Why the Giants didn't get Ohtani or Harper and will not get Soto

[msgkings322]

Most of you already know why left handed power hitters have zero interest in signing in SF...triples alley

To have the power alley be 425 feet for lefties, even after they brought in the fence a bit, it's insane. Why would any lefty in this era of home runs want to hit there? When they designed the park the game hadn't yet evolved to where it is now, all about launch angles and home runs.

Patrick Bailey this past Saturday came up to bat with the Giants down 3-2 bottom of the 8th. With two outs he hits a mammoth shot, 430 feet to the deepest part of the yard (triples alley), he says "oh shit" then starts his home run trot, before realizing it's not going to leave the yard, it bounces off the wall and he gets a triple, with a very angry look on his face. He just hit the ball as well as he ever has and instead of tying the game late he's on 3rd with 2 outs...and of course doesn't score, Giants lose.

How different would Brandon Belt's career have gone if that alley wasn't there?

I get that we don't want cookie cutter parks, and the aesthetics of our park are the best in baseball partly due to these dimensions, but we have to just get over EVER bringing a lefty power hitter in as a free agent. Ohtani's people have said as much, big reason he gave us little attention. I also get that it's the same for both teams, and can even be an advantage for us designing a team with our park in mind.

We simply have to draft or trade for lefty power bats, which is why they drafted Hunter Bishop, and why they drafted a lefty power hitter #1 just now.

This isn't 'news' just heard the story on the morning radio and it reminded me not to ever think someone like Juan Soto will ever sign here, no matter how much 'cap space' we free up selling players like some of you want to do. And if Bishop or the new guy becomes a stud, they will leave when they are a FA (one benefit of the team friendly length of service rules for players is players can't leave as unrestricted FAs until they are in their late 20s at least)

Just musing on what I heard on the radio. This doesn't even get into the other factor, the heavy, foggy air which makes pitches break harder and takes a few feet off distances, and that one affects all hitters. We are who we are.

 

[calsnowskier]

Triples alley means this team will never win anything. How many runs has that thing cost this team? I am surprised we have ever even had a .500 record in this ball park.

 

[msgkings322]

Triples alley means this team will never win anything. How many runs has that thing cost this team? I am surprised we have ever even had a .500 record in this ball park.

It means what it means, we will never sign lefty power bats like Ohtani and Soto and when our lefties become FAs they will leave.

Which is why we will only win with pitching dominated teams and righty power like we did 10-14 years ago. And why people need to stop complaining when our front office doesn't land Harper/Ohtani/Soto/etc

 

[tzill]

Yup, it's not like the GREATEST LHH IN THE HISTORY OF BASEBALL played here or anything. When they're going INTO the water, it doesn't matter how vast triples alley is.

 

[msgkings322]

Yup, it's not like the GREATEST LHH IN THE HISTORY OF BASEBALL played here or anything. When they're going INTO the water, it doesn't matter how vast triples alley is.

Yeah let's use the illegally-enhanced unicorn example who signed here when the park was different to push back on the obvious truth.

Tell FZ to get ready to offer Soto a contract he will never accept.

Dumb post for you, you're better than this.

 

[tzill]

Yeah let's use the illegally-enhanced unicorn example who signed here when the park was different to push back on the obvious truth.

Tell FZ to get ready to offer Soto a contract he will never accept.

Dumb post for you, you're better than this.

Nope.

Nope, nope, nope.

 

[calsnowskier]

It means what it means, we will never sign lefty power bats like Ohtani and Soto and when our lefties become FAs they will leave.

Which is why we will only win with pitching dominated teams and righty power like we did 10-14 years ago. And why people need to stop complaining when our front office doesn't land Harper/Ohtani/Soto/etc

If hitters refuse to sign with us because it is such a pitching dominant yard, why aren’t we able to sign star pitcher after star pitcher at team-friendly contracts?

The park is not holding us back. A FO that has no clue how to build a team around that park is holding us back.

 

[msgkings322]

Nope.

Nope, nope, nope.

Oh god grow up tzill

You have really regressed as a poster lately

 

[msgkings322]

If hitters refuse to sign with us because it is such a pitching dominant yard, why aren’t we able to sign star pitcher after star pitcher at team-friendly contracts?

Good question. Not sure I have a good answer. We do sign pitchers sometimes though like Snell and Ray and Rodon etc. We will never sign a lefty power bat.

The park is not holding us back. A FO that has no clue how to build a team around that park is holding us back.

I agree in general, but my point stands, whatever we need to do, we need to do it without ever signing lefty power bats like Ohtanl and Soto. They simply are not available here as free agents.

 

[calsnowskier]

Good question. Not sure I have a good answer. We do sign pitchers sometimes though like Snell and Ray and Rodon etc. We will never sign a lefty power bat.

I agree in general, but my point stands, whatever we need to do, we need to do it without ever signing lefty power bats like Ohtanl and Soto. They simply are not available here as free agents.

Snell signed with us on a very player-friendly contract, after essentially being black-balled by the rest of the league.

Ray was a trade.

Rodon signed a 1-year, prove it contract. He is the example of what I think we should do EVERY year. Though, he was not exactly a HUGE signing when it happened. His stock was rather low when he was signed.

Gausman was a dumpster-dive.

Cueto/Scrabble were expensive, but I liked both contracts when they signed, and we need more of that.

 

[LHG]

Good question. Not sure I have a good answer. We do sign pitchers sometimes though like Snell and Ray and Rodon etc. We will never sign a lefty power bat.

