the same to an extent this season.

You appear to be basing this on stats w/o looking at the actual games. The Redskins fell short in a few games due to some silly turnovers and a wilting D. This is correctable via improved play by some (e.g. Cousins), replacing certain players (e.g. Matt Jones) and improvements on D (that I have already detailed).

I respect your opinion & I am not stating that everything you say is wrong - just the fact that you appear to give the Redskins just about no credit (beyond 4/5 wins this season) & also appear to be portraying the Giants as one of the SB favorites & dismiss just about any flaw on that team. HTTR

Those starts are fine, but with those stats that you are using to say that the Redskins were just as good, if not better than, the Giants and Cowboys, they still finished 8-7-1 with no playoff spot. They also have the hardest schedule in the NFC. Giants have the 2nd hardest, Eagles and Cowboys are tied at 3rd hardest. I'm not dismissing the flaws, I am providing facts and stats to back up my opinions on the Redskins and my lack of confidence in them. You can provide any stat you want that makes the Redskins look good but they still barely had a winning record last year because of stupid mistakes.

To play devil's advocate, the Redskins were 5th in the league in scoring drives on offense, 6th in the league in rushing TDs, 3rd in the league in total yards on offense. But they were also 28th in yards given up on defense, 28th in rushing TDs allowed on defense, 24th in rushing yards allowed on defense and 32nd in average plays per drive and average yards per play. The Giants were 29th in first downs, 29th in rushing yards, 25th in total yards, 30th in average time of possession, but were also 2nd in points allowed on defense, 5th in first downs allowed on defense, 2nd in passing TDs allowed on defense, 2nd in yards per rushing attempt on defense, and 1st in average points allowed per drive. You can trust the Redskins offense to score, but if there is a mistake made on offense, you can't trust the Redskins defense to stop the opposing offense. Arguably, you can't trust the Giants offense to score or move the ball up the field, but you can have faith that the Giants defense will stop the opposing offense. The NFL is a defensive league as proven by the Super Bowl outcome. Had the Falcons played the same defense in the 2nd half as they did in the first half, the Falcons would be Super Bowl champs, not the Patriots.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Again - you are basing everything on last years Redskins defense - not the one for this season. This defense will have a totally revamped D line, as many as 3 new LBs who either start or have significant time and a totally new safety corps. This includes several rookies and vets who could make a substantial difference.

There is no way of knowing if this will work out well, but it is very promising - at least to the extent of stopping other teams much more than last season. We will see.

 

[Yo Tee]

Again - you are basing everything on last years Redskins defense - not the one for this season. This defense will have a totally revamped D line, as many as 3 new LBs who either start or have significant time and a totally new safety corps. This includes several rookies and vets who could make a substantial difference.

There is no way of knowing if this will work out well, but it is very promising - at least to the extent of stopping other teams much more than last season. We will see.

D.J Swearinger and Zach Brown are the only guys worth mentioning that you added. The Panthers had rookies in their defense and look how that played out for them last year. Terrell McClain has 90 tackles in 7 years, not even 13 tackles a year. Jonathan Allen and Ryan Anderson were good draft choices, 100%. But are you willing to bank the defense getting THAT much better on the backs of a safety who has started 13 games in 2 years and two Bama rookies? The money they overpaid and wasted on Ziggy, McGee and McClain, they could've thrown in D-Jax' face and got him to stay. Yeah he's 30, but he's consistent. Pryor, Crowder, Jackson and Garcon. What a freaking receiving corps! That right there would've been impressive.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

No way in hell that the Redskins could have or should have signed Pryor, Jackson AND Garcon especially since they drafted Doctson the previous year - makes no sense. Fine - let's just assume that Allen & Anderson will be so-so because of what happened w/ the Panthers last season - great analogy. I will put my money on Ryan Anderson doing very well this season. We will see.

I will go w/ your previous suggestion of agreeing to disagree since you obviously have an anti-Redskins bias & are a closet Giants fan. In your eyes the Redskins can't do anything right.

