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Series Thread: NLCS - Phillies vs Diamondbacks

Cedrique

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That’s my generation’s ‘64 Phillies collapse. My dad still talks about it. Google it. This has to be up there with one of the biggest Philly sports collapses in my lifetime. The sad part is that I need to let it sit for me to really place it on the pain level. The worst part is that I have like 18-20 legitimate candidates for the top 10 list.

This one starts in Game 4 for me when Topper goes to Sanchez with one out and runner on 2nd in the 3rd down 1-0. He projects panic when it didn’t need to be. All year they can hit with so many outs left to play. He put that shit out into the world haha.

When he creates a bull pen game he guarantees that you’re going to have to use Kimbrel the day after he got beat up. He was leaking oil since the All Star break. His pen wasn’t as deep as he thought it was.

But the Phillies are built to hit. They’ve been a streaky team with lengthy slides and lengthy moments of being hot. I’ve said too much without giving credit to the Diamondbacks. They were great. They used the over aggression of Phillies big hitters against them. They changed their whole approach to the lineup in Game 3. Tip of the cap to them. They have bullpen and timely hitting. Their starters can be nasty as well though the Phillies went 3-1 vs their top guys. I’m back. The Phils lost this series while going 3-1 in Gallen/Kelly starts. Everybody deals with their team’s falling short. How often do you have to swallow something like that. They have no starters depth and they win all 3 of those games!!!

@DJ hope you know I was just messing with ya today. This is on the guys who are paid millions puckering in a big spot. I’m in the moment but this is baseball where you fail 7 of 10 times they remember you forever. This team has come through a ton of the last two seasons and this time they didn’t. They got a little complacent and like a Greek tragedy the hubris had to cut a bitch.
No need to dig into too much detail on this. Any of the teams in the postseason was good enough to win. But the Phillies not winning was obviously a thinly veiled attempt by the liberal media to distract us from the recent Bigfoot/Alien sightings that everyone seems to be ignoring.
 

boltfan72

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Loving the new playoff format. Winning 100 games isn't near as meaningful as it used to be.

Interesting stat I heard this morning: this is the first World Series where both teams had an 8-game or longer losing streak during the season.

Gotta get hot at the right time.
 

fightinfunbags

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I’m in the corner, in a fetal position still trying to figure out how the Phil’s lost this series after going 3-1 in the Gallen/Kelly starts. I’m not ok.
 

Hunter Montana

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Loving the new playoff format. Winning 100 games isn't near as meaningful as it used to be.

Interesting stat I heard this morning: this is the first World Series where both teams had an 8-game or longer losing streak during the season.

Gotta get hot at the right time.

I have mixed feelings about the new playoff format. On the positive side, it gives smaller market teams a better chance at the postseason and a championship. On the negative side, I feel it somewhat cheapens the playoffs and a World Series title if getting hot at the right time takes too much significance (when many teams make the playoffs). I suspect that stat you cited about the losing streaks will become more common. For as well as the Braves did during the regular season, they lost two out of three in Oakland. Every team goes through ups and downs. If MLB is headed in a direction similar to NHL and NBA where half the league is invited, MLB might as well just also have around an 80 game schedule. Because what would be the point of playing those extra 80 games? Aside from my feelings about the new playoff format, Manfred is still a douche. Lord help us if he ever brings that stupid ghost runner rule to the playoffs.
 

msgkings322

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I’m in the corner, in a fetal position still trying to figure out how the Phil’s lost this series after going 3-1 in the Gallen/Kelly starts. I’m not ok.
The other team scored more in 4 games.


But really...the literal randomness of the sport in short samples. Any outcome could have happened, you got this one.
 

Cedrique

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The other team scored more in 4 games.


But really...the literal randomness of the sport in short samples. Any outcome could have happened, you got this one.
Truer words never typed. The Phillies played more games than all but 2 teams. It doesn't make sense to base any analysis of their season on the 3-4 performance against the Diamondbacks. The same is true with all the teams that made the playoffs and didn't make the WS. It's especially annoying when someone that didn't even follow a team all season starts making recommendations on all the moves a team should make in the offseason based on what they saw in the postseason. But I guess it's good for getting clicks.
 

