What can the Giants do that's practical?

[nateistheshi]

As I've already said, I definitely don't want the Giants going after Reyes because there's going to be a few teams that need a SS at the trading deadline that are still contenders. As the best available, the Mets should be able to get a good sized haul for him and they probably wouldn't have to pick up any of his salary either. Guys like Scutaro should be available too, but the Red Sox wouldn't have to trade him so they'd have a lot of leverage, and they aren't good trading partners for the Giants since they would most likely want a MLB ready catcher for Scutaro.

If the Giants decide to trade for somebody, I don't want it to be a SS to shift Tejada to 3B while Panda is out, it needs to be a guy that can play multiple positions and won't cost too much in terms of prospects. I know it sounds crazy to say this, but the guy I want the Giants to look at is...Chone Figgins. I know he's only played 150 innings at SS in his career, but does anybody really think that his range would be as bad as Tejada, or that his arm would be as bad as Fontenot? His contract has been dead weight for the Mariners so they'd love to pick up some salary to get rid of him.

His contract breaks down as follows: 9M for 2011, 9M for 2012, 8M for 2013, and a 9M option for 2014 that vests if he gets 600 PA in 2013, but by then he'll be 35 years old and it should be pretty easy for the Giants to keep him well rested and prevent him from getting 600PA. If the Giants could get the Mariners to pick up about 8M of his remaining contract so that the Giants would end up paying 6M per year then I'm sure the Mariners would love to jump on that (they might compete in 2013 but unless the FO is incredibly stupid, they know that they shouldn't compete this year or next.) Maybe it would take something along the lines of Tommy Joseph, Francisco Peguero, and Jorge Bucardo (3 guys with potential that are with major flaws) to get him with the Mariners picking up some salary.

He'd be filling the role that Mark Derosa was supposed to fill, only he's still got some wheels, and with Sabean's comments that our team is too right handed, as a switch hitter he helps out in that department too. He's also played some OF as recently as 2009, so he's pretty versatile, and from what I can see on Fangraphs he's been slightly below average defensively at every position except 3B over his career (slightly above average there.) I think that Tejada would be a decent player if he stayed well rested and got more days off (the same can be said about a lot of players on the Giants that would get more rest by doing this like Sanchez, Burrell, Ross.)

So, what do you hope the Giants do for Tejada insurance and to help replace Panda while he's on the DL? Do you trust the likes of Burriss, Fontenot, and Rohlinger to get the job done? Who else is available? Am I crazy for considering Figgins?

 

[SFGRTB]

Figgens would be crazy. We would be adding big money for another player who doesn't deserve it. If they would take Rowand, then maybe but at this point Rowand has been our best hitter (never thought I'd say that :/). I expect Rowand to falter a bit as he usually does after a hit April/May. But I hate to say we kind if need him right now.

The thing that's unfortunate about this is that 3rd/SS are our weakest depth wise. We have 7 guys who could fill in for the 3 OF and 1B and do a respectable job filling in. It's a shame that when Belt and Yorres come back, we'll likely have to sit our 2 hottest hitters right now (Burrell and Rowand).

 

[nateistheshi]

Figgens would be crazy. We would be adding big money for another player who doesn't deserve it. If they would take Rowand, then maybe but at this point Rowand has been our best hitter (never thought I'd say that :/). I expect Rowand to falter a bit as he usually does after a hit April/May. But I hate to say we kind if need him right now.

The thing that's unfortunate about this is that 3rd/SS are our weakest depth wise. We have 7 guys who could fill in for the 3 OF and 1B and do a respectable job filling in. It's a shame that when Belt and Yorres come back, we'll likely have to sit our 2 hottest hitters right now (Burrell and Rowand).

While it's true that he doesn't deserve his current pay, if the Mariners picked up about 8M of his remaining contract then he'd be paid about the market value for what we can expect for his production. I don't think it's unreasonable to think he could produce at least 1.2 WAR per year, which is worth the 6M/year.

