POLL Top 10 poll #21: #21 player in history - Runoff

[calsnowskier]

Runoff for the #21 player in baseball history. Poll closes Monday AM.

Spoiler: Tags

@navamind @LHG
@steveringo @broncosmitty @packerzrule
@jarntt @redseat
@black francis @molsaniceman @Fountain City Blues
@Used 2 B Hu @MilkSpiller22 @chappee11
@CitySushi @Clayton @UK Cowboy
@Beengay fudgepackers @Hbomb @Maximus Rex
@Pure Steel @jon2tanman @Boglodyte
@nynasty @Hank Kingsley @Wamu
@Robotech @kcden @jwolt92
@Sportsguy9695 @DHoey @chillerdab
@DorianRo @socaljim242
@msgkings322 @Cedrique @BigFin
@catman @omarsrevenge @rmilia1
@obxyankeefan @femurov @Nosferatu
@Maverick426h @TheGoodMan19 @Bodega
@blstoker @Diamondeye @trojanfan12
@mr.hockey4242 @Janus @VikingFan2k2
@Stakesarehigh @eaglesnut @boogiewithstu2007
@SF11704 @Hunter Montana

 

[Clayton]

Never seen the movie. Hate the Red Sox. Vote for Pedro

 

[calsnowskier]

Pedro Martinez 1992 - 2009

3 CY, 4 top 5 CY, 2 top 5 MVP, 4 more season w MVP votes, 8 ASG

Bold: ERA 5, K 3, WHIP 6, K/BB 5

219-100 W-L
3154/760 K/BB
409/46 GS/CG
2827.1 IP

Lefty Grove 1925 - 1941

1 MVP, 1 top 5 MVP, 2 top 10 MVP, 5 more season w MVP votes (no Cy Young Awards were given during his career)

Bold: ERA 9, K 6, WHIP 5, IP 0, K/BB 8

300-141 W-L
2266/1187 K/BB
457/298 GS/CG
3940.2 IP

Cy Young 1890 - 1911

CY every day of his life (no accolades given during his career)

Bold: ERA 2, K 2, WHIP 7, IP 2, K/BB 11; All Time; Wins 511, GS 815, CG 749, IP 7356.0

511-315 W-L
2803/1217 K/BB
815/749 GS/CG
7356.0 IP

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Lefty, foxx and Pedro. All deserving to win here.

But my vote is lefty. 8 or 9(depending on the stat)times being the best pitcher in the league is just too impressive for me not to pick him. Most times being the best than any other pitcher of all time.

 

[calsnowskier]

Lefty was Pedro 70 years before Pedro was Pedro….

 

[calsnowskier]

Jimmie Foxx (1B) 1925 - 1942

3 MVP, 1 top 5 MVP, 3 top 10 MVP, 4 additional seasons with MVP votes, 9 ASG (ASG started in his age 25 season - he already had 4 MVP vote seasons at that time)

92.2, 58.1

Bold: R 1, HR 4, RBI 3, BB 2, OPS 5, TB 3

OPS+ buckets

200 - 2
180 - 4
160 - 2
140 - 4
120 - 2

Ken Griffey Jr (CF) 1989 - 2010

1 MVP, 4 top 5 MVP, 2 top 10 MVP, 3 additional seasons with MVP votes, 13 ASG, 10 GG, 7 SS

83.8, 54.0

Bold: RBI - 1, HR - 4, R - 1, TB - 2

OPS+ buckets

160 - 3
140 - 5
120 - 4

 

[calsnowskier]

Foxx had 8 seasons with an OPS+ of 160 or greater.


Griffey had 3.


Come on guys. Let’s be serious here.

 

[calsnowskier]

Any vote for Griffey really is a #votefortheworst vote and little more.

 

[calsnowskier]

I think I may have been convinced on Lefty > Pedro, but they are so freaking similar it is hard to get upset either way.

Lefty
Pedro
Foxx
Young
…
Griffey

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I think I may have been convinced on Lefty > Pedro, but they are so freaking similar it is hard to get upset either way.

Lefty
Pedro
Foxx
Young
…
Griffey

Yea. Those top 3 should be the next 3. No matter how they are ordered.

 

[Clayton]

Any vote for Griffey really is a #votefortheworst vote and little more.

I'd imagine the argument for Griffey is that era adjusted stats don't apply because he was clean and everyone else wasnt

 

[msgkings322]

I'd imagine the argument for Griffey is that era adjusted stats don't apply because he was clean and everyone else wasnt

Not everybody. Frank Thomas was clean for sure

 

[calsnowskier]

Bonds, Sheffield and Sosa were all clean as well. None of them broke a single drug rule in the game.

 

[calsnowskier]

Not everybody. Frank Thomas was clean for sure

And she was apparently very disappointed.

 

[msgkings322]

No matter how much the data 'proves' Griffey doesn't belong here, we have to accept that this list has other factors besides numbers. It's why Bonds isn't #2 and ARod isn't getting much traction, not to mention why Henderson and DiMaggio are higher than pure numbers would indicate. It's all a factor and that's part of the fun of this...Griffey just has some special extra that appeals to some voters.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

No matter how much the data 'proves' Griffey doesn't belong here, we have to accept that this list has other factors besides numbers. It's why Bonds isn't #2 and ARod isn't getting much traction, not to mention why Henderson and DiMaggio are higher than pure numbers would indicate. It's all a factor and that's part of the fun of this...Griffey just has some special extra that appeals to some voters.

Yes. He has the we grew up on 90s baseball and we all loved him. But that’s on fans. Not on player.

 

[msgkings322]

Yes. He has the we grew up on 90s baseball and we all loved him. But that’s on fans. Not on player.

This is a fans' list of course, which is my point. So Henderson gets more love than his pure numbers indicate, as does Griffey.

 

[Cedrique]

This is a fans' list of course, which is my point. So Henderson gets more love than his pure numbers indicate, as does Griffey.

interesting

25 Most Beloved Players in Baseball History

Last month, we looked at the most average—yet beloved player in each team's history. Outside of those markets, people would look at the names on that list and shrug their ...

bleacherreport.com

 

[LHG]

Foxx had 8 seasons with an OPS+ of 160 or greater.


Griffey had 3.


Come on guys. Let’s be serious here.

Foxx was obviously roided up. Otherwise, he wouldn't have been half as good as Griffey.

 

[calsnowskier]

Foxx was obviously roided up. Otherwise, he wouldn't have been half as good as Griffey.

He failed the same number of tests as other players who are “known” users…