 

[Yo Tee]

No way in hell that the Redskins could have or should have signed Pryor, Jackson AND Garcon especially since they drafted Doctson the previous year - makes no sense. Fine - let's just assume that Allen & Anderson will be so-so because of what happened w/ the Panthers last season - great analogy. I will put my money on Ryan Anderson doing very well this season. We will see.

I will go w/ your previous suggestion of agreeing to disagree since you obviously have an anti-Redskins bias & are a closet Giants fan. In your eyes the Redskins can't do anything right.

It's not a bias, it's my opinion which is based on stats and facts. The defense sucked last year and the way they addressed it was by overpaying for Terrell McClain and Stacy McGee, resigning Ziggy Hood who should not of been resigned and throwing $1 million at a scrub like Chris Carter. Not to mention throwing $1 million at a scrub like Brian Quick.

They signed Terrell McClain to a 4 year $21 million deal and Stacy McGee to a 5 year $25 million deal. Desean signed a 3 year $33 mill deal with the Bucs and Garcon signed a 5 year $47.5 mill deal. Pryor was cheap at $8 mill. If they don't over pay for McClain or McGee, and didn't throw away $2 million at Carter and Quick, you probably could've afforded to keep D-Jax on for the same contract he signed with the Bucs. Probably couldn't keep Garcon but they could've kept Jackson.

We can keep debating if you want but if you keep telling me how I'm wrong and how my opinions are biased it's not gonna work. The facts are the Redskins defense sucked last year, they added 2 good pieces and 3 crap pieces, they lost two of their top receivers and replaced them with Terrelle Pryor (YAY) and Brian Quick (BOO), their DC gives me questions, their D-line coach gives me bigger questions. You yourself said that the Redskins cost themselves numerous games by making silly mistakes and a wilting D. D.J Swearinger, Zach Brown and Chris Carter don't make this defense turn a complete 180. Terrelle Pyror and Brian Quick don't equal Desean Jackson and Pierre Garcon. If you get rid of the contract of McClain, McGee, Quick, Hood and Carter, you have an extra $14.35 mill a year to give to Desean Jackson or Pierre Garcon not including the extra $6 million that they are still under the cap by. They could of afforded to keep at least D-Jax.

Another reason, their schedule. Another reason, their not even the 2nd best team in their division and in order for them to go 9-7 like some people say they will, they will more than likely need to have a winning divisional record which they have only had once since 2013.

 

[Yo Tee]

edit to my previous post: Two winning divisional records since 2006.

 

[Skin'EmAll]

My prediction are based on what happened last year, the guys they signed, the players they lost and the guys the other teams in the NFC East have signed and lost. So let's agree to disagree or y'all can get triggered and make an ass out of yourselves by cursing me out because I don't like your team this year.

oh man, I have friends who are Steelers. I'm a casual poster, I only tap into elite poster tier when absolutely necessary. I respect your opinions and welcome them -- just know I'm not going to be like "oh yeah 9 wins is silly"

 

[Niner Outlaw]

A down year is possible, but I think 5 wins is too low. 7-9 is a more realistic floor, though I personally see them coming out at 9-7, fighting for a WC spot.

 

[Skin'EmAll]

A down year is possible, but I think 5 wins is too low. 7-9 is a more realistic floor, though I personally see them coming out at 9-7, fighting for a WC spot.

I think that is what the majority would side with, whatever the record we should clinch a wildcard spot.
I believe this will be the 3rd year we are predicted to finish last in the division despite the talent, so I can understand why baring injury -- so many fans find it ridiculous.

A lot can change with film study in just one year, and there have been a ton of injuries already -- sadly some
key players are going to get hurt. It will affect the standings and that is not being taken into account.

 

[Yo Tee]

oh man, I have friends who are Steelers. I'm a casual poster, I only tap into elite poster tier when absolutely necessary. I respect your opinions and welcome them -- just know I'm not going to be like "oh yeah 9 wins is silly"

That's fine with me man. I welcome the debating. What I don't like is the "Again - you're wrong", "Again - ", "Again - ", it's so arrogant. You might as well just say, re-read my previous statement as to why you're wrong.