While this is very true, I don't think they will be our two hottest players in a few weeks when Belt could likely be back. Also Torres + Belt is a huge defensive upgrade over Rowand + Burrell.

What do you think the Giants should do to get insurance for Tejada and to help replace Panda's production for approximately the next 6 weeks?

 

[sfsportsfan]

i dont see reyes as that horrible of an option. why would the mets be picking up his salary? he has an 11 million dollar option for the year. come deadline he would only be owed about 6 million, right? i dont like the idea of giving up a lot for a rental player. i saw you mention a few teams yesterday, though off the top the only i remember is milwaukee. could the brewers even afford to take him on though? besides, they have betancort(sp?) whos not horrible.

aside from his injury problem though i dont think reyes is that bad of a player. he has a career average of .286, .344 on base, .436 slug. 13 homers a season, 58 steals. figgins on the other hand has a similar average, slightly better on base, but thats it in comparison. with your idea, both would be getting 6 a year, but at least with reyes we wouldnt be handicapped by a longer contract. once the season ends we wave bye to reyes. not to mention figgins fell way off once he went up north. not sure if its seattle, the pressure of the contract, or what.



(not sure if this is even a possibility) but what about brian roberts? can he play short? with him starting to age/the orioles inevitably falling to bottom of the east, is there any chance they move him? he's under contract through '13, and has been a solid player throughout his career (with the exception of being hurt last year). what would we have to give up for him?

what about stephen drew? any chance the d'bags would give him up? who would we have to give up for him? do we want to trade prospects within the division? do they wanna trade him in the division? obviously though he wouldn't be cheap to pick up. i'd love it if we can get him and lock him up though.

 

[nateistheshi]

i dont see reyes as that horrible of an option. why would the mets be picking up his salary? he has an 11 million dollar option for the year. come deadline he would only be owed about 6 million, right? i dont like the idea of giving up a lot for a rental player. i saw you mention a few teams yesterday, though off the top the only i remember is milwaukee. could the brewers even afford to take him on though? besides, they have betancort(sp?) whos not horrible.

aside from his injury problem though i dont think reyes is that bad of a player. he has a career average of .286, .344 on base, .436 slug. 13 homers a season, 58 steals. figgins on the other hand has a similar average, slightly better on base, but thats it in comparison. with your idea, both would be getting 6 a year, but at least with reyes we wouldnt be handicapped by a longer contract. once the season ends we wave bye to reyes. not to mention figgins fell way off once he went up north. not sure if its seattle, the pressure of the contract, or what.



(not sure if this is even a possibility) but what about brian roberts? can he play short? with him starting to age/the orioles inevitably falling to bottom of the east, is there any chance they move him? he's under contract through '13, and has been a solid player throughout his career (with the exception of being hurt last year). what would we have to give up for him?

what about stephen drew? any chance the d'bags would give him up? who would we have to give up for him? do we want to trade prospects within the division? do they wanna trade him in the division? obviously though he wouldn't be cheap to pick up. i'd love it if we can get him and lock him up though.

Besides the Brewers, other teams that could very well be looking for SS help at the deadline are the Angels and the Cardinals. The Brewers probably don't have the trade chips at this point to get Reyes, but we do, the Angels do, and the Cardinals do. If the Cardinals decided to show Pujols that they are committed to winning while he is there, then they could probably put together the best package since the Angels wouldn't trade Trout for just about anything. If the Cards seriously want him, the only way the Giants can outbid them is if they trade Belt and Wheeler...no thank you. In addition, part of our need is at 3B now, and I think Reyes is solely a SS, with wrist injuries they say that it takes close to a year for it to fully heal if you rest properly, so it's unfortunate, but unlikely that Pablo will continue to rake when he returns.

The 3 biggest differences in Figgins 2009 to 2010 seasons are: a .042 point decrease in BABIP (some regression and some luck, but as a speedster who puts the ball on the ground often, .314 seems a little low and it is below his career average of .334,) a 3.1% decrease in BB rate (this is probably about where we should expect his BB rate to be since 2009 looks like an outlier,) and a career low UZR at 2B (he wouldn't primarily be a 2B on the Giants anyway, he looks to be at least adequate at 3B and SS over his career.)

