Duckboy33
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Nice recruiting class you got. Keep it up.
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PAC 12 Thread v6.0
- Thread starter SUBuddha
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Nice recruiting class you got. Keep it up.
socaljim242
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And still gonna win the PAC next season. Congrats on your recruiting title.Are you have a trophy room made for it? lol
Duckboy33
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We won it this year so mine as well make it 2 years in a row
socaljim242
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You're not winning it next year. You're set for the years after though. Right now it's a clown show after this next years team at USC. I have friends who wont go to the Holiday bowl to protest Helton but I feel bad for the players. They do play hard for him. I'm going with a small group of friends.
Duckboy33
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So who is allowed to win in next year? There’s no clear favorite and Oregon will have as much talent as anyone
michaeljordan_fan
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Of course Oregon will win the conference next year.
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socaljim242
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The north maybe but not the PAC
Herbert won the pac once at Oregon. Next season you will step waaaay down at the most important position.
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Pac-12 recruiting recap: USC craters while Oregon, UW ascend
The first day of the third early-signing period was relatively drama free for the Pac-12.
Oregon grabbed coveted inside linebacker Justin Flowe, Arizona State flipped receiver Johnny Wilson, USC got left in the dust …
But generally, the day played out as expected for most programs and for the conference, which has just one class in the Rivals top-10 ranking (Oregon, 10th) and none in the 247sports composite top 10.
That’s hardly a stamp of doom for the conference. Conference championship and playoff rosters are built on several recruiting classes.
But the combined absence from the top of the playoff rankings and the top of the recruiting rankings certainly fuels the narrative that the Pac-12 is soft at the top.
Impressions from the day are below. But first, a trend that we’ve been tracking for several recruiting cycles and is worth mentioning prominently.
The big picture with regards to the big bodies — or lack thereof — is problematic.
Collectively, the Pac-12’s weakest position compared to the heavyweights in other conferences is the interior defensive line: The run-stuffing, pocket-collapsing tackles coveted on every level of football.
Washington has produced a handful of elite defensive tackles in recent years; Utah typically has a few; same with USC. But collectively, the conference is lacking.
And it’s lacking, in large part, because there simply aren’t many 290- or 300-pound defensive tackle prospects within the Pac-12 footprint on a yearly basis.
The talent pool is shallow.
We examined the number of four- and five-star defensive tackles per year nationally (per 247sports composite rankings) and matched that figure against the number produced within the Pac-12 footprint (including Nevada and Hawaii) and the number signed by Pac-12 programs:
2015
Total nationally: 21
Total within footprint: 5
Total signed: 3
2016
Total nationally: 37
Total within footprint: 2
Total signed: 2
2017
Total nationally: 21
Total within footprint: 4
Total signed: 4
2018
Total nationally: 26
Total within footprint: 2
Total signed: 3
2019
Total nationally: 26
Total within footprint: 5
Total signed: 5
2020
Total nationally: 35
Total within footprint: 1
Total signed: 1
In the six recruiting cycles (2015-20), there have been 166 defensive tackles nationally with four- or five-star ratings.
The Pac-12 has signed 18.
Clemson has signed nine.
(The 2020 tackle headed to the Pac-12, if you’re curious, is Omarr Norman-Lott, a four-star prospect signed by Arizona State.)
And there isn’t clear and immediate relief on the way …
2021
Total nationally (projected): 23
Total within footprint (projected): 3
Total signed: TBA
The star ratings system isn’t always accurate, but it provides a reasonable framework for projected and actual on-field success. (There is a statistical correlation.)
What’s more, the lack of high-level play on the interior defensive line doesn’t doom a team, or a conference, from the playoff chase.
But it helps … oh, does it help.
And good luck beating Clemson and Ohio State — and the SEC champion — without them.
Other impressions and noteworthy numbers from Day One:
* The Pac-12 signed three of the top-30 offensive tackles, according to the 247sports composite: No. 8 Myles Hinton (Stanford), No. 12 Roger Rosengarten (Washington) and No. 25 Connor McLaughlin (Stanford).
* And it signed two of the top-10 quarterbacks: No. 7 Jay Butterfield (Oregon) and No. 10 Ethan Garbers (Washington).
