Top Three Most Poorly Operated NBA Franchises

[The Q]

What are you babbling about now? lol

They had 4 #1 picks. 3 of the 4 became stars. Irving, Lebron and Wiggins. They traded Bennett for Love, another star. That is 4/4 or 100% on getting stars with their #1 pick.

In the 2012, 13 and 14 drafts the guy they selected Dion Waiters, is he any worse than Michael kid Gilchrist the #2 pick?

In the 2013 draft after Bennett who was traded for love, there is Oladipo, Otto Porter, Cody Zeller, Alex Len...None of those players would have stayed with the Cavs and would have been included in the Love trade either way.

In the 2014 draft after Wiggins there was Jabari Parker, who ended up worse than Wiggins.

You are grasping at straws here kid.

Wiggins is not a star. At all.

If he was jimmy butler would still be in Minny.

 

[lebron23james]

Wiggins is not a star. At all.

If he was jimmy butler would still be in Minny.

He's a fringe star, so is Jimmy Butler....Remember Wiggins is only 23, go back and see what buthole was putting up at age 23

 

[lebron23james]

HAHAHAHA!!!! You do realize Stephen A Smith for YEARS has been saying the Cavs screwed up by getting Love right? He's been saying they need to trade him for years. But THAT is what you want to show? Please tell me you are wanting to tell me you like Stephen A as a viable source on their front office... PLEASE. Because he was very talkative about their coaches, about JR, About the Irving trade, about Love, about what the cavs squandered.

Lol... because they didn't say Anthony Bennett was a bad pick, he therefore had to be a great one. You are actually believing that?

Great point on the paying top dollar for two stars. That was a big loss, not just with handing over all the picks for Love, but adding a massive salary that limited them substantially like you say.

And "nobody was available". Lots of role players were. And Isiah Thomas went to Boston for basically nothing.

In the end, you are right, they struggled to add talent with no rookie scale depth. For Bynum/Jack/Deng, Love, rights to Murpy (never played), Shumpert, JR, and Mozgov in the few months before and after adding Lebron:

Cleveland gave up a 1st overall pick
The previous years #1 pick
The previous years #4 pick
8 other first round picks
6 other 2nd round picks
Their trade exemption.


Yeah, no crap they had no money to spend. They gave up a LOT of value for a couple role players and Love. and like you said, took themselves out of the much better free agent market of 2014 to boot.

Just stop with your embarrassing takes, they are hard to stomach

Do you think the heat screwed up by getting Bosh? Love was the 3rd option on a championship team.

Kevin Love averaged in the playoffs 15.3 points and 10 rebounds

Chris Bosh (with the heat) averaged in the playoffs 14.87 points and 7.3 rebounds

It's like we have gone over many times, the Cavs had a team that would have been a dynasty if not for GS, possibly the best team in NBA history. We didn't get to play a Mavs team with 1 star. We have been over this over and over but you are too dumb to realize this. They had bad timing with GS, there isn't typically a team with 4 superstars on the same team, unless you can recall any.

Just stop well you are so far behind, not for me but for everyone else with a brain

 

[Stakesarehigh]

 

[lebron23james]

I won't even mention this kid doesn't even understand how simple statistics work. A 70% chance for a star means 30 out of 100 won't be stars. Statistics are not very accurate on a small sample sizes. Most people would consider 3 a small sample size.

Even with that said if Irving is a superstar

Also Wiggins at age 23 still has a very real possibility to turn into a full blown star. He is putting up 20 a night already and doesn't seem very motivated. Even Harden at age 23 was only putting up 25. Jimmy Butler was dropping 8.

 

[The Q]

I won't even mention this kid doesn't even understand how simple statistics work. A 70% chance for a star means 30 out of 100 won't be stars. Statistics are not very accurate on a small sample sizes. Most people would consider 3 a small sample size.

Also Wiggins at age 23 still has a very real possibility to turn into a full blown star. He is putting up 20 a night already and doesn't seem very motivated. Even Harden at age 23 was only putting up 25.

