NFL thinking of moving PAT to 25 yrd line

[anotheridiot]

I would definitely rather see a farther extra point than the talk about eliminating it. Hell, they gotta stop play to verify the score anyway, what are you gonna wait, then have the referee confirm and then go to commercial?

2 yard line 1 point
25 yard line 2 extra points
50 yard line 3 extra points.

 

[MHSL82]

Graziano: More rule changes the NFL should adopt - ESPN

 

[MHSL82]

I would definitely rather see a farther extra point than the talk about eliminating it. Hell, they gotta stop play to verify the score anyway, what are you gonna wait, then have the referee confirm and then go to commercial?

2 yard line 1 point
25 yard line 2 extra points
50 yard line 3 extra points.

This is what you do if you want something more supported but have the power to change to whatever you want - suggest an extreme like elimination, wait awhile, and then suggest what you wanted all along, and implement it. (It's an application of a false dichotomy as a strategy, as opposed to just a theoretical argument tool.) The only way to fight it (support, not implementation) is to oppose all changes because what is there is good enough.

 

[MHSL82]

Adam Vinatieri, Jay Feely, Justin Tucker hope longer PAT proposal gets boot - ESPN

Enough complaining and they'll just do away with the PATs altogether. I think it's inevitable that the rule will change, whether that be moving it back or eliminating it.

I don't get how these kickers feel that moving the kick back trivializes kickers. In fact, it's the opposite. It makes their execution more important. I realize that pushing it back makes it look like it was easy the last decades of kicking, but it makes it more important in the future. In fact, if they move it back to the 25 and someone goes 37/37 and others go 33/37, you just upped your salary. Go tell someone you are better than 33/37 on 2 yard PATs and they'll say, "ok... and?"

 

[h0ckeysk83r]

I'm just not a big fan of if. This would completely change games IMO.

 

[ckhokie]

If that is the case then there would be no fakes. Who would go for a fake at the 25 yard line.

How many fake xp have you been seeing recently?

 

[NinerSickness]

If the extra point is a 40-yard FG, then teams would probably just go for 2 every time. Statistically they'd speaking they'd probably score more points.

 

[tallglassofwater007]

Yep. And from the 25 that might happen even more often. Think of that excitement happening more than 0.3% of the time.

The fact that you had to go back to the Carney one, from 2003, speaks to how automatic the PAT is. The excitement that comes with the incredibly rare miss (and that excitement is pretty rare even on missed PATs) is why the NFL is exploring ways of keeping the kick in the game but making it more challenging rather than just awarding 7 points for the TD.

I only used that Carney one because it was sooooo brutal. Poor Saints make maybe arguably the greatest play in NFL history only to lose that way. If I am not mistaken I think that either kept them out of the playoffs that year, or let the Jag in. I could be wrong though.

I am not apposed to them moving the kick back, because it would add some drama, but I just want them to stop changing everything. In 10 years the game will not be recognizable anymore.

 

[tomikcon1971]

If the extra point is a 40-yard FG, then teams would probably just go for 2 every time. Statistically they'd speaking they'd probably score more points.

What's the two point conversion rate? I'm guessing 35-45 percent. 40 yard FGs are around 80-85%.

 

[NinerSickness]

What's the two point conversion rate? I'm guessing 35-45 percent. 40 yard FGs are around 80-85%.

Last year the 2-point conversion rate was in the 60's. I'm sure that would go down if they went for it every time...

But if a 40-yard FG rate is 80% (don't know what it really is), all a team would have to do is make more than 40% of their 2-point tries to make it statistically feasible.

 

[tomikcon1971]

Last year the 2-point conversion rate was in the 60's. I'm sure that would go down if they went for it every time...

But if a 40-yard FG rate is 80% (don't know what it really is), all a team would have to do is make more than 40% of their 2-point tries to make it statistically feasible.

FGs are hard to tell. They lump 40-49 yards together. That range was 83%.

 

[tomikcon1971]

For whatever it's worth......

New NFL Extra Point Rule Would Bump 2-Point Conversions - Business Insider

 

[NinerSickness]

I found an article saying teams have historically made 47.9% of their attempts. That's easily more points per try than extra points at 40 yards away.

Only scenario I could see 'em trying for an extra point is if they absolutely only needed one point towards the end of the game.

 

[MHSL82]

Last year the 2-point conversion rate was in the 60's. I'm sure that would go down if they went for it every time...

But if a 40-yard FG rate is 80% (don't know what it really is), all a team would have to do is make more than 40% of their 2-point tries to make it statistically feasible.

This mirrors the argument of shooting a three-pointer every time in the NBA. You just have to shoot 33.4% to make more than 50% two point shots. Of course, this ignores the chances of getting fouled for free throws and the fact that teams would defend you differently if you only shot threes, like you said about the two-point conversion thing defended better if it wasn't done every time.

 

[NinerSickness]

This mirrors the argument of shooting a three-pointer every time in the NBA. You just have to shoot 33.4% to make more than 50% two point shots. Of course, this ignores the chances of getting fouled for free throws and the fact that teams would defend you differently if you only shot threes, like you said about the two-point conversion thing defended better if it wasn't done every time.

That isn't true. Teams wouldn't defend 2-point conversions better if they were tried every time. Basketball is a lot more complex; there's only 1 variable in football. Is it a fake or do they know you're going for the 2-point conversion? That's it. The vast majority of the time (like 99%) they know the 2-point try is coming.

 

[clyde_carbon]

Jesus...talk about nothing-to-do execs trying to justify their salaries Quit fucking with shit, and go golfing or on vacation er' some shit??

So much this.

Bunch of lazy, idiotic rich guys trying to do something to make it look like they're doing something. I could just imagine the stupidity and shear amusements between them having an actual discussion (and probably for months) about this.

 

[MHSL82]

That isn't true. Teams wouldn't defend 2-point conversions better if they were tried every time. Basketball is a lot more complex; there's only 1 variable in football. Is it a fake or do they know you're going for the 2-point conversion? That's it. The vast majority of the time (like 99%) they know the 2-point try is coming.

That's what I thought you meant by: "Last year the 2-point conversion rate was in the 60's. I'm sure that would go down if they went for it every time..."

 

[NinerSickness]

That's what I thought you meant by: "Last year the 2-point conversion rate was in the 60's. I'm sure that would go down if they went for it every time..."

I wasn't clear. I said that because 60+ % is a statistical anomaly. I was referring to the rule of averages not the "every time" part. The "every time" part just means there would be more attempts, and so more attempts = closer to the actual, predictable rate.

The rules keep making it easier for offense, so the actual, predictable rate might be higher than 47.9% now; but it's probably close to that. You could flip a coin & get heads 4 times in a row, but if you flip it 10,000 times you'll get heads right around 50% of the time.

 

[imac_21]

Like I said if they do move it maybe move it to like the 10 or 12 yard line. It still makes it a 27-30 yard try and teams can still go for 2 from that distance. Takes away the running option on the play but they can still getting by passing.

Overall just keep it where it is.

The kick from the 2 is pointless. I haven't seen anything that suggests going for 2 would have to be at the 25. If a team wanted to go for 2, my understanding is it would still come from the 2 yard line. Only the kick would be moved back to the 25.

 

[#1BostonFan]

Moving it back some makes some sense, but the 25 is too far.