* Five-star prospects signed by the Pac-12, per Rivals: Oregon ILBs Noah Sewell and Justin Flowe and Stanford OT Myles Hinton.
* Four-star prospects signed, per Rivals:
9: Washington
8: Oregon
7: Stanford
6: Arizona State
3: Colorado and Cal
2: Utah and UCLA
1: USC, Oregon State and Washington State
0: Arizona
* Thanks, in part, to the allure of playing with quarterback Jayden Daniels, Arizona State is well-positioned with receivers:
The Sun Devils signed two four-star wideouts, Johnny Wilson and Chad Johnson Jr., and could snare two more this cycle.
* Washington has the top-rated class in the conference in the 247sports composite, thanks partly to Sav’ell Smalls, the No. 1 outside linebacker in the country.
The Huskies also signed three four-star offensive linemen, but their most intriguing prospect might be Rome Odunze, a 6-foot-3 receiver from Las Vegas.
* Oregon’s top-rated class (per Rivals) is anchored by the top-two inside linebackers in the country: Justin Flowe and Noah Sewell (brother of Penei) could form a devastating combination for several seasons to come.
Add Kayvon Thibodeaux, Mase Funa, Isaac Slade-Matautia, Jordon Scott and others, and Oregon has the foundation for a dominant front seven next season (although the Ducks will miss Troy Dye’s leadership and playmaking).
* USC’s situation has reached unimaginable depths.
A program that usually recruits as well as anyone isn’t recruiting as well as Toledo.
Or Western Michigan.
Or Troy.
The Trojans have the No. 78 class in the country, an epic fail that Clay Helton attributed to low numbers: The Trojans have just 11 players signed.
But that spin should be ignored, because the quality is lacking, as well: USC’s class has no five-star prospects and only one four-star player (guard Jonah Monheim).
The Trojans’ class rating likely will rise before the close of the cycle in February, but make no mistake:
Recruiting is in the gutter, which creates opportunities for others (inside and outside the conference).
(As we explored here, the Trojans haven’t come close to maximizing their talent on the field, as compared to Utah, for example.)
‘It was a good day for Oregon, ASU and Washington,” ESPN recruiting analyst Tom Luginbill told the Hotline.
“What’s happened at USC is concerning, obviously. The lack of long-term commitment and uncertainty around Clay Helton has killed the Trojans.
“They are a program that needs to seriously evaluate how their recruiting department is structured, and the administration needs to invest in staffing and resources for the program to compete on a national level against those they are compared against.”
Even Matt Leinart weighed in:
“Oregon is the new Usc in recruiting on the West Coast… back in my day no one dared to recruit So Cal. Now it’s open season and Oregon is hunting!”
And USC is the duck.
* Perhaps the most talented prospect to sign with the Pac-12 wasn’t a high school senior but a transfer:
Antonio Alfano, a former five-star defensive end — and Alabama enrollee — officially transferred to Colorado.
The Buffaloes have reason to be encouraged in their first full cycle under Mel Tucker, but they missed on the top-three in-state prospects.
* Pac-12 recruiting classes nationally, per 247sports composite
14. Washington
16. Oregon
22. Stanford
28. UCLA
33. Cal
34. Colorado
35. Arizona State
47. Oregon State
49. Utah
59. Washington State
69. Arizona
78. USC
* Pac-12 recruiting classes ranked on per-player basis (i.e., quantity excluded), per Rivals
1. Stanford: 3.5 stars (out of 5)
1. Oregon: 3.5
3. Arizona State: 3.4
4. Washington: 3.36
5. Utah: 3.13
6. UCLA: 3.05
7. Cal: 3.04
8. USC: 3.0
9. Colorado: 2.91
10. Oregon State: 2.9
11. Washington State: 2.85
12. Arizona: 2.73
* Finally, the top unsigned prospects within the footprint (with current leader per 247):
Five stars
CB Kelee Ringo (Scottsdale): Georgia
ATH Darnell Washington (Las Vegas): Georgia
Four stars
DE Jason Harris (Gilbert): Colorado
CB Clark Phillips III (La Habra): Ohio State
WR Gary Bryant Jr. (Corona): USC
AP Daniyel Ngata (Folsom): ASU
DE Xavier Carlton (Draper): Utah
RB Darvon Hubbard (Surprise): Utah
The first day of the third early-signing period was relatively drama free for the Pac-12.