As a 23 year old butler had 7 wins shares, Wiggins has .5

BPM for butler was 1.9, Wiggins -3.3

VORP for butler was 2.1, Wiggins -.5


Frankly it’s not even close

 

[lebron23james]

As a 23 year old butler had 7 wins shares, Wiggins has .5

BPM for butler was 1.9, Wiggins -3.3

VORP for butler was 2.1, Wiggins -.5


Frankly it’s not even close

The difference is Wiggins doesn't care. How much is win share affected when all you care about is the money?

Wiggins had a higher win share last year with Butler on the same team to start the season before he was traded

 

[lebron23james]

Lol... because they didn't say Anthony Bennett was a bad pick, he therefore had to be a great one. You are actually believing that?

Great point on the paying top dollar for two stars. That was a big loss, not just with handing over all the picks for Love, but adding a massive salary that limited them substantially like you say.

And "nobody was available". Lots of role players were. And Isiah Thomas went to Boston for basically nothing.

In the end, you are right, they struggled to add talent with no rookie scale depth. For Bynum/Jack/Deng, Love, rights to Murpy (never played), Shumpert, JR, and Mozgov in the few months before and after adding Lebron:

Cleveland gave up a 1st overall pick
The previous years #1 pick
The previous years #4 pick
8 other first round picks
6 other 2nd round picks
Their trade exemption.


Yeah, no crap they had no money to spend. They gave up a LOT of value for a couple role players and Love. and like you said, took themselves out of the much better free agent market of 2014 to boot.

Why would we care how Bennett turned out? If he turned into Michael Jordan or if he went bust out of the league? Why would we care. He was getting traded once lebron came back because we were no longer going to have time to develop young rookie talent which often takes 5-7 years before the enter their prime. The fact that he never developed into anything means nothing to any Cavs fan. It's actually a benefit that we didn't give away a true superstar. Very odd angle you are going for here...lol

Kevin Love averaged 26 points a game before he came to CLE. He is a 5X all-star, won a championship and put up 15, 10 on over 40% from three in the playoffs. Seems pretty good too me.

Isash Thomas sucked

You are too focused on the draft picks. That is only part of building a team. Most teams are not built from the draft that have won the most championships. You know why? Because the draft is a crap shoot. The Cavs also got back players that were also picked in the draft at some point right or were they walk ons? We added the #2 pick in the Kyrie Draft onto our team with Lebron for nothing...Funny how you glossed over that.

And all those players you listed we won a championship with so i still don't get your point...

 

[lebron23james]

LA is willing to give up
This years #2 pick
Last years #2 pick
The year before that #2 pick
The #7 pick they let walk

You know why, because picks mean nothing when you have lebron, and our in win now mode. The reason you don't understand this is because you are a Denver fan, and a stupid moron at the same time...So i hope this sinks in

Next time stick to something you understand better, maybe try your hand at soccer

Teams with Lebron have a short window to quickly get better

@Rockinkuwait

 

[Montalban]

Timberwolves
Nets
Lakers

 

[megalodon30]

I get the argument. The Cavs are a bottom tier franchise that lucked into 2 different runs with one of the greatest basketball players of all time and have 1 championship to show for it. Outside of having a GOAT, Cleveland is a pretty mediocre franchise. We'll see how they fare post-LeBron, but I wouldn't put much stock in 'em.

 

[Pastafazul]

The Knicks by far are the worst franchise in the history of sports! No excuse for them not to be in post season every year. This is New York City , the biggest tourist attraction in the world with the best of everything!

I ain’t sitting here and breaking it down any further, you have to be one of them progressive nuts jobs to think any other way!

 

[dtgold88]

I get the argument. The Cavs are a bottom tier franchise that lucked into 2 different runs with one of the greatest basketball players of all time and have 1 championship to show for it. Outside of having a GOAT, Cleveland is a pretty mediocre franchise. We'll see how they fare post-LeBron, but I wouldn't put much stock in 'em.