I do like Brian Roberts a lot, and he is a great player, but the last time he played in the majors at a position other than 2B was 2003. With Freddy Sanchez looking pretty solid, 2B isn't really a need for us, also Roberts can block trades to 12 teams this year, so if we're on his no-trade list then he's not an option. I do think that the Orioles will look to deal Roberts at some point, but they probably want to him to rebuild some value this year to show potential trade partners that he's still capable of playing a full season.

Stephen Drew is really good, and he's coming off a 5.1 WAR season. He's signed through 2012, with a mutual option for 10M in 2013, at a freaking bargain. He's a Boras client though, meaning that he might turn down his end of that mutual in 2013 to be a FA a year earlier. In addition, when the Dbacks were looking for offers on Upton this winter, their GM made it clear that they wouldn't deal him within the division, for this reason I think that the price would be much higher if Drew was dealt within the division. The Diamondbacks also have no reason to deal him this year, yes they know that they aren't contenders, but if some prospects pan out and Upton takes a step forward, they could contend next year. For these reasons, the asking price for Stephen Drew starts at the same asking price as Reyes, and will be much higher.

The players you suggested are good players, and I'm not trying to criticize you at all (sorry if I came off that way,) I just think that the Giants are going to look more at a guy who plays multiple positions since neither Rohlinger nor Burriss is a solution, and the health and consistency of our infield are both now very much in question.

Any other suggestions? I hope if they make a move they do it soon, because none of Fontenot, Rohlinger, Burriss, or Tejada (if he doesn't start taking some walks) are everyday players on a team that wants to win.

 

[Heathbar012]

I think the main problem with Reyes will be the price of prospects. If Wheeler and Belt are kept out of the deal, I could be swayed, but I think you're right to assume that the Cardinals or Angels would offer more than the Giants.

I think sportsfan is right to look toward the Orioles, but Roberts is a little too pricey, money-wise for me, and I, too, am not sold that he could play a solid defensive shortshop. Once J.J. Hardy comes back from his shoulder injury, though, he could be a possibility. Granted, the Os only have him signed for one year, so they might just wait it out. However, maybe part of the reason for the signing was if they weren't competing for the playoffs (don't know why they would in that division), they could ship him for some prospects. The better the prospects they get in return, the more salary I would assume they would pick up.

I would be alright with getting Reyes for the package that you originally suggested, but I fear it will take more. Hardy, on the other hand, if healthy, could be a solid pick-up that eases the potential Tejada mistake.

 

[sfsportsfan]

didnt franchez play 3rd in pitts? any chance he could play short and we could open our search to a 2nd baseman also?

 

[calsnowskier]

I think the main problem with Reyes will be the price of prospects. If Wheeler and Belt are kept out of the deal, I could be swayed, but I think you're right to assume that the Cardinals or Angels would offer more than the Giants.

I think sportsfan is right to look toward the Orioles, but Roberts is a little too pricey, money-wise for me, and I, too, am not sold that he could play a solid defensive shortshop. Once J.J. Hardy comes back from his shoulder injury, though, he could be a possibility. Granted, the Os only have him signed for one year, so they might just wait it out. However, maybe part of the reason for the signing was if they weren't competing for the playoffs (don't know why they would in that division), they could ship him for some prospects. The better the prospects they get in return, the more salary I would assume they would pick up.

I would be alright with getting Reyes for the package that you originally suggested, but I fear it will take more. Hardy, on the other hand, if healthy, could be a solid pick-up that eases the potential Tejada mistake.

I am against trading for Reyes. I have been pretty clear about that for a few months now. (just making that clear)

If you are taking Wheeler AND Belt off the table, the Mets will hang up and have no more discussions with us. I think the Wheeler / Neal / Adrianza package is about what it take to land him, and I would NOT want to pay that price.