Oregon grabbed coveted inside linebacker Justin Flowe, Arizona State flipped receiver Johnny Wilson, USC got left in the dust …
But generally, the day played out as expected for most programs and for the conference, which has just one class in the Rivals top-10 ranking (Oregon, 10th) and none in the 247sports composite top 10.
That’s hardly a stamp of doom for the conference. Conference championship and playoff rosters are built on several recruiting classes.
But the combined absence from the top of the playoff rankings and the top of the recruiting rankings certainly fuels the narrative that the Pac-12 is soft at the top.
Impressions from the day are below. But first, a trend that we’ve been tracking for several recruiting cycles and is worth mentioning prominently.
The big picture with regards to the big bodies — or lack thereof — is problematic.
Collectively, the Pac-12’s weakest position compared to the heavyweights in other conferences is the interior defensive line: The run-stuffing, pocket-collapsing tackles coveted on every level of football.
Washington has produced a handful of elite defensive tackles in recent years; Utah typically has a few; same with USC. But collectively, the conference is lacking.
And it’s lacking, in large part, because there simply aren’t many 290- or 300-pound defensive tackle prospects within the Pac-12 footprint on a yearly basis.
The talent pool is shallow.
We examined the number of four- and five-star defensive tackles per year nationally (per 247sports composite rankings) and matched that figure against the number produced within the Pac-12 footprint (including Nevada and Hawaii) and the number signed by Pac-12 programs:
2015
Total nationally: 21
Total within footprint: 5
Total signed: 3
2016
Total nationally: 37
Total within footprint: 2
Total signed: 2
2017
Total nationally: 21
Total within footprint: 4
Total signed: 4
2018
Total nationally: 26
Total within footprint: 2
Total signed: 3
2019
Total nationally: 26
Total within footprint: 5
Total signed: 5
2020
Total nationally: 35
Total within footprint: 1
Total signed: 1
In the six recruiting cycles (2015-20), there have been 166 defensive tackles nationally with four- or five-star ratings.
The Pac-12 has signed 18.
Clemson has signed nine.
(The 2020 tackle headed to the Pac-12, if you’re curious, is Omarr Norman-Lott, a four-star prospect signed by Arizona State.)
And there isn’t clear and immediate relief on the way …
2021
Total nationally (projected): 23
Total within footprint (projected): 3
Total signed: TBA
The star ratings system isn’t always accurate, but it provides a reasonable framework for projected and actual on-field success. (There is a statistical correlation.)
What’s more, the lack of high-level play on the interior defensive line doesn’t doom a team, or a conference, from the playoff chase.
But it helps … oh, does it help.
And good luck beating Clemson and Ohio State — and the SEC champion — without them.
Other impressions and noteworthy numbers from Day One:
* The Pac-12 signed three of the top-30 offensive tackles, according to the 247sports composite: No. 8 Myles Hinton (Stanford), No. 12 Roger Rosengarten (Washington) and No. 25 Connor McLaughlin (Stanford).
* And it signed two of the top-10 quarterbacks: No. 7 Jay Butterfield (Oregon) and No. 10 Ethan Garbers (Washington).
* Five-star prospects signed by the Pac-12, per Rivals: Oregon ILBs Noah Sewell and Justin Flowe and Stanford OT Myles Hinton.
* Four-star prospects signed, per Rivals:
9: Washington
8: Oregon
7: Stanford
6: Arizona State
3: Colorado and Cal
2: Utah and UCLA
1: USC, Oregon State and Washington State
0: Arizona
* Thanks, in part, to the allure of playing with quarterback Jayden Daniels, Arizona State is well-positioned with receivers:
The Sun Devils signed two four-star wideouts, Johnny Wilson and Chad Johnson Jr., and could snare two more this cycle.
* Washington has the top-rated class in the conference in the 247sports composite, thanks partly to Sav’ell Smalls, the No. 1 outside linebacker in the country.
The Huskies also signed three four-star offensive linemen, but their most intriguing prospect might be Rome Odunze, a 6-foot-3 receiver from Las Vegas.