Cavs tanked not once, but twice to get Lebron......and it worked both times. Beat a GS no one else has beaten in the playoffs, and no one but GS has beaten them in Lebron 2.0

 

[megalodon30]

Cavs tanked not once, but twice to get Lebron......and it worked both times. Beat a GS no one else has beaten in the playoffs, and no one but GS has beaten them in Lebron 2.0

And? That tanking to get one of the greatest basketball players ever got them one championship. Compared to GSW, who built a great team, have won multiple championships, and will probably win at least a couple more.

Meanwhile, Cleveland will be in the lottery for the next several years because they decided to sell out everything for one player. Not the workings of a first class organization.

 

[lebron23james]

And? That tanking to get one of the greatest basketball players ever got them one championship. Compared to GSW, who built a great team, have won multiple championships, and will probably win at least a couple more.

Meanwhile, Cleveland will be in the lottery for the next several years because they decided to sell out everything for one player. Not the workings of a first class organization.

GSW got luck tho. You know why so few teams have done what GS has done? Because it's nearly impossible to build a team through the draft. How many bad teams are still bad after decades of building through the draft? Orl? Suns? Minn? Sac? Clippers? Hornets? etc

1 championship is more than half the NBA has, some teams have never even made a finals.

Also GSW team was bad timing for the Cavs, plus injuries or they likely would have had 3-4 with how they built that team

 

[Stakesarehigh]

I get the argument. The Cavs are a bottom tier franchise that lucked into 2 different runs with one of the greatest basketball players of all time and have 1 championship to show for it. Outside of having a GOAT, Cleveland is a pretty mediocre franchise. We'll see how they fare post-LeBron, but I wouldn't put much stock in 'em.

The issue I have with people calling it luck in Clevelands case is that it's not like they call it luck when a West coast guy wants to stay closer to LA or a kid from the Bronx wants to go to the Knicks. But only in the Cavs case is it called luck.

 

[lebron23james]

The issue I have with people calling it luck in Clevelands case is that it's not like they call it luck when a West coast guy wants to stay closer to LA or a kid from the Bronx wants to go to the Knicks. But only in the Cavs case is it called luck.

It's an odd argument. Outside of Wade getting drafted in Mia they weren't very good either. Without Wade, Lebron would have never gone to Mia, and they would have a franchise with 0 rings.

Getting 1 player is hard, it's the reason many teams have not got their 1 player...Let alone, building a championship team once you get the right guy.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

It's an odd argument. Outside of Wade getting drafted in Mia they weren't very good either. Without Wade, Lebron would have never gone to Mia, and they would have a franchise with 0 rings.

Getting 1 player is hard, it's the reason many teams have not got their 1 player...

There are very few transcendent players like LeBron or to a lesser extent Wade. Kg barely won shit until he teamed up with two other stars. AD has one series win. Philly has taken what.... Seven years to build this team?

It's rare to strike gold like the Warriors did in the draft or manage to build a competitor overnight like Boston did with KG etc

 

[lebron23james]

There are very few transcendent players like LeBron or to a lesser extent Wade. Kg barely won shit until he teamed up with two other stars. AD has one series win. Philly has taken what.... Seven years to build this team?

It's rare to strike gold like the Warriors did in the draft or manage to build a competitor overnight like Boston did with KG etc

Rare and lucky. They also added Durant. Without Durant they most likely would also be a 1 ring wonder. They wouldn't have beat Houston last year, and possibly OKC the year before that or w/e team durant went too.

So basically what he is saying is we should all follow the GS model. Draft superstars all around the same time and then add Durant to become one of the only teams in NBA history to have 4 superstars on the same team. Why didn't more teams think of this?...lol

 

[The Q]

The Cavs wouldn’t have even Made the playoff since 2010 had Lebron been born literally anywhere else in the entire world.

Their drafts outside of the clippers clippering in 2011 have been abysmal.

Their moves even with Lebron have been mediocre at best (Larry Hughes anyone?)

Lebron saves them from the list only because the post Jordan Bulls, post Ewing Knicks and the laughable wizards are just so bad.