 

[Heathbar012]

I am against trading for Reyes. I have been pretty clear about that for a few months now. (just making that clear)

If you are taking Wheeler AND Belt off the table, the Mets will hang up and have no more discussions with us. I think the Wheeler / Neal / Adrianza package is about what it take to land him, and I would NOT want to pay that price.

+1

 

[nateistheshi]

I am against trading for Reyes. I have been pretty clear about that for a few months now. (just making that clear)

If you are taking Wheeler AND Belt off the table, the Mets will hang up and have no more discussions with us. I think the Wheeler / Neal / Adrianza package is about what it take to land him, and I would NOT want to pay that price.

Exactly, they want guys that can pan out to be equal to or better than Reyes. Interesting development today in that the timing of it is perfect for a stopgap for the Giants:

Rays Designate Felipe Lopez For Assignment: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

Obviously he's just a temporary solution if the Giants were interested, but he can play 2B, SS, and 3B without embarassing himself too badly. He's got to be better than any of Rohlinger, Burriss, Fontenot, or Tejada playing full time, right?

 

[Heathbar012]

Exactly, they want guys that can pan out to be equal to or better than Reyes. Interesting development today in that the timing of it is perfect for a stopgap for the Giants:

Rays Designate Felipe Lopez For Assignment: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

Obviously he's just a temporary solution if the Giants were interested, but he can play 2B, SS, and 3B without embarassing himself too badly. He's got to be better than any of Rohlinger, Burriss, Fontenot, or Tejada playing full time, right?

I like that. I think it's worth a shot, but who gets bumped? Is this road trip Nate's Swan Song? Then who gets bumped when Belt comes up? Burriss?

 

[ColinCoby]

Exactly, they want guys that can pan out to be equal to or better than Reyes. Interesting development today in that the timing of it is perfect for a stopgap for the Giants:

Rays Designate Felipe Lopez For Assignment: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

Obviously he's just a temporary solution if the Giants were interested, but he can play 2B, SS, and 3B without embarassing himself too badly. He's got to be better than any of Rohlinger, Burriss, Fontenot, or Tejada playing full time, right?

Man, the guy had such a great year in 2009, only to really suck since then. I remember some of us threw his name out there before the 2010 season as a possible signing for the Giants.

 

[Heathbar012]

Man, the guy had such a great year in 2009, only to really suck since then. I remember some of us threw his name out there before the 2010 season as a possible signing for the Giants.

Those are the guys the Giants had some luck with, recently. So far this year, maybe not so much, but the season is young!

 

[Heathbar012]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Report: San Francisco Giants talk about trade for New York Mets' Jose Reyes - ESPN New York

 

[calsnowskier]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Report: San Francisco Giants talk about trade for New York Mets' Jose Reyes - ESPN New York

One Giant who’s batting 1.000 on the trip, plus a few thoughts on Reyes/Tejada, etc. | Extra Baggs

"Let’s address this Jose Reyes trade speculation head on:

The Giants are not talking seriously to the Mets about a trade. If any conversations have happened at all, it’s nothing more than tire kicking. “If the time comes, keep us in the loop.” That sort of thing.

There will be much interest in Reyes if the Mets make him available nearer to the July 31 trade deadline. But he won’t be traded now, a week from now or probably even a month from now. So adjust your expectations accordingly.

That’s easier said than done, I realize — especially after the respective games that Tejada and Reyes had last night. Reyes reached base in all six of his plate appearances, and while his play at shortstop was routine, it also looked stunningly quick and athletic to anyone who has watched the Giants all season.

And Tejada was 0 for 5, popping up in the ninth with the infield in and the go-ahead run at third base. It was probably his worst at-bat of the season, which is saying something.

The Giants will have another third baseman on Tuesday when Mark DeRosa comes off the DL. I’m sure they will be happy to have another option at the position."

Cool your jets, man...

 

[Heathbar012]

I wasn't too worried, but even the fact that he'll be a free agent next year won't help the prospect price fall too much. Certainly not enough to warrant a two (hopefully, three) month rental. No chance a 27 year-old, speedy shortshop with All-Star potential signs a contract extension. No Belt or Wheeler, no deal.