OT: Sam Bradford re-vistited

[imac_21]

Threes, that's Mac for you. It's like playing a game of chess with a pigeon.

Bingo, I'm not sure you know what that means. Too often on this board you completely misuse three syllable words.

But could it seriously not be chicken/egg? Is it completely impossible that the WRs aren't producing because of the QB? Or is it always the QB that struggles because of his WRs?

Or is that too hard to comprehend?

 

[imac_21]

Mac, he actually spread the ball around quite nicely this season. He had 3 recievers close to 700 yards recieving and one over 500 yards. He also has 4 receviers with over 40 catches and one with 38. He just doesn't have a complete receiver to make anyone worry, he uses Pettis as a red zone threat but Pettis has yet to show he can be a consistent threat. Give this guy a Dwayne Bowe and see what happens.

Or maybe, he's not a complete QB to make people worry? He was 26th in ypa this year.

Sure he threw for 3700 yards (15th in the league), but it took 550 passes (11th) to do it. Of course, completing less than 60% of his passes (20th) would impact that.

Where else did he rank? 20th in TDs, 15th in interceptions, 18th in passer rating.

But you're right. He's a star being held down by those around him. Just like Alex Smith.

 

[imac_21]

Can you do Vernon Davis this year too? Thx

Yep.

In 9 games with Smith
25/374/4 projects to
44/665/7

In 6 games with CK7
12/144/1 projects to
32/384/3


Walker with Smith
7/89/1 =
12/158/2

with CK7
14/255/2 =
37/680/5

TEs combined
with Smith
32/465/5 =
57/827/9

with CK7
26/399/3 =
69/1064/8

So Davis was considerably more productive with Smith, Walker with Kaepernick, and the TE position in general Kapernick gets the edge. I don't think this should come as a surprise to anyone as the offense became more explosive with Kaepernick than it was with Smith.

**I ignored Celek. With Smith he had 2/10/0, with CK7 he had 2/41/0.

 

[EaseUrStorm]

We'll see how this evens out next year. A few big downfield misses to Davis impacted those numbers in the short term a lot. Crabtree's definitely the key benefactor with Kaep though... he's not afraid to get him the ball.

I anticipate the Crabtree/Davis yardage will be much more evenly distributed over the course of a season once Kaep and Davis get going. The opportunity cost of all those yards to Crabtree is less Davis along with everyone else. I am hoping Crabtree draws double teams through these playoffs and everyone else can take advantage.

 

[Dodub]

Or maybe, he's not a complete QB to make people worry? He was 26th in ypa this year.

Sure he threw for 3700 yards (15th in the league), but it took 550 passes (11th) to do it. Of course, completing less than 60% of his passes (20th) would impact that.

Where else did he rank? 20th in TDs, 15th in interceptions, 18th in passer rating.

But you're right. He's a star being held down by those around him. Just like Alex Smith.

Lol I know the stats you don't have to post them.

My question to you is this, who of his recievers his year would you take in the 1st round or 2nd round? I feel like you are trying to convince me that they actually have talent at WR yet in my opinion they don't have any 1st or 2nd round talent at the position. So theres my question to you, who is that caliber or player and why?

 

[clyde_carbon]

Sounds a lot like excuses to me.

 

[Jikkle]

Sounds a lot like excuses to me.

Would they be called Samxuses or Bradxuses?

 

[imac_21]

Lol I know the stats you don't have to post them.

My question to you is this, who of his recievers his year would you take in the 1st round or 2nd round? I feel like you are trying to convince me that they actually have talent at WR yet in my opinion they don't have any 1st or 2nd round talent at the position. So theres my question to you, who is that caliber or player and why?

My question, that no one who is here defending Bradford will answer, is why are you assuming the QB's stats are below average because of the WRs? Why can't it be the other way around?

He's played with Brandon Lloyd. He played with Danario Alexander. Both performed better immediately after leaving Bradford. Lloyd was miles better immediately before joining Bradford.

Also, Bradford was drafted 1st overall. Isn't it more on him to improve the play of his WRs, than of his WRs to improve the play of the QB taken first overall?

Sam Bradford is Alex Smith.

 

[NinerSickness]

Sam Bradford is the worst type of QB to have. Not quite terrible where a team is eeking to get rid of him, and not quite good enough for his team to take the next step. When he came out I compared him to Alex Smith and he's become just that, IMO.

Couldn't have said it better.

 

[Dodub]

My question, that no one who is here defending Bradford will answer, is why are you assuming the QB's stats are below average because of the WRs? Why can't it be the other way around?