* Oregon’s top-rated class (per Rivals) is anchored by the top-two inside linebackers in the country: Justin Flowe and Noah Sewell (brother of Penei) could form a devastating combination for several seasons to come.
Add Kayvon Thibodeaux, Mase Funa, Isaac Slade-Matautia, Jordon Scott and others, and Oregon has the foundation for a dominant front seven next season (although the Ducks will miss Troy Dye’s leadership and playmaking).
* USC’s situation has reached unimaginable depths.
A program that usually recruits as well as anyone isn’t recruiting as well as Toledo.
Or Western Michigan.
Or Troy.
The Trojans have the No. 78 class in the country, an epic fail that Clay Helton attributed to low numbers: The Trojans have just 11 players signed.
But that spin should be ignored, because the quality is lacking, as well: USC’s class has no five-star prospects and only one four-star player (guard Jonah Monheim).
The Trojans’ class rating likely will rise before the close of the cycle in February, but make no mistake:
Recruiting is in the gutter, which creates opportunities for others (inside and outside the conference).
(As we explored here, the Trojans haven’t come close to maximizing their talent on the field, as compared to Utah, for example.)
‘It was a good day for Oregon, ASU and Washington,” ESPN recruiting analyst Tom Luginbill told the Hotline.
“What’s happened at USC is concerning, obviously. The lack of long-term commitment and uncertainty around Clay Helton has killed the Trojans.
“They are a program that needs to seriously evaluate how their recruiting department is structured, and the administration needs to invest in staffing and resources for the program to compete on a national level against those they are compared against.”
Even Matt Leinart weighed in:
“Oregon is the new Usc in recruiting on the West Coast… back in my day no one dared to recruit So Cal. Now it’s open season and Oregon is hunting!”
And USC is the duck.
* Perhaps the most talented prospect to sign with the Pac-12 wasn’t a high school senior but a transfer:
Antonio Alfano, a former five-star defensive end — and Alabama enrollee — officially transferred to Colorado.
The Buffaloes have reason to be encouraged in their first full cycle under Mel Tucker, but they missed on the top-three in-state prospects.
* Pac-12 recruiting classes nationally, per 247sports composite
14. Washington
16. Oregon
22. Stanford
28. UCLA
33. Cal
34. Colorado
35. Arizona State
47. Oregon State
49. Utah
59. Washington State
69. Arizona
78. USC
* Pac-12 recruiting classes ranked on per-player basis (i.e., quantity excluded), per Rivals
1. Stanford: 3.5 stars (out of 5)
1. Oregon: 3.5
3. Arizona State: 3.4
4. Washington: 3.36
5. Utah: 3.13
6. UCLA: 3.05
7. Cal: 3.04
8. USC: 3.0
9. Colorado: 2.91
10. Oregon State: 2.9
11. Washington State: 2.85
12. Arizona: 2.73
* Finally, the top unsigned prospects within the footprint (with current leader per 247):
Five stars
CB Kelee Ringo (Scottsdale): Georgia
ATH Darnell Washington (Las Vegas): Georgia
Four stars
DE Jason Harris (Gilbert): Colorado
CB Clark Phillips III (La Habra): Ohio State
WR Gary Bryant Jr. (Corona): USC
AP Daniyel Ngata (Folsom): ASU
DE Xavier Carlton (Draper): Utah
RB Darvon Hubbard (Surprise): Utah
AlaskaGuy
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michaeljordan_fan
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You have a much higher view of Herbert than most Oregon fans.
socaljim242
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He's better and more experienced than anything you're going to have at QB next season. Two seasons ago you guys were raving about him.
michaeljordan_fan
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More experienced. It remains to be seen if he's better.
AlaskaGuy
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socaljim242
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Yeah, I'm going to go with the obvious. Way more inexperienced and could be good in a year or two . But next season having a QB with no experience is going to lose you a few games easily. You guys don't even know for sure if the kid you have now will be the starter.
michaeljordan_fan
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Fortunately, the PAC is pretty soft and Oregon has the edge on talent elsewhere. Oregon will be running down the throat of most teams they play anyway, so they won't be asked to do too much. Couple that with a defense holding PAC opponents under 25 and things will be just fine.
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