With that being said, with all these "amazing improvements" made on both sides of the ball, and the $74.5 million dollars they will shell out to improve this team, 1 more win is all you guys are expecting? 9-7 is not gonna be good enough this year. I really don't see it. With teams like the Packers, Falcons, Seahawks, Giants and Cowboys being better, the improvements made by the Panthers and Bucs who have improved more so than the Redskins and with the constant contention of the Lions and Cardinals, it's not as much of a lock as many think it is that they will be in the hung for a WC spot. Their schedule looks rough. Especially in November.

 

[deanpet21]

It's not a bias, it's my opinion which is based on stats and facts. The defense sucked last year and the way they addressed it was by overpaying for Terrell McClain and Stacy McGee, resigning Ziggy Hood who should not of been resigned and throwing $1 million at a scrub like Chris Carter. Not to mention throwing $1 million at a scrub like Brian Quick.

They signed Terrell McClain to a 4 year $21 million deal and Stacy McGee to a 5 year $25 million deal. Desean signed a 3 year $33 mill deal with the Bucs and Garcon signed a 5 year $47.5 mill deal. Pryor was cheap at $8 mill. If they don't over pay for McClain or McGee, and didn't throw away $2 million at Carter and Quick, you probably could've afforded to keep D-Jax on for the same contract he signed with the Bucs. Probably couldn't keep Garcon but they could've kept Jackson.

We can keep debating if you want but if you keep telling me how I'm wrong and how my opinions are biased it's not gonna work. The facts are the Redskins defense sucked last year, they added 2 good pieces and 3 crap pieces, they lost two of their top receivers and replaced them with Terrelle Pryor (YAY) and Brian Quick (BOO), their DC gives me questions, their D-line coach gives me bigger questions. You yourself said that the Redskins cost themselves numerous games by making silly mistakes and a wilting D. D.J Swearinger, Zach Brown and Chris Carter don't make this defense turn a complete 180. Terrelle Pyror and Brian Quick don't equal Desean Jackson and Pierre Garcon. If you get rid of the contract of McClain, McGee, Quick, Hood and Carter, you have an extra $14.35 mill a year to give to Desean Jackson or Pierre Garcon not including the extra $6 million that they are still under the cap by. They could of afforded to keep at least D-Jax.

Another reason, their schedule. Another reason, their not even the 2nd best team in their division and in order for them to go 9-7 like some people say they will, they will more than likely need to have a winning divisional record which they have only had once since 2013.

You discount the fact that the defense added coaches DC Maunsky and D line Tomsula. Plus you never mentioned Glaette which is an elite pass rusher when healthy and having a great camp. Plus we added the best d lineman in college football last year in Allen. If drafted by any other team the media would of went nuts. So adding a Pro Bowl LB in Brown doesn't mean anything? lol.

As for the WR's you don't put Docston into the equation? He is having a great camp and has 1st round WR talent. If you are going to praise the Giants rookie TE you have to do the same for Docston. Jackson and Garcon were grossly overpaid in FA. Jackson cant stay healthy for a 16 game season. Garcon got crazy money in his first year in SF. So yea, Pryor and Docston for Jackson and Garcon is actually an upgrade with way more upside.

McClain and Mcgee were solid signings. They are basically one year deals. Hood can now be a rotational d lineman. Where he should belong. He was forced to start last year b/c of injury. So now the dline has actually good depth.

 

[Stymietee]

It is fascinating to see how non-followers see other teams, ours included. How many times have people here posted that Dallas is going to take a step back, the Giants don't impress and/or Philly won't be a threat, all as a means to justify the rise of our team in the division? Anyone want to bet that fans of those teams aren't using our team as fodder to justify finishing ahead of us?

You have to respect @Terry Rode for coming in and verifying what we already know about fandom.It seems that the argument using stats are as valid or useless only to the extent as one wants to use them in that regard. Although there's the back and forth specifically about this team, the longer view is about the end game. So here's my suggestion:

Based on everything that we now know, I emphasize NOW KNOW, list the order of finish and the records in this division as you currently predict them to be.