I agree in general, but my point stands, whatever we need to do, we need to do it without ever signing lefty power bats like Ohtanl and Soto. They simply are not available here as free agents.

Your examples of pitchers signing here may actually help cal's point even further. Ray was a trade, so he doesn't even count. However, both Snell and Rodon had big question marks that was limiting them from getting the big deals they wanted. It possible that both only considered SF when the FO came knocking with a high value, short term deal that would allow them to demonstrate they were as good as they thought so they could quickly get back to the market and get the initial deal that they wanted.

 

[calsnowskier]

Oh god grow up tzill

You have really regressed as a poster lately

You constant whining about his posts, meanwhile, have been a demonstration of top-tier posting that I look forward to reading on a daily basis.

 

[msgkings322]

You constant whining about his posts, meanwhile, have been a demonstration of top-tier posting that I look forward to reading on a daily basis.

You'll miss out on those if he ever stops the bullshit.

 

[LHG]

Nope.

Nope, nope, nope.

Did you mean to say that it was not illegal, either federally or with the MLB, at the time of the alleged usage and that studies showed that the power deferential was only a few feet so it made warning track hitters into barely home run hitters?

 

[tzill]

Oh god grow up tzill

You have really regressed as a poster lately

"growing up" is not challenging a falsehood??

Cmon man.

 

[tzill]

Did you mean to say that it was not illegal, either federally or with the MLB, at the time of the alleged usage and that studies showed that the power deferential was only a few feet so it made warning track hitters into barely home run hitters?

I didn't want to rehash this as we talked about it for a while but:

There was nothing codified in baseball when Barry was using (and yes, I assume the "cream and the clear" were steroids). There was an advisory notice the commissioner sent to the MLBPA but nothing bargained into the CBA. Thus, it was not "illegal." That was my only point. Once it was codified, he never tested positive. He played the game. Like Willie Mays and lots of others did in the 50s and 60s with greenies. Not illegal until it was.

 

[chappee11]

Most of you already know why left handed power hitters have zero interest in signing in SF...triples alley

To have the power alley be 425 feet for lefties, even after they brought in the fence a bit, it's insane. Why would any lefty in this era of home runs want to hit there? When they designed the park the game hadn't yet evolved to where it is now, all about launch angles and home runs.

Patrick Bailey this past Saturday came up to bat with the Giants down 3-2 bottom of the 8th. With two outs he hits a mammoth shot, 430 feet to the deepest part of the yard (triples alley), he says "oh shit" then starts his home run trot, before realizing it's not going to leave the yard, it bounces off the wall and he gets a triple, with a very angry look on his face. He just hit the ball as well as he ever has and instead of tying the game late he's on 3rd with 2 outs...and of course doesn't score, Giants lose.

How different would Brandon Belt's career have gone if that alley wasn't there?

I get that we don't want cookie cutter parks, and the aesthetics of our park are the best in baseball partly due to these dimensions, but we have to just get over EVER bringing a lefty power hitter in as a free agent. Ohtani's people have said as much, big reason he gave us little attention. I also get that it's the same for both teams, and can even be an advantage for us designing a team with our park in mind.

We simply have to draft or trade for lefty power bats, which is why they drafted Hunter Bishop, and why they drafted a lefty power hitter #1 just now.

This isn't 'news' just heard the story on the morning radio and it reminded me not to ever think someone like Juan Soto will ever sign here, no matter how much 'cap space' we free up selling players like some of you want to do. And if Bishop or the new guy becomes a stud, they will leave when they are a FA (one benefit of the team friendly length of service rules for players is players can't leave as unrestricted FAs until they are in their late 20s at least)

Just musing on what I heard on the radio. This doesn't even get into the other factor, the heavy, foggy air which makes pitches break harder and takes a few feet off distances, and that one affects all hitters. We are who we are.

Bonds did OK in that ballpark as a lefty. The reason the Giants won’t sign Soto is because they are too cheap and won’t pay anything close to what it takes to get him.

 

[msgkings322]

Bonds did OK in that ballpark as a lefty. The reason the Giants won’t sign Soto is because they are too cheap and won’t pay anything close to what it takes to get him.

Here ya go @tzill , you sound like this dope

Word games about Bonds roiding up are boring. We both know what I meant, that the roided up unicorn who signed here years before the park opened does not disprove my point that lefty sluggers will never sign to play in that park.

 

[chappee11]

Here ya go @tzill , you sound like this dope

Word games about Bonds roiding up are boring. We both know what I meant, that the roided up unicorn who signed here years before the park opened does not disprove my point that lefty sluggers will never sign to play in that park.

You want to talk about the ballpark. How about these factors?

-California State taxes
-The perception that San Fran is a feces-covered hellhole(this is why JD Martinez didn’t want to play there)
-The Giants didn’t make the best offer for a guy like Harper(and they never really do on big name free agents)

Nah. Can’t be any of those. Better to blame the scary ballpark!

Triples Alley!! Oh, the horror!!

 

[msgkings322]

You want to talk about the ballpark. How about these factors?

-California State taxes
-The perception that San Fran is a feces-covered hellhole(this is why JD Martinez didn’t want to play there)
-The Giants didn’t make the best offer for a guy like Harper(and they never really do on big name free agents)

Nah. Can’t be any of those. Better to blame the scary ballpark!

Triples Alley!! Oh, the horror!!

Also good points, my factor is every bit as important though