He's played with Brandon Lloyd. He played with Danario Alexander. Both performed better immediately after leaving Bradford. Lloyd was miles better immediately before joining Bradford.

Also, Bradford was drafted 1st overall. Isn't it more on him to improve the play of his WRs, than of his WRs to improve the play of the QB taken first overall?

Sam Bradford is Alex Smith.

Well we're trying to explore that questions right now by taking a look at the WR's and seeing if any of them are guys that you would take in the 1st or 2nd round, meaning they are talented guys that you want starting on your own team. Who are these guys?

 

[BINGO]

Lol. He used Alexander and Lloyd as proof that Bradford has had talent at the WR position. Lmfao. I just pissed on myself dying with laughter. The great Brandon Lloyd who tore sh8 up this year in NE playing alongside FHOF Tom Brady; when he immediately had left St Louis.

 

[imac_21]

Well we're trying to explore that questions right now by taking a look at the WR's and seeing if any of them are guys that you would take in the 1st or 2nd round, meaning they are talented guys that you want starting on your own team. Who are these guys?

Did you not read the whole reply? Brandon Lloyd was a 1400 yard WR the year before he played with Bradford. In the five games he played with Bradford his numbers went down across the board. That's compared to playing with Kyle Orton and Tim Tebow.

How about Danario Alexander? He was a big time prospect if not for his surgery.

How did he do with Bradford compared to with Rivers?

Oh yeah, he was head and shoulders better with Rivers.

 

[imac_21]

Lol. He used Alexander and Lloyd as proof that Bradford has had talent at the WR position. Lmfao. I just pissed on myself dying with laughter. The great Brandon Lloyd who tore sh8 up this year in NE playing alongside FHOF Tom Brady; when he immediately had left St Louis.

Good counter. Lloyd was a 74 catch/930 yard/4 TD player in New England. As the 3rd option at best (behind Welker and whichever TE was healthy).

He was better with Tebow than he was with Bradford. But that can't be a reflection of Bradford. It's because Lloyd's bad.

But it's okay Bingo, I know you like to ignore stats when they don't agree with your pre-conceptions of a player. Don't let the evidence influence your opinion.

Can someone (Dub, birds, or even Bingo) provide some sort of evidence that Sam Bradford was worth the first overall pick in that draft?

Player. Not QB. Player.

 

[Dodub]

Did you not read the whole reply? Brandon Lloyd was a 1400 yard WR the year before he played with Bradford. In the five games he played with Bradford his numbers went down across the board. That's compared to playing with Kyle Orton and Tim Tebow.

How about Danario Alexander? He was a big time prospect if not for his surgery.

How did he do with Bradford compared to with Rivers?

Oh yeah, he was head and shoulders better with Rivers.

So they had 5 games together and they were supposed to have great chemistry together, add in the fact that Bradford was often injury last year and you have a no chemistry situation in the making. You're acting as if Lloyd tore it up this year, the guy underperformed in the Patriots pass happy offense. Lloyd isn't as good as he was, thats just all there is to it. Unless Tom Brady somehow made him worse than he was two years ago with Kyle Orton.......

Last year with all the QB's that he worked with (Orton, Tebow, Bradford, etc.) he had more yards and touchdowns than he did this season with Brady. Must have been Brady's fault though.....

 

[Dodub]

Can we stop being silly now and talk about the receivers that are currently on the team? Of course not, that would be too easy.

 

[imac_21]

So they had 5 games together and they were supposed to have great chemistry together, add in the fact that Bradford was often injury last year and you have a no chemistry situation in the making. You're acting as if Lloyd tore it up this year, the guy underperformed in the Patriots pass happy offense. Lloyd isn't as good as he was, thats just all there is to it. Unless Tom Brady somehow made him worse than he was two years ago with Kyle Orton.......

Last year with all the QB's that he worked with (Orton, Tebow, Bradford, etc.) he had more yards and touchdowns than he did this season with Brady. Must have been Brady's fault though.....

That was a significant issue for Crabtree and Kaepernick too wasn't it? Having no chemistry and only getting to play 6 games together.

 

[imac_21]

Can we stop being silly now and talk about the receivers that are currently on the team? Of course not, that would be too easy.

Let's. Tell me how they look with an above average QB.

 

[NinerSickness]

This debate about Bradford sounds almost identical to the debate about Alex Smith that lasted like 8 years.

 

[I_am_1z]

Sickness how's DHB doing in Oakland? Do you still have him as better than Crabtree?

 

[NinerSickness]

Sickness how's DHB doing in Oakland? Do you still have him as better than Crabtree?

No, Crabby looks to have surpassed him. However, I'd love to bring DHB into SF. The Raiders are a dumpster fire.