The 3&1 NBA Decades Draft Play-In 5 : Milk vs Stoke

[Nosferatu]

WOW

 

[blstoker]

WOW

I take it you didn't read it

 

[Nosferatu]

I take it you didn't read it

I read every word

 

[blstoker]

I read every word

Sweet, I figured no one would read it because it was too long.

 

[blstoker]

Overall, I thought it was a fair assessment. Don't get me wrong - defense never wins these, so I really don't expect to win - but my team would be crazy good defensively.

 

[CitySushi]

Overall, I thought it was a fair assessment. Don't get me wrong - defense never wins these, so I really don't expect to win - but my team would be crazy good defensively.

I appreciate your breakdown but I don’t think it was a “fair assessment”. It got hard to take serious a lot of what you were saying after you said in the first quarter that playing Roy in the 1st quarter was a misplay because he was a 4th quarter player and that Van Horn could cause him defensive problems. There’s almost no chance of that happening. You watched Van Horn play before right?

Anyways you put a lot of thought into this which is awesome to me. Love discussing basketball. But sorry this was not a fair assessment.

 

[Nosferatu]

Overall, I thought it was a fair assessment. Don't get me wrong - defense never wins these, so I really don't expect to win - but my team would be crazy good defensively.

Defense Schmefense!

 

[Nosferatu]

I appreciate your breakdown but I don’t think it was a “fair assessment”. It got hard to take serious a lot of what you were saying after you said in the first quarter that playing Roy in the 1st quarter was a misplay because he was a 4th quarter player and that Van Horn could cause him defensive problems. There’s almost no chance of that happening. You watched Van Horn play before right?

Anyways you put a lot of thought into this which is awesome to me. Love discussing basketball. But sorry this was not a fair assessment.

Brandon Roy broke his foot while you were typing that!

 

[CitySushi]

Brandon Roy broke his foot while you were typing that!

Probably. He’s a total liability. At least Van Horn is healthy

 

[blstoker]

I appreciate your breakdown but I don’t think it was a “fair assessment”. It got hard to take serious a lot of what you were saying after you said in the first quarter that playing Roy in the 1st quarter was a misplay because he was a 4th quarter player and that Van Horn could cause him defensive problems. There’s almost no chance of that happening. You watched Van Horn play before right?

Anyways you put a lot of thought into this which is awesome to me. Love discussing basketball. But sorry this was not a fair assessment.

Actually, as a basketball fan, I really only followed one team - which happens to be the the Blazers. So, I watched Roy about 30-50 games a year while he played (I've since stopped watching all but a few games a year). Being that games outside Portland (Seattle before the Sonics moved) were scarce without cable/satellite (which I rarely had) I didn't see Van Horn play more than a handful of times - and I couldn't even tell you anything about those games. As such, and since I wasn't going to go into anything more in depth than a cursory glance at a few articles, stats and maybe even highlight videos about any one given player (none of which were wikipedia ) - which is probably more than most did before they decided their votes.

Now, if you're thinking that I was saying that Van Horn would cover Roy and that's how he would create issues for him defensively, then I stated it wrong, because that's not true (and probably is the more likely scenario upon re-reading). I meant, that Van Horn would provide issues for when Roy is playing defense - and not just because of his ability to put the ball in the hoop (because that wasn't the biggest factor in this comment). Actually playing a forward position, Van Horn not only collected offensive rebounds at a much closer rate to Roy's ability to get defensive rebounds (Roy's a guard after all), but at nearly the same rate as Milk's other two bigs in the same quarter (while my other two bigs were significantly better). This allows my team many more additional offensive possessions than Milk's, cause my bigs are also much better at defensive rebounding as well.

As for the flippant misplay quote - it isn't like I was asking him to move Jordan, he had Eddie Jones playing SG in the 4th. Plus, though Jones played a majority of SG, he did play SF, which despite being 6'6", Roy never did as Portland always had Outlaw, Webster, Batum or other SFs in that position when Roy was on the floor.

It's not like anything I said in the assessment was pointing to Van Horn actually winning the matchup, and it's pretty obvious that this is a mismatch. But, it's not like everything was stacked in Roy's favor.

 

[Mebert]

My favorite Brandon Roy moment was when the Timberwolves signed his broken ass so the Blazers cap would be shot to hell

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Overall, I thought it was a fair assessment. Don't get me wrong - defense never wins these, so I really don't expect to win - but my team would be crazy good defensively.

overall I thought it was fair... My biggest problem though was Q2 on your CLEAR hate on Iverson... Sure he is a ball hog... But that is kind of why he is in with my worst offensive players... He is there to be a a ball hog... it should work... And in no way is Van lier better than Iverson... No way in My limited Basketball knowledge...

 

[Nosferatu]

And in no way is Van lier better than Iverson

Yeah that was pretty much my only issue as well.

 

[Nosferatu]

We still wait for Ducey

 

[CitySushi]

Yeah that was pretty much my only issue as well.

I didn't have really any issue with his edge picks, save for the Iverson one, but it was more so the explanation and downplay of particular matchups. I'll go over it a bit later more when I have some time at work, but I read every word and there were certain things that just stuck out more with me than just the Iverson and Roy situations.

The "fair assessment" wasn't as an overall whole, it was the individual breakdowns.

 

[Nosferatu]

I did text him again

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I didn't have really any issue with his edge picks, save for the Iverson one, but it was more so the explanation and downplay of particular matchups. I'll go over it a bit later more when I have some time at work, but I read every word and there were certain things that just stuck out more with me than just the Iverson and Roy situations.

The "fair assessment" wasn't as an overall whole, it was the individual breakdowns.

well, I expect bias when you vote for yourself... so I give people leeway towards their biases... So I don't care about downplaying some matchups... Just don't be absurd... Like the Iverson vs Van lier...

 

[CitySushi]

well, I expect bias when you vote for yourself... so I give people leeway towards their biases... So I don't care about downplaying some matchups... Just don't be absurd... Like the Iverson vs Van lier...

One of the more egregious edges he had also was Iguodala over Ginobili, and I'm a huge Iguodala fan, seeing how important he is to the Warriors success. Ginobili is arguably a top 10 SG of all time, IMO.

His assessment matching up the two discounts how good Ginobili actually was on the court. He mentions that Iguodala's highest scoring out put is just over Ginobili's but didn't mention that Ginobili's came as a backup. In the 3 years he started more games than he came off the bench, two of them he made the All-star teams (2005 and 2011). That's 6 years in between all-star games. He didn't magically just get better in 2011, he was consistently the same player all those years in between. If he had been a starter he's easily a 7-8 time all-star over the course of his career.

Ginobili also made an All-NBA team as a BENCH PLAYER. Think about that. That's absurd. He also didn't even make the all-star team in that year either. Stoke used per 36 numbers in a lot of matchups, but didn't do so here. If you took both players per 36 numbers and match them up, Ginobili's is far and away better.

Ginobili is far and away the superior player to Iguodala.

 

[Nosferatu]

Ginobili is far and away the superior player to Iguodala

I just looked past this one figuring he really didn't see Manu play a lot. One of the greatest effort players I've ever seen.

 

[tducey]

My full apologies for my delay in voting. Busy couple days. Brandon Roy was here at my house and fell down in the kitchen so I had to tend to that. Vote coming within minutes.