Cedrique

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I’m in the corner, in a fetal position still trying to figure out how the Phil’s lost this series after going 3-1 in the Gallen/Kelly starts. I’m not ok.
Oh shit, I get it now. I was fine the last couple days when there was no baseball. But now that the series is about to start and the Phils aren't in it I might need to be talked off that ledge.
 

fightinfunbags

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Oh shit, I get it now. I was fine the last couple days when there was no baseball. But now that the series is about to start and the Phils aren't in it I might need to be talked off that ledge.
All the D’Backs had to do was go in with a plan to not throw strikes. It’s a desperate attempt for a team down 2-0 and fuck if it didn’t work. They had guys swinging through balls off the plate the rest of the series. I read in Games 6 and 7 Trea Turner saw 22 pitches and he swung at 19 of them. I can’t believe that the Phillies didn’t adjust when it was apparent to nearly everybody that they weren’t throwing strikes. Lots of blame to go around but one guy who has skirted blame is Kevin Long. He’s given wide latitude all season in developing an approach at the plate. Our hitters went up there without a plan. If it was one or two guys that would be on them but it was the whole freaking lineup.
 

Cedrique

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All the D’Backs had to do was go in with a plan to not throw strikes. It’s a desperate attempt for a team down 2-0 and fuck if it didn’t work. They had guys swinging through balls off the plate the rest of the series. I read in Games 6 and 7 Trea Turner saw 22 pitches and he swung at 19 of them. I can’t believe that the Phillies didn’t adjust when it was apparent to nearly everybody that they weren’t throwing strikes. Lots of blame to go around but one guy who has skirted blame is Kevin Long. He’s given wide latitude all season in developing an approach at the plate. Our hitters went up there without a plan. If it was one or two guys that would be on them but it was the whole freaking lineup.
oops, sorry to open up this again. Dude, stop trying to make sense of it. It's baseball variance. I really don't think a lot of planning goes into it. Trea Turner is a hacker and always will be. Sometimes it will work out, sometimes it won't. The truth is plate discipline is something that rarely changes over the course of a players' career. Hits depend a lot on luck but plate discipline is consistent. For example, I'd bet you any amount of money that barring injuries Bryce Harper and Kyle Schwarber will always have at least twice as many walks as Castellanos and Turner. Every time, Every year no matter what any of their batting averages is or what kind of planning or programs their hitting coaches worked on with them.
 

fightinfunbags

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oops, sorry to open up this again. Dude, stop trying to make sense of it. It's baseball variance. I really don't think a lot of planning goes into it. Trea Turner is a hacker and always will be. Sometimes it will work out, sometimes it won't. The truth is plate discipline is something that rarely changes over the course of a players' career. Hits depend a lot on luck but plate discipline is consistent. For example, I'd bet you any amount of money that barring injuries Bryce Harper and Kyle Schwarber will always have at least twice as many walks as Castellanos and Turner. Every time, Every year no matter what any of their batting averages is or what kind of planning or programs their hitting coaches worked on with them.
I agree with a lot of this. At the same time, when you get into playoff competition in every sport teams make you beat them left handed. There are things that can be done and said to change an approach at the plate. We’ve seen it with both of the players you named. There have been times this season where both players made the adjustment and changed approach. I am a believer that winning baseball is making adjustments and then making adjustments to the opponents adjustments. I’m on board with what you’re saying if we are talking about 162 games. But in October you have to be able to adjust. Fuck! Trea Turner is fucking trying to bunt for a hit he was so frustrated. If you’re frustrated then changing it up should be taking pitches. Not necessarily to pass the bat, but to get a mistake. When you don’t have to make shit even look like a strike to get a swing you’re not getting that mistake. The mistake paints the black haha.
 

Cedrique

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I agree with a lot of this. At the same time, when you get into playoff competition in every sport teams make you beat them left handed. There are things that can be done and said to change an approach at the plate. We’ve seen it with both of the players you named. There have been times this season where both players made the adjustment and changed approach. I am a believer that winning baseball is making adjustments and then making adjustments to the opponents adjustments. I’m on board with what you’re saying if we are talking about 162 games. But in October you have to be able to adjust. Fuck! Trea Turner is fucking trying to bunt for a hit he was so frustrated. If you’re frustrated then changing it up should be taking pitches. Not necessarily to pass the bat, but to get a mistake. When you don’t have to make shit even look like a strike to get a swing you’re not getting that mistake. The mistake paints the black haha.
I agree there are adjustments made back and forth by pitchers and hitters. But my main point was trying to dive into the minutia that of what a hitting coach is supposed to do and what adjustments a batter makes seems like a futile effort that will only frustrate us as fans.

But also, I really don't remember any time this season where Castellanos and Turner decided to take more pitches. I'd need data to back